you remind me of someone else who was posting here...

 

It is not the first time.

https://www.camaroz28.com/forums/sho...22#post5622322

Hey, JohnnyTuinals/gangwar/nickylip...give the multiple accounts, trolling, thread crapping, sky is falling posts, etc. a rest.

 

Yes please put a stop to this moron.

 

I'm baffled as to why you are always trying to make Ford out to be stronger than it really is. They had only $18.9 billion on hand at the end of Q3, after burning through $7.7 billion in the third quarter (compared to GM burning through $6.9b and ending with $16.2b). So Ford's burn rate is even higher than GM's right now.

 

I don't think Ford is stronger at all... because it still makes products that Americans don't care about. It's basic problem is its cars.

However, Ford is smaller and has probably always been more dynamic than GM. It still has Volvo and Mazda to sell off, in case it needs the extra cash.

But Ford still relies on the same suppliers as GM and if GM goes... doom 'n' gloom.

 

IMO their problem is not cars, it's marketing and reputation. Ford is smaller than Chevy and people think of them as the "Pickup and Explorer" company and don't shop them for cars. At least, cars like the Fusion and Taurus are better than the sales figures suggest.

 

"The Dearborn automaker didn't lose as much as General Motors Corp. in the third quarter, and it may have enough cash to keep bankruptcy speculation at bay for now...

Even more telling was Ford's cash-burn rate, which increased to $7.7 billion in the third quarter,.....significantly more money than the much larger GM burned through during the same three-month period....

Ford ended the quarter with available credit lines totaling $10.7 billion and overall liquidity totals of $29.6 billion. It called that sum sufficient, even without help from Washington.... "
http://www.detnews.com/apps/pbcs.dll...811080377/1148


Amount of cash @ Ford > Amount of cash @ GM
Number of factories to run @ Ford < number of factories to run @ GM
Divisions to fund @ Ford < the number of divisions to run at GM
Amount of money dedicated to suppliers at Ford < that dedicated to suppliers for GM.

Ford's higher burn rate is due to the temporary suspension of F150 production this quarter to get inventories under control according to Alan Mually on CNBC interview yesterday.


Ford IS morgaged up to their eyeballs, but they are in far better shape to weather these rough economic times than GM.

Therefore, Ford is stronger than GM right now.

No one is questioning if Ford will be around past next summer.

No one is questioning Chrysler's immediate survival either, now that the exaggeration-to-get-federal-money-for-a-buyout act is over.

 

Hmmm . . . still no mention about the burden of the UAW I see. I'm pretty sure I saw a story only a few days ago about the health care costs that GM has to pay out to former employees and how they were asking around to get money for it or something along those lines.

 

This mentions it and points out how the UAW held a monopoly by striking whenever domestics wanted to talk about wages.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/27609471

 

Two important factors.

1. UAW cost is still a bit higher than transplant cost, after the retiree health care transfer is funded (until then, it's much higher). That means that if everything else is equal, the Detroit manufacturers will lose money where the transplants break even. So either Detroit has to be smarter, or the UAW has to be more productive.

2. GM still owes money to the retiree health care fund.

Historically, the domestics concentrated on vehicles that they could make better than everyone else (trucks and SUVs). All the people who suggest they should have been going straight up against the Japanese and Koreans earlier when the cost difference was huge don't know what they're talking about.

GM, Ford, and Chrysler tried to make it work by cutting costs and getting their costs down to the transplant costs. The results were unappealing cars that needed huge rebates. Now they're trying to put the quality back in. Unfortunately, that will mean higher costs.

It's a difficult line to walk trying to compete in small and midsize cars where the Japanese and Koreans are strongest and have lower labor costs. The domestics will have to work smarter. It's hard to do that forever.

Note that there are two ways to equalize costs. One is to lower the domestics' costs. Another is to raise the transplants' costs. Why does a Kentucky Toyota worker accept meager 401K matches where the Detroit worker gets a nice pension? Maybe instead of lowering the UAW's wages or benefits, the transplants should increase wages or benefits.

One way or another, things will eventually level out. Hopefully with GM, Ford, and Chrysler still in existence.