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At what CFM does a stock MAF "peg"

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Old Dec 24, 2004 | 12:21 AM
  #16  
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Re: At what CFM does a stock MAF "peg"

Originally Posted by FASTFATBOY
If you want to know the combo I will post it, this is probably the most radical 23* headed 383 normally aspirated LT1 on pump gas that has been built on this board. My Dad and I are shooting for mid to high 10's all motor on a drag radial with a fully optioned Z28 that will weigh in the neighborhood of 3650 lbs with me in it. Tall order I know....we will see.

David
IF you're really gunning that hard I'd think you could go faster than mid-high 10s all motor. Although on a drag radial it might be hard. Best I've seen out of a 23 degree LT4 headed LT1 motor was 640hp on pump gas. It's AFR LT4 heads flowed a touch over 330cfm on the intake side.
Old Dec 24, 2004 | 07:45 AM
  #17  
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Re: At what CFM does a stock MAF "peg"

Originally Posted by 5.0THIS
IF you're really gunning that hard I'd think you could go faster than mid-high 10s all motor. Although on a drag radial it might be hard. Best I've seen out of a 23 degree LT4 headed LT1 motor was 640hp on pump gas. It's AFR LT4 heads flowed a touch over 330cfm on the intake side.

We are shooting for 700 HP on pump gas(dont mean we'll make it but you gotta have a goal right), as far as the drag radial goes, no problems there....guys here run low 1.30's 60 fts on a 325/50, tear off rear bumpers etc. I dont see any traction problems. Our heads flow 330 cfm on West Coast Cylinder heads bench, which I was told was "conservative"(the bench). Our intake is a one off. Fairly radical cam, custom 1 7/8 headers, 3.5 inch Y pipe, 4 inch Mufflex, Combination Motorsports level 3 4L60E, 9 inch 4.11 gear. This car will be a true street driver with all options still intact. We will see next summer as it should be done by then.


David

Last edited by FASTFATBOY; Dec 24, 2004 at 07:57 AM.
Old Dec 24, 2004 | 08:41 AM
  #18  
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Re: At what CFM does a stock MAF "peg"

I was tought in school that OBD I didn't use the MAF in open loop it only "uses" it to achieve the 14.7:1 AFR.
If this is the case you wouldn't have to worry about the PCM limitations of the MAF just the actual mechanical "flow" limitations

But Like was posted earlier the easiest way to get around the MAF limitations is to remove it and tune in speed density.
Old Dec 24, 2004 | 09:54 AM
  #19  
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Re: At what CFM does a stock MAF "peg"

Originally Posted by FASTFATBOY
If you want to know the combo I will post it, this is probably the most radical 23* headed 383 normally aspirated LT1 on pump gas that has been built on this board. My Dad and I are shooting for mid to high 10's all motor on a drag radial with a fully optioned Z28 that will weigh in the neighborhood of 3650 lbs with me in it. Tall order I know....we will see.

David
You are looking at 700+ fwhp @ only 7000 with 23 degree heads on 93 octane NA?

That's 525 lb-ft @ 7K power peak. By my calculations, that's as much torque per cube at power peak as a Nextel Cup engine. That is certainly a TALL order for 23 degree heads.

Put me in the skeptical column on this one.

Good luck and keep us posted on the results.
Old Dec 24, 2004 | 11:13 AM
  #20  
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Re: At what CFM does a stock MAF "peg"

Originally Posted by OldSStroker
You are looking at 700+ fwhp @ only 7000 with 23 degree heads on 93 octane NA?

That's 525 lb-ft @ 7K power peak. By my calculations, that's as much torque per cube at power peak as a Nextel Cup engine. That is certainly a TALL order for 23 degree heads.

Put me in the skeptical column on this one.

Good luck and keep us posted on the results.
Engine Analyzer Pro shows torque peak of 600 lb feet@5500 RPM......in a few months we will find out how accurate it is. Some say it is, some say it aint, Dad and I are gonna find out. If the guy above can make 640 FWHP, we definately have the parts to go to 700FWHP, it is an extremely well thought out combination, Dad has many, many hours on EA Pro developing this combo. And to think it started 2 years ago with a 3.750 stroke crank .


David
Old Dec 24, 2004 | 11:20 AM
  #21  
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Re: At what CFM does a stock MAF "peg"

Originally Posted by WIDOMKR383
I was tought in school that OBD I didn't use the MAF in open loop it only "uses" it to achieve the 14.7:1 AFR.
If this is the case you wouldn't have to worry about the PCM limitations of the MAF just the actual mechanical "flow" limitations

But Like was posted earlier the easiest way to get around the MAF limitations is to remove it and tune in speed density.
I will ask the question again, on a 94 pcm, how do you tune in speed density? Or do you mean open loop? I thought OBD1 used the MAF, IAT, TPS and MAP to read gps of incoming air and engine load with a fuel table to set enrichment, turned the O2 sensors off in PE mode, well not turn them off, but not use the readings. ANd that the o2's were used in closed loop to achieve 14.7 A/F.

David

Last edited by FASTFATBOY; Dec 24, 2004 at 11:25 AM.
Old Dec 24, 2004 | 11:53 AM
  #22  
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Re: At what CFM does a stock MAF "peg"

Originally Posted by FASTFATBOY
I will ask the question again, on a 94 pcm, how do you tune in speed density? Or do you mean open loop? I thought OBD1 used the MAF, IAT, TPS and MAP to read gps of incoming air and engine load with a fuel table to set enrichment, turned the O2 sensors off in PE mode, well not turn them off, but not use the readings. ANd that the o2's were used in closed loop to achieve 14.7 A/F.

David
If you are using Tuner Cats you need to open the ECM Switch table and mark the "x" on speed density.
Maybe achieve was the wrong word to use, or maybe I should of said it uses the MAF to help achieve the 14.7:1 AFR with the O2 sensors monitoring the exhaust.
The PCM relies on readings from the MAP sensor for the calculation of engine load and not the MAF.
Yeah you got TPS threshold for WOT but that just lets the pcm know what tps measurment it needs to look for to start refering to the WOT tables.
There has aslo been a big descusion of whether or not the PCM actually uses the PE tables in WOT or open loop do a search in the computer section.
I believe it does make a difference in OBD I as I seen results from changing the PE tables in my car.
You may have to run some pretty extreame #'s in the PE table such as -40 at the idle rpm's and a big positive # in the higher rpm's to achieve a AFR of 12.5:1 or 12.0:1 to get the max HP level in your engine, of coarse all engines and setups require different AFR levels to get the max HP out of them but the dyno will let you know that.
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