Hey it seems when anyone ruins a piston its from a serious lean condition or detonation rather than an overload of power, my question is if these problems were totally eliminated would forged pistons really be neccessary below 600rwhp? The pistons I would be using are Keith Black Hypers dished, for a turbo setup that would be around 500-575 rwhp at most (and not ALL the time) and have around 9.3:1 compression. My reason for considering them is I am doing a "junkyard" turbo setup in a non F-bod car and dont want to have to use alky or anything like that while still keeping cost down, not rebuilding the shortlblock just replacing pistons for now. Now my theory for the reason I think they may work is that as long as detonation and leaning out is avoided, using a safe tune and a good fuel system just to start, doubling the torque would only require a minimal maximum cylinder pressure increase. Like as a lot of you know the pressure may increase at the peak only maybe another 25% but it would have an average cylinder pressure of double what it was N/A since pressure builds sooner and/or holds longer. What do you guys think?

 

Is this gonna be a race gas setup? If so, I think the KB's would be fine. But if it's gonna run on pump gas, detonation is inevitable and I would use another piston.

Rich

 

Keith Black has nothin to to with Silvolite. Silvolite is a cheap junk-non high performance piston manufacturer. The KB name was bought from his family after he died. KB pistons are only used in ghetto-sliders.

 

I wouldn't sweat using the KB's in a turbo motor with efficient intercooling and good tuning. Many of the lower cost import and domestic turbo/supercharged engines are coming from the factory with high-silicon "hyper" pistons and look at the numbers enthusiasts are pushing from stock internals. Scary in my book, but many of them hold up for a good while.

Hennessey Venom Vipers were all built on the stock internals (hypereutectic pistons). Those were 800+hp. A good friend of mine just put together a Roe Supercharger package (8 psi) on his 97' GTS with stock internals. Its quick when you can keep the tires on the ground. The combination is only ~6 months old so we'll see how it holds up.

Heavy nitrous would concern me much more than boost with hypers. Otherwise, for a budget junk-yard build, I say go for it.

-Mindgame

 

Yes it will be pump gas, I did a search and found a thread similar to this where this was discussed and hypers seem to be alright under certain conditions. What I gathered was untill your getting into serious power levels unless something goes wrong they are ok while forged pistons are more tolerant to things going wrong they both still need repair if somethign goes wrong. I just replacing pistons and honing the cylinders this time untill I have enough money to even make more power to need a stronger bottom end, anyone suggest main studs and a stud girdle to help keep everything from distorting under power and possibly ruining bearings and crank surfaces? Just something I thought of...

 

...BTW could some of you suggest a good ring setup, I know nothing about that area of things. If not Ill check the FI forum.

 

Tooled steel only, with that setup you are talking about, 550 rwhp means you will be at 20/25 or more psi of boost, tread lightly, keep it fat and happy.BTW alcohol/water injection is the shiznit for detonation control on a marginal setup.


David

 

I have used standard moly ring sets in pretty much all mine, FI and nitrous. I wanted to try out some of the total seal style this time around, but budget said no. I like the file to fit style to be able to get the ring gaps where I want them, they need to be a little larger to handle the heat and added expansion.
I would recommend talking to the piston manuf. you choose, and see what they recommend.

 

I agree with "Tex". Tool steel vs. "regular" moly rings? I think the TS rings are only needed on an all out race motor that is running "on the edge". I do not know all the details, but TS rings require a specific honing procedure. If you want to use them effectively, close cordination with the machinist is needed as well as following the ring manufacturers instructions. But I wouldn't use them on a street or street/strip combo. I use moly rings on my blower+nitrous motor with no problems.

Rich

 

my motor currently in my car has been together for about 5 years with LOTS of abuse at the track and on the street, with Keith Black flat-tops and Eagle SIR rods. the car has been 10.9@128 with a differnent cam, and a NX kit with a 150 shot on pump gas, with no weight reduction whatsoever.

i dont see a problem with you running keith black pistons. i anticipate mine to go in the 10's at over 130mph when i get my kit back on it and hit it with a 200 shot.

ive been using a kit i had laying around for now with a 100 shot its a dry kit, and i dont even pull out timing with it. i was going to go put a vortech on the car but ima just put the NX kit back on until funds provide...

just dont detonate on them, you'll be fine.