Alright, in my quest for the 50/50 weight distribution I wanna get some opinions and experience with moving the rad and fans to the trunk?

I know I would have to have some kind of venting so the fans could push/pull air from somewhere, but I could do that since I could vent into the underbody pan I am installing and then out the rear diffusser panel.

Any thoughts?

Hunter

 

I think you would need more airflow than you are probably willing to go for. Most vehicles with that setup have huge air inlets into the rear section....Ferraris with the huge egg-grate sides and Lambos with huge air ducts in the rear of the car. Even the Bugattis have them as well. I think you would probably need some major hacking to do that in a Camaro. Maybe it can be done with out that?

 

Here at Georgia Tech Research Institute we are currently working on a radiator that will be the rear spoiler. This is for race cars right now, but, I see future production automobile's having this setup. It has what we call a blown surface that forces air through the spoiler/radiator that gives four times the downforce and the spoiler/radiator is half the size of a conventional radiatior with the same amount of cooling!!!

 

>>>
Here at Georgia Tech Research Institute we are currently working on a radiator that will be the rear spoiler. This is for race cars right now, but, I see future production automobile's having this setup. It has what we call a blown surface that forces air through the spoiler/radiator that gives four times the downforce and the spoiler/radiator is half the size of a conventional radiatior with the same amount of cooling!!!
>>>

Tell us more! I want that. Well, I want anything that is completely different for the sake of function and happens to have neat form to go with it.

 

Some thoughts:

1968 F-car per your siggy? That's what I'm assuming.

Pick up air behind door and forward of rear wheel opening with flush NACA ducts, maybe 2 per side.

Internally duct that air to twin or one long rad mounted vertically between the taillamps and completely enclosed in ductwork. You could use long horizontal louvers to let the air out.

With stock-type (or higher) lip spoiler on rear of decklid, you'll generate low pressure area behind car, and if your ductwork is correct, you'll have positive pressure at front of rad(s), so at cruise speed, fans will probably not be needed. They will be needed for some cases, so small pushers at the face of the rad(s) will probably work well.

Run the aluminum(?) plumbing under the floorpan so the airstream can help cool it.

There would still be room for a under-floor fuel cell in the trunk, and almost no heat into the passenger compartment.

As for weight distribution change, it'll be better than moving the battery to the trunk, which you are doing, of course, but with the plumbing and fibreglas or even carbon fibre ducting, overall weight probably won't change much.

You can now use stock front rad area for intercoolers. I'd want them as short and wide as possible to keep the weight low.

My $.02.

 

i guess you could get some air inlets that they make for the kit car gt-40's but you may be opposed to it coming from a Ford

 

Ya this is for my 68.

I will be putting a full underbody carbon fiber pan to seal up the bottom of the car and clean up aerodynamics. This allows me to take all this extra air flowing in the engine comparment from where the rad was and flow it under that floorpan and into the trunk, where the rad would be.

I could take this air and duct it into the rad, and then duct it back into the underbody pan and it would go out the rear diffuser panel. Another idea was to take air from teh quarter panel, duct it into the rad and then out into the underbody pan.

Stainless or aluminum pipes under floorpan to help cool the coolant on the way. Also Ill have 2 electroic pumps, because I do not need any pressure to cool the engine with the Evan's NPG coolant I am going to use.

As for rad size and design, I haven't thought of that, but are long skinny ones gonna work better than squares?I will alread have an intercooler spot in the front valance panel, but unless I need the extra intercooling space, Ill just leave it open.

Ford GT-40 ducts... open to those...though its a ford...its GT-40...and I LOVE THOSE

A friend of mine and I are workin on this at school and get to use it as a project for the end of our quarter.

Thanks for the replies, its jsut a work in progress.
Hunter

 

Hunter,

There are a ton of ways to get front end weight off of your car to get you to your 50/50 goal. Putting the radiator in rear sounds cool but will add a bunch of weight to the car. I know of several Stockers with cast iron heads that have better than 50% of their weight on the rear wheels. You don't have the restrictions that we have so you really shouldn't have a problem. The trick is to look at every part on your car right down to the nuts and bolts.


Best Regards,

Daren

 

Diffuser design is tricky, and with the 68's body shape, you'll still need a trunk lip spoiler to decrease the rear lift.

I strongly recommend Race Car Aerodynamics: Designing for Speed by Joseph Katz, and published by Bentley Publishers to you. It's worth way more than it's $35 price, and will help you immensely in this project.

If you haven't done a lot of carbon fibre fabricating, you might consider fibreglass; it's tons cheaper and easier. If you mix carbon black powder in the resin, it looks a lot like CF.

Good luck. Keep your minds open.

 

Carbon fiber on the bottom? I hope you dont find any rocks

 

I think that my idea of moving air under the pan was a bad one, I didn't think about the front end lift it would create. Back to the drawing boards.

Air going into the grill will go into the turbos and then to the intercooler mounted below and intop the engine. That should keep air out of the engine compartment. Also I like the idea of fender vents from 2nd gen's they always looked cool and would help get all that hot air out of the engine bay.

Ya the rear lip spoiler will be there, but it is going to be a bit larger, and adjustable from the cockpit. I can then take it to the track and see what angle the spoiler needs to be at for the best downforce to the rear wheels.

Funny you should mention that book, I just ordered it, should be here in about 2 weeks.

I actually have done some carbon fiber fabbing for my dads boat with him, and also with kevlar, so I am set on one of those two.
The carbon fiber is really strong, rigid and will hold up to the rocks that it will come in contact with. I might use Kevlar though because of its cheaper, from where I get it.

HUnter

 

Carbon fiber is very brittle without some other fibers mixed with it. Yes, it’s strong, but on impact it turns to dust.

Kevlar is just about the opposite. It’s very flexible and just about impossible to break/rip. The problem is that it’s also very difficult to wet out with epoxy resin, making it difficult to work.

In many applications you’re best of going with CF for the stiff, strong parts with Kevlar inserts in the stress points to prevent cracking… That’s what formula cars do for their tubs, they put Kevlar in areas so that on a hard impact the CF will absorb the energy and then Kevlar keeps it from flying apart.

From that viewpoint you’d probably be best off using either a hybrid roving or pre peg or for that matter, it would be cheaper and just as functional to use just straight ‘gas. After all, this isn’t a structural piece. Real world… well, composites aren’t that great a choice at all since most are not all that heat tolerant and with exhaust that could become an issue.

I’d probably do sections in ‘glass and others in aluminum sheet…

 

After staying up for 2 days without sleep, I post stupid stuff like in my last post.

Carbon fiber is stong, but as you said, brittle as glass. I will probably be using a carbon fiber and kevlar weave. If that gets terribly destroyed, I may resort to aluminum. To support the pan, aluminum supports will hold it up.

Nothing new on the radiator, been busy this weekend with my girls b day, but Ill post more into monday.

Hunter

 

Alright I firgured out where I am gonna take cool air from and put it into the rad. The quarter panel window will fit one maybe two NACA ducts in it, so I will grab air from both windows and duct it to the rad. Probably dual Spal fans will be pulling air also if it gets tooo hot.

Now for the cooling lines........what do u think, aluminum or stainless steel? If the lines are protected I think aluminum should be fine, plus it will help with weight and cooling.


Hunter

 

I believe the Fiero cooling lines were aluminum. They also had a drain plug on them for draining the coolant.