I am trying to figure out why lifters fail. It seems Comp Cams R's have a bad reputation as the clips keeps breaking, or some have.
So, what would cause the failures?
With the vast experince here, lets discuss possible issues.
I think adjustment is one. Comp Cams hasa very specific set up, and for some this may be diffiicult to do as it is cumbersome to adjust, especially in the car.
Spring pressure. For a aggresive hydraulic roller, some prefer allot of pressure to maintain valvetrain stability and reduce float for high rpm. But what kind of pressure is too much for a Hydraulic roller?
Cam selection: Some ramps are very aggressive, and in turn causes you to get a lot of movement in the valvetrain.
But engine builders should have more input as they have used these lifters, and the 5 out of 19 companies that have replied to my emails, have had no issues with the COMP CAMS r's.
So, whats your opinions on these lifters and the possible cause of failures.

 

I’m running into the opposite as the comp R’s seemed to have been working pretty good but got hp greedy. It's more than likely a magicians trick and has nothing to do with the lifters, but we just swapped out a set of Comp R’s for a set of Morels and lost 40 hp.

I have very serious doubts it’s the lifters and more than likely something else is going on, but we zero lashed the Comp R’s and it picked up above 6100 rpm and revved clean to 7200 so we were hoping to get even a bit more from the Morels.

Getting ready for a second round of playing with the car on the dyno and even swapped out intakes as some oil showed up in the intake and it may be from getting carried away porting. The Comp R’s seem to be OK and if we can’t figure out what is going on… they’re going back in to make sure there is no Morel lifter issues.

Now solids……….. I can go on a while regarding failure of solids during everyday driving.

 

What amount of pre-load are you setting?

I've heard of cases where people are setting pre-loads of 0.030" or more on a
FULL ROLLER cam/valvetrain!

I think Denny has it right with zero lash, but I've also read that hydraulic
lifters like/need some amount of preload (~0.005") to prevent the seat from
pushing the retainer clip out.

Looking forward to this discussion.

 

I set mine at exactly what Comp Cams said. It seems that there is an issue with the retainers werent hardened correctly. Comp Cams hasnt issued any warnings or recalls to anyone.

 

Regarding lifter preload. For many years in Stock Eliminator I've set hydraulic flat tappets and hydraulic rollers to zero lash and twisted the engines to 7500 repeatedly. I've broken more stock rocker arms than I have lifters. Usually, when something goes wrong in a Stock Eliminator valve train it can be traced to an unanticipated loss of valve spring pressure.

c.

 

So, do you think maybe Spring pressure may have more to do with the Comp R failures, or the combination of there pre load and spring pressure.

 

im running comp rs with nary a problem so far, and ive gone to 7+ on missed shifts with no float.honestly i was not expecting them to function as well as they do.eventually i will get around to putting a real cam in it, and will give them a chance to prove thier worth before just throwing an SR in.[i have a light valvetrain btw, which is helping]
i think the failures are attributed more to too much pressure[people cranking it up to stay oput of float] more so than not being adjusted correctly. i have noticed when a setup is not lashed properly, other valvetrain parts will fail, ie pushrods, rockers, studs etc; where as too much pressure is hard on the cam and lifters[ran triples on a hyd once cuz i was stupid-er- and thats all I had] and it completely wiped the cam and wasted the lifters, but didnt break anything in the valvetrain.
is this convoluted logic making sense?
as far as ramps being too aggresive i think thats more of an issue for flat tappets than for a roller.
my take on the business anyway.

 

The failures I have seen are totally to do with the manufacturing of the parts and nothing else.... put them in at zero-lash and you find power but put more preload into them and your not going to break them. I've seen lots of spring pressure put on Comp R's and nothing has failed so its not the pressure.

The retainer clips to me look like they were not heat treated or designed properly, while the old style clips were C clips and they did the job perfectly.

I've talked with Denny about the Morels and he played with a few things but didn't check the pushrod length when he changed the lifters which could very well be a big problem that could cause the HP loss.

Bret

 

I agree. Pushrod length is a critical factor as much as is proper valve spring pressure. Simply running the valve train with zero lash will not break lifters. Weak valve springs will induce failure of stamped rocker arms as well as other even more catastrophic events. I run open spring pressures of over 400 pounds when using the relatively radical Stock Eliminator lobe profiles with stock lift limitations and stock GM roller lifters. They routinely see 7000+ RPMs with a neglible failure rate.

 

Bret, Have you called Comp Cams to talk to them, being a business person and all. I am curious as to what they would say, or if there QA has been checked?

 

That's a touchy subject.... if they have bad parts they will warranty them but most likely they are not going to tell you why they go boom. We came to the conclusion around here what I said above, and I dont see any other evidence that it's anything else.

I'm still waiting on the lifters to have the problem fixed.... I've always had good luck with these things but I can't sell customers parts that will break.

Bret

 

Bret , Have you ever had the clips actually tested for hardness?

 

No I haven't.... only have had customer many states away have the problem but not a motor I have in front of me, I don't know if that's good or bad.

Either way the new design just doesn't cut it for me and the quality of the lifters is going down, where the Morel's are running tolerances .0002" on the plunger, plus they actually give a rats *** about burrs and making a quality part.... the pricing structure on the Comp R's does not allow this anymore.

Bret

 

One of the key things I have found from the companies that have responded to my emails in regards to there workings with the Comp R's, is they say they work fine but are finicky to work with. SO the adjustment is crucial and the clips arent up to snuff.
I guess I need to save some money up for new lifters.
Its a shame that Comp Cams, being who they are, havent come up to fix this problem, or noticed it.

 

Bret i showed my cracked and blown up Comp R's to my motor builder hoping he would tell others of the problem to save them the headaches too. He told that it should be possible to just take a Comp R and pull the junky clip out and put a stock C clip in them. Have you tried this? Do you know would it work? I'd try it but most of my Comp R's are in pieces rather than still in tact.