Many thanks for the links, 'Game.

If Pro Stock with their 2.6 hp/cube, 10k rpm engines and 5-speed close ratio transmissions use 4-2-1, perhaps it works better in a 2000 or so rpm band than 4 into 1's. Hmmmm.

 

That does bring up a darn good question doesn't it.

Any thoughts on that?

Here we're talking about broadening a torque curve over a wide rpm range and we have an example of PS cars using a tri-y design. It is baffling a times.
Then again... these designs (real long primaries before the "Y") are quite a bit different than the shorter primary Doug Thorleys for street aps.

BTW, the parametric modeling software Burns makes mention of....... consulting with them I think would be an excellent idea considering they offer such a service and have the expertise!

Interesting.

-Mindgame

 

1-949-631-5120
fax 949-631-3184
8am - 4 pm PST M-F

Go for it!

 

Oh no, I'm much too busy to make a career change at this point in life. What I do has been good to me but I do know of a gentlemen with a fledgeling business developing engines, marketing throttle bodies for LS1's, etc., who might find use of such a service.

Beats the hell out of developing your own software. Unless of course you have the programming skills, research materials and mathematical expertise necessary to that task. Then again, enough dinero would surely buy you a professional level parametric modeling package...... but it's all about ROI.
Ode to joy.

-Mindgame

 

As my bro monk said earlier i have been working on equal length turbo headers on my s10. Making headers isnt easy but if you like to be challecnges go for it ther are some tricks like welding hte collectors but if you are going to mek the headers i will explain to you how its done leak free. it wont cost much, the ones for the s10 cost me $10 what i did was go to a swap meet and picked up a pair of slightly used headers sandblated them and cut them up also i have obtines 3 other sets of headers for free 2 being unused. I would say if you realize that it isnt the easiest thing to do but your up for a challenge go for it because when i make a pair of custom headers i feel like i acomplished something because they are the only pair in the world like them .

 

Funny,

BTW the TB's are a good product to turn out over and over again. Bussiness's are based on cash flow, West Coast Choppers, JPE any good specialty bussiness has to have the cash cow to be able to do the fun stuff. How else can you find the time to have 40hours a week devoted to a intake manifold, or phone time or dyno time?......etc....

I'm really thinking of a 4-2-1 Tri-Y for my LS1 at this point. I'm going witha custom intake, so I might as well do that other end of the system too.

Bret

 

Thanks Bret,
Having been in business some 20 years I can honestly tell you that I do understand the economics of it, thanks.

I guess there was some offense taken with my statement. The point of a "fledgeling business" perhaps?
Perhaps a poor choice of wording but "fledgeling" means nothing other than "young" in that context. I'm under the impression that you are in your mid-upper 20's correct? I'd also assume that your business is relatively "young" also?

Let's try not to be hypersensitive about everything ok. The point of my post was not to insult, just passing along an idea that you could 'consult' with experts on your design if you chose to.

Good luck.

-Mindgame

 

Game,

I'm not offened by it. That time I really didn't take it bad.

Yeah, it's young and so am I, on the young side of your guess.

I found after college that being a stock broker and the other couple of jobs I had was going to leave me nothing but unhappy, broke and a drunk. I tossed that and said I gotta do what I think about all day, and that's cars. People would think that a high end private college education and Series 7 would be a blessing at 22. The education yes, because it's applicable today, but the carrer field was completely boring. Going from that to this is awesome. There are so many people that I find in the racing field that I respect and learn things from than I ever found in the finance community. God most of those guys only know how to make money for them, not clients. BIG RULE OF THUMB ON LIFE HERE: 10% of stock brokers know what they are doing, and only 10% of them are good at it. Investing is easy, diversifiy and use indexes, especially ETF's. You can get more complicated, but 99% of the people out there would be better off if they just did that.

Anyways, yeah being young has that advantage. You can do what you want too. A job field is like a wife, if you don't like alot of what's there now, it's only going to get worse. There is no real good way to jump ship when you are 40, have kids and a house. I really felt like American Beauty was going to happen to me when I got older. I could care less if I had the potential for $500K a year, but I ended up being the president of the FDS club (Fat, Drunk and Stupid) There is a meaning to life and it's to be happy. Nothing is better than making something that grown men can use and laugh like school girls. I still do that everytime I do a burnout or doughnut.

Talk about being off topic, just wanted you to know that I didn't take that wrong.

BTW the NSX Ti rods are a bit overkill. I've yet to figure out why Honda and BMW want 8,000rpm engines with a long stroke. They are pretty cool engines, but man with a warranty and that kind of RPM I wonder.

Bret

 

That's a good point. I always wonder why guys will spend stupid extra money on a set of heads that are 10-20cfm more, say $100 or more per CFM, and never run it in a competiton. One thing to look at in the Engine Masters was John Becks engine. Minimal pocket ported Fast Burn GM heads and a RPM Air Gap intake, and he finished 3rd? Sherman had about 3 times the money in the heads (AFR 215's)and only beat John by 1.5%. Throw coatings on that engine he had and Sherman would have gotten beat at his own game. That engine too me was the most significant there. I was right on par with Sherman and his design, and Beck's engine really suprised me.

A street engine has no rules, so take advantage of what you have. Some of us have the advantage of being able to build what we need, but that is only a small part of it. Power is easier when you don't have rules. That's the beauty of N2O. A well put together N2O set can be driveable and faster than stink on the track.

Ultra competitve stuff is always a challenge and is fun if there is money there to build it. It teaches you alot, but it also eats up money and time very quickly. Alot of the topics we talk about on here deal with some stuff that really only applies to this, the simple things that can really help the average guy should be more of a discussion on here. So guys things like bore/stroke and rod/stroke ratios are important, but in most engines are really not a big part of making power. Oil control, proper cam phasing and a simple intake manifold will get you allot closer to the dream engine you want.

Bret