Can Rod Clearance be TOO much?
Thread Starter
Banned
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 3,505
From: looking for a flow bench so Brook and I can race
Can Rod Clearance be TOO much?
on my stroker,
the butt of connecting rods clear the wall by .009'' as opposed to the .003'' in the specs...
does that matter?
some clear .003 while some clear .009
we had to notch them out manualy so its hard to be that accurate...
does it matter?
also end play is supposed to be .001 to .003 and its .0011
am i cutting it too close?
thanks guys
trey
------------------
- Project N/A Underway-
Estimated time of completion: June 26th
AIM: SUPACHARGED22
I have up the beautiful shores of Long Island and the Excitment of NYC for the wonders of Flint MI
[This message has been edited by treyZ28 (edited July 23, 2002).]
the butt of connecting rods clear the wall by .009'' as opposed to the .003'' in the specs...
does that matter?
some clear .003 while some clear .009
we had to notch them out manualy so its hard to be that accurate...
does it matter?
also end play is supposed to be .001 to .003 and its .0011
am i cutting it too close?
thanks guys
trey
------------------
- Project N/A Underway-
Estimated time of completion: June 26th
AIM: SUPACHARGED22
I have up the beautiful shores of Long Island and the Excitment of NYC for the wonders of Flint MI
[This message has been edited by treyZ28 (edited July 23, 2002).]
West South Central Moderator / Special Guest
Joined: Dec 1998
Posts: 1,650
From: Coppell, TX USA
what do you mean "rods clear the wall"?
end play.. do you mean crank end play(thrust)? .111 is WAYtoo much.
------------------
-94 Black T-Topped Z28 M6, 10s, and daily driven!
-96 CBR F3, modded of course
-92 Talon Tsi AWD, also too many mods..
-99 Tony Kart
http://www.fastblackcar.com
end play.. do you mean crank end play(thrust)? .111 is WAYtoo much.
------------------
-94 Black T-Topped Z28 M6, 10s, and daily driven!
-96 CBR F3, modded of course
-92 Talon Tsi AWD, also too many mods..
-99 Tony Kart
http://www.fastblackcar.com
Thread Starter
Banned
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 3,505
From: looking for a flow bench so Brook and I can race
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by JordonMusser:
what do you mean "rods clear the wall"?
end play.. do you mean crank end play(thrust)? .111 is WAYtoo much.
</font>
what do you mean "rods clear the wall"?
end play.. do you mean crank end play(thrust)? .111 is WAYtoo much.
</font>
what i mean as far as the clearance is...
imagine where the rod stud goes in, now if it kept going through the whole rod....
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----X|||||||||||-------------
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if thats the connecting rod, the x is where its hitting the very bottom of the cylander wall due to the lengthened stroke
we had to notch that out
[This message has been edited by treyZ28 (edited July 23, 2002).]
[This message has been edited by treyZ28 (edited July 23, 2002).]
Registered User
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 2,400
From: Michigan's left coast
Trey,
You need at least 0.060" of clearance between the rotating assembly and the block. I do believe that you're getting this spec mixed up with the rod bearing clearance spec. I check the rod-to-block clearance with a 1/16" drill bit (0.0625" diameter) - if I can't fit the bit between the block and rod at the tightest point, I'm not done grinding. It doesn't have to be super-accurate - go far enough to get that 0.060" of clearance, but don't go so far that you cut into a water jacket. As long as you don't go overboard, you should be fine. I can assure you that if you've only got a few thou of clearance, you'll hit the block with the rods once the engine's running.
As far as the crank endplay goes, you're probably OK, but it's a bit on the tight side. If you want to open it up a bit, ask your machine shop about the best way. If you've got a selection of main bearings to pick from, you can often dial in the endplay that way. If not, the shop can take a very light cut off the thrust surface of the crank.
------------------
1996 Impala SS - LT4 396, T56
1996 GMC K2500
1992 Buick Roadmaster Estate Wagon
You need at least 0.060" of clearance between the rotating assembly and the block. I do believe that you're getting this spec mixed up with the rod bearing clearance spec. I check the rod-to-block clearance with a 1/16" drill bit (0.0625" diameter) - if I can't fit the bit between the block and rod at the tightest point, I'm not done grinding. It doesn't have to be super-accurate - go far enough to get that 0.060" of clearance, but don't go so far that you cut into a water jacket. As long as you don't go overboard, you should be fine. I can assure you that if you've only got a few thou of clearance, you'll hit the block with the rods once the engine's running.
As far as the crank endplay goes, you're probably OK, but it's a bit on the tight side. If you want to open it up a bit, ask your machine shop about the best way. If you've got a selection of main bearings to pick from, you can often dial in the endplay that way. If not, the shop can take a very light cut off the thrust surface of the crank.
------------------
1996 Impala SS - LT4 396, T56
1996 GMC K2500
1992 Buick Roadmaster Estate Wagon
Thread Starter
Banned
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 3,505
From: looking for a flow bench so Brook and I can race
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by Eric Bryant:
Trey,
You need at least 0.060" of clearance between the rotating assembly and the block. I do believe that you're getting this spec mixed up with the rod bearing clearance spec. I check the rod-to-block clearance with a 1/16" drill bit (0.0625" diameter) - if I can't fit the bit between the block and rod at the tightest point, I'm not done grinding. It doesn't have to be super-accurate - go far enough to get that 0.060" of clearance, but don't go so far that you cut into a water jacket. As long as you don't go overboard, you should be fine. I can assure you that if you've only got a few thou of clearance, you'll hit the block with the rods once the engine's running.
As far as the crank endplay goes, you're probably OK, but it's a bit on the tight side. If you want to open it up a bit, ask your machine shop about the best way. If you've got a selection of main bearings to pick from, you can often dial in the endplay that way. If not, the shop can take a very light cut off the thrust surface of the crank.
</font>
Trey,
You need at least 0.060" of clearance between the rotating assembly and the block. I do believe that you're getting this spec mixed up with the rod bearing clearance spec. I check the rod-to-block clearance with a 1/16" drill bit (0.0625" diameter) - if I can't fit the bit between the block and rod at the tightest point, I'm not done grinding. It doesn't have to be super-accurate - go far enough to get that 0.060" of clearance, but don't go so far that you cut into a water jacket. As long as you don't go overboard, you should be fine. I can assure you that if you've only got a few thou of clearance, you'll hit the block with the rods once the engine's running.
As far as the crank endplay goes, you're probably OK, but it's a bit on the tight side. If you want to open it up a bit, ask your machine shop about the best way. If you've got a selection of main bearings to pick from, you can often dial in the endplay that way. If not, the shop can take a very light cut off the thrust surface of the crank.
</font>
Yeah you right
my clearance is .09 i believe, but if i didn't go too deep into the coolant passages adn such, can there be too much clearance?
also eric,
when i get my car up here, can you help me put in a new fuel pump?
i'd realy appreciate it. i just got raped on books in college and have NO tools here...
thanks man
trey
Registered User
Joined: Dec 1969
Posts: 1,431
From: Pacific North West
From the sounds of things here I would loosen the rear main and tap the crank from front to back with a Plastic mallet then tighten cap again and re check. Could be as simple as main cap not centered.
IF I were you I would get some help on that motor. hate to see you loose it to a small mistake
------------------
Ellis
Team Captain
Team North West F-Body
www.teamnwfbody.org
IF I were you I would get some help on that motor. hate to see you loose it to a small mistake
------------------
Ellis
Team Captain
Team North West F-Body
www.teamnwfbody.org
Registered User
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 2,400
From: Michigan's left coast
Trey,
I'd be more than happy to help you out with this thing. I haven't done an F-body fuel pump yet, but I've got tools and a garage. Let me know if you want help with that motor, too, and I'll do what I can.
0.090" of clearance is not too much as long as you haven't gone into a coolant passage. It's much better to have "too much" clearance than not enough As I'm sure you can imagine, it'd be bad to swat the block with a rod at 6500 RPM.
------------------
1996 Impala SS - LT4 396, T56
1996 GMC K2500
1992 Buick Roadmaster Estate Wagon
I'd be more than happy to help you out with this thing. I haven't done an F-body fuel pump yet, but I've got tools and a garage. Let me know if you want help with that motor, too, and I'll do what I can.
0.090" of clearance is not too much as long as you haven't gone into a coolant passage. It's much better to have "too much" clearance than not enough
As I'm sure you can imagine, it'd be bad to swat the block with a rod at 6500 RPM. ------------------
1996 Impala SS - LT4 396, T56
1996 GMC K2500
1992 Buick Roadmaster Estate Wagon
Moderator
Joined: Dec 1969
Posts: 10,745
From: Buffalo, New York
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by Eric Bryant:
Trey,
You need at least 0.060" of clearance between the rotating assembly and the block. I do believe that you're getting this spec mixed up with the rod bearing clearance spec. I check the rod-to-block clearance with a 1/16" drill bit (0.0625" diameter) - if I can't fit the bit between the block and rod at the tightest point, I'm not done grinding. It doesn't have to be super-accurate - go far enough to get that 0.060" of clearance, but don't go so far that you cut into a water jacket. As long as you don't go overboard, you should be fine. I can assure you that if you've only got a few thou of clearance, you'll hit the block with the rods once the engine's running.
As far as the crank endplay goes, you're probably OK, but it's a bit on the tight side. If you want to open it up a bit, ask your machine shop about the best way. If you've got a selection of main bearings to pick from, you can often dial in the endplay that way. If not, the shop can take a very light cut off the thrust surface of the crank.
</font>
Trey,
You need at least 0.060" of clearance between the rotating assembly and the block. I do believe that you're getting this spec mixed up with the rod bearing clearance spec. I check the rod-to-block clearance with a 1/16" drill bit (0.0625" diameter) - if I can't fit the bit between the block and rod at the tightest point, I'm not done grinding. It doesn't have to be super-accurate - go far enough to get that 0.060" of clearance, but don't go so far that you cut into a water jacket. As long as you don't go overboard, you should be fine. I can assure you that if you've only got a few thou of clearance, you'll hit the block with the rods once the engine's running.
As far as the crank endplay goes, you're probably OK, but it's a bit on the tight side. If you want to open it up a bit, ask your machine shop about the best way. If you've got a selection of main bearings to pick from, you can often dial in the endplay that way. If not, the shop can take a very light cut off the thrust surface of the crank.
</font>
YMMV
Rich Krause
------------------
'95 Z-28 383 with Vortech, nitrous, etc.
"1FASTZ28"
Registered User
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 2,400
From: Michigan's left coast
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by rskrause:
As you say, more won't hurt unless you get into the water jacket though, but I have used 0.030" without a problem.
</font>
As you say, more won't hurt unless you get into the water jacket though, but I have used 0.030" without a problem.
</font>
------------------
1996 Impala SS - LT4 396, T56
1996 GMC K2500
1992 Buick Roadmaster Estate Wagon
Thread Starter
Banned
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 3,505
From: looking for a flow bench so Brook and I can race
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by Eric Bryant:
Trey,
I'd be more than happy to help you out with this thing. I haven't done an F-body fuel pump yet, but I've got tools and a garage. Let me know if you want help with that motor, too, and I'll do what I can.
0.090" of clearance is not too much as long as you haven't gone into a coolant passage. It's much better to have "too much" clearance than not enough As I'm sure you can imagine, it'd be bad to swat the block with a rod at 6500 RPM.
</font>
Trey,
I'd be more than happy to help you out with this thing. I haven't done an F-body fuel pump yet, but I've got tools and a garage. Let me know if you want help with that motor, too, and I'll do what I can.
0.090" of clearance is not too much as long as you haven't gone into a coolant passage. It's much better to have "too much" clearance than not enough
As I'm sure you can imagine, it'd be bad to swat the block with a rod at 6500 RPM. </font>
hey eric
thanks a ton man!
the car should be up here in late august...
im in college right now and my friends dad whos a mechanic and build a few chevys is finfishing it off for me
i got to throw in my hollyy 255 and my 2 bottles
anything you can help me with would be greatly appreciated!
I hate my schools car clubs and don't really get along with anyone there... they think they know so much more than me because they are seniors.
example
i noticed their straitline acceleration is poor in competion
I ask if they ever concidered porting heads and going with more aggressive cam
in an arregent way he tells me there isn't enough power to be gained in heads and cam combo, they dont' have enough time for lil gains like that and they just have to find ways to make it lighter...
so they use stock heads and cam combo in the setup
our other car club isn't hardcore enough... its just a joke and they dont' take anything seriously. they autocross SUVs and do'nt realy care too much about their performance.
with the exception of 2 kids, most kids here that are into cars want me to help them with their headers on their alero
thanks man
you may have just saved my sanity!:-D
trey
West South Central Moderator / Special Guest
Joined: Dec 1998
Posts: 1,650
From: Coppell, TX USA
.030 is a min.. .060 is "100% safe". the .060 number takes into account if you.. say spin a bearing, you still won't get rod to block contact.
like Ellis said, loosen everything, and knock the crank back and forth.. make sure everything is seated.
------------------
-94 Black T-Topped Z28 M6, 10s, and daily driven!
-96 CBR F3, modded of course
-92 Talon Tsi AWD, also too many mods..
-99 Tony Kart
http://www.fastblackcar.com
like Ellis said, loosen everything, and knock the crank back and forth.. make sure everything is seated.
------------------
-94 Black T-Topped Z28 M6, 10s, and daily driven!
-96 CBR F3, modded of course
-92 Talon Tsi AWD, also too many mods..
-99 Tony Kart
http://www.fastblackcar.com
Registered User
Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 312
From: Phoenix, AZ USA
Hey guys my engine builder called and said he hit a water jacket clearancing for the rod. He says he's going to fix it by pouring something similar to concrete below the drain plugs in the block. This will fix it while also giving more strength....
What so you?
Mike
What so you?
Mike
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