Black6SpdTA

All the answers you need: www.lt1intake.com

IMO, given a set budget (gotta buy the car/engine with it), an L98 can be made to stomp an LT1. Because L98's and mods for it are cheaper, you always have more "mod money" when compared to doing an LT1/LS1 buildup.

-Corey

Bad AZz Z28

nice. I know I've seen/heard of a converted intake before but never paid much attention.

It really comes down to what people want to build between L98 and LT1 and what deal they can get with one. Unlike that tin foil crap , a small block is a small block and can use alot of the same good parts. an L98 with LTx intake, some good SBC heads and a solid bottom end has no reason to not perform very well and be good daily driven.

MadMax350

Here is my 2 cents on the whole L98 vs. LT1 debate:

Stock vs. Stock the LT1 will most likely beat the L98 in every catagory except low end torque. With that being said, there are some things that I think makes the LT1 less desirable:

-Opti-Junk
-Unique heads

Basically, I think what makes the LT1 is the intake. Sure, the heads are better, but they aren't that great and looking down the road at performance mods, you are going to want to get better heads. Cost is always a factor and lets face it, the LT1 is one of the most expensive chevy engines to mod when we are talking hard parts. Not to metion that you need an ignition system to support the mods and the Optispark is quite possibly one of the most sad ignitions I have ever seen.

-on the other side of the coin-

The L98 has a great intake and heads combo if you have a truck that needs to pull stumps. However, there are so many different aftermarket intakes out for these engines you can basically pick and choose one that best matches your driving style.

Either way, when it comes to making more power, it is not going to be cheap. If you are looking for a stock engine that you do not intend to ever produce 400+ HP then I think the LT1 would be my first choice, just be prepaired to deal with all the headaches that come along with swapping in an LT1 as the serpentine assy drive setup that comes on these engines is not directly compatible with a 3rd gen. The Corvette serpentine setup works great but you will still need custom A/C lines and the vette A/C compressor is not cheap if you have to buy one.

For reference, I helped my friend install an LT1 into his 86 T/A about 4 years ago and then later helped him do the HOT-LT4 (heads and cam) conversion on it. http://lt4.cz28.com Impressive for what it is but not how much he had to pay for everything. He still doesn't have the A/C hooked up but it could easily be done.

So let me put all this in perspective:

Your typical LT1 puts out 275 HP, upgrade the exhaust and induction as well as all of the free mods, and you are looking at a solid 300hp. The best stock L98 makes 245hp. Even with the exhaust and induction upgrades as well as free mods I think you are going to be hard pressed even to hit the LT1's stock 275hp. To get to 300hp you are going to need a very agressively ported intake and possibly aftermarket runners. However, IF you get the TPI L98 to 300hp, it is going to be making a lot more torque than an LT1 with the same HP, and is going to be making it a lot earlier.

To get to 400hp with either engine, I think one needs to seriously consider aftermarket heads. Heads for the LT1 are going to be more expensive since not as many companies offer them, on the other hand, I don't think 400 HP is attainable using a stock TPI intake on an L98 even with the best heads so that is additional cost that needs to be considered.

In the end, I think you need to make a choice of what you want for your car. Do you want an engine that makes good high RPM power or one that has torque-on-demand?

90rocz

Here we go again...
The gains from an LT1 are not just the intake, I don't really think it's a great advantage over the TPI. It was a combination of the intake + taller port aluminum heads + larger cam; but all this didn't really boost torque numbers a great deal, it just moved the peak torque point higher in the rpm range increasing HP slightly.
So, NO "one" part of an LT1 is that superior, period; but the entire combo resulted in maybe a .4 improvement stock for stock...

Combination is everything!, if you build an L98 around a package that the heads will support the cam and intake, you can still be as quick. I'm not trying to mimic an LT1, powerband, rpm etc..I'm building around my TPI...everthing I do will meet it's needs..

There's a pretty good article about Torque vs. HP in the new Hot Rod, the only reason for buying the mag.... It explains a little better why an L98 can keep up with an LT1...

Jonesy, maybe the LS1's here are slow, and no offense(and noe taken) but 12's with 3.73 gears, exhaust, Prom..
Thanx for the comic releif bro...
And Ya know what, second place, is just First Loser...

Hey, set a date after March, I'll try to have her back together..
But it's gonna take more than 12.70's to own the combo I'm workin on tho...

I've been taking this project slow and deliberate, I could've dumped a slippery converter in and steep gears, cam, and sticky's and be in the 12's right now. But I want this project to be an extremely streetable, reliable, stock appearing, sounding, sleeper that will pull past most all comers with Authority!...
(This is my current, NOT my fastest attempt...)

Yeah Kevin91Z, there are a few differences in the Vette heads from iron, But the basic port/runner designs / flow characteristics are almost copies...Truthfully I'd take the iron over the Vette's anyday..Pro's and con's for Aluminum are well known...

Merry Christmas to all my Bow Tie brothers!..

jonesy91z28

Hey 90irocz I see that you live in ohio. How far up do you live? I live in kentucky. After march when you get you car done you can give me a ring and maybe we can meet at clay city. I dont know if you have heard of this track but I do know alot of people from ohio come down and race there. If you come down I can show you a stock ls1 with 3:73 and exhaust run 12.70's first hand. Also maybe I will have my car ready to go again by then and I can show you a street driven 9 second lt1. hell I will drive it to and from the track that's like 150 mile round trip. Just some thoughts maybe even some laughs. Good luck with the tpi I really would like to see one run good.

doug791

9 seconds eh whats it run consistently? My buddies dad has a C4 corvette with a race block v6 and a rather large turbo that runs consistent 9.7's hes hopeing to have it in the 9.5's by next summer. And those times are on ET streets he could drive it to the track, do a burnout, run the 1/4 in under 10 seconds, and drive home, all without even swapping a tire.

RobsWS6

Here we go again:

The opti spark has gotten a bad rep because of the early non vented design. Once it got wet, it died. That changed in 95 with the vented design.

Its a pretty good setup, the best of any small block. Much better than a distributor. It was just in a bad spot right under the water pump.

The LT1 also came with the best rods ever put in a small block. A full point compression over a TPI. Better flowing intake. Better flowing heads. Better computer controls. Better y-pipe. Better transmissions. ETC...

My 96 WS6 ran 13.18@104 with just HPP+, thermostat, K&N, air foil, 4.10 gears, and 1LE driveshaft. Everything else was completely stock including the tires. I then added a HOT cam, 1.6 rockers, new springs, 52mm TB, SLP dual cat headers, RPS turbo clutch, Hurst shifter, Kenny Brown SFC, Hotchkis panhard rod, Racenet LCA's, Nitto Drag Radials, and LT1 Edit. Ran 12.4@111.

Stock heads with all emission crap still intact. Passed IM240 emissions twice. Got 28mpg before the cam and 26mpg after on the highway. Pulled 324rwhp which is about 375 flywheel HP.

My Dad's 95 Comp TA had the exact same mods as mine but he went with the LT4 intake and LT4 heads and cat pipe. He pulled 369rwhp which is about 420 flywheel HP.

Both cars were dynoed right after each other so its a pretty good comparison of what the intake and heads can do on a LT1. FWIW, he ran 12.2@113 and he was a couple hundred pounds heavier than mine.

The LT1 is just as easy to mod as any small block and the results are probably better mod for mod also. The cost isn't going to be that much more, if any, for those mods than a small block.

Sorry so long....

MadMax350

Rob, the Optispark IS a distributor. The only thing that makes it different than most other distributors is its use of an optical trigger instead of magnetic. Perhaps you could be right about it getting a bad rap because of the earlier units but if that is the case why do I still see and hear about so many going bad, even on 97's? Besides that, just to maintain the stupid thing costs a lot of money and if you want to upgrade it you are automatically going to pay a lot more than you would if you had an L98's HEI.

Second of all not all LT1's came with the powdered metal rods. My buddy got his LT1 from a 94 Camaro and it had the old style X rods. While I have heard these are some of the best non-PM rods available stock, they are still not PM rods and are not as good.

As far as better flowing components I agree with you. However, there is a point you are going to reach that the stock stuff is simply not enough to make the power. I think the magic number for the LT1 is somewhere between 380 and 400hp. After that you better be ready to shell out some hard cash for trick porting or AFR heads or a nice LT4 heads and intake combo. Either way, you are looking at $1500-$2500 just to upgrade these components and for what? Another 100 HP or so. Contrast that with the $900 I spent on Trick flow heads, $900 for a Superram intake with edelbrock ported base, and $200 for a LT4 HOTCAM which all together gave my "L98" 380HP and 440TQ of dyno-tested power at the crank. Sure, you can get the same HP easily enough out of an LT1 but it is simply not going to have the TQ that my L98 does.

When it comes down to it, I think the best way to look at this debate is how heavy is your car and what tranny are you using... If you have a 3300lb car with a 6-speed manual than I definately say go with the LT1. If you have a 3600lb car and an automatic, I say the TQ from an L98 is unbeatible. Like I said before, it just depends what you want and how much money you are willing to spend.

I too am sorry, but the days of the LT1 are coming to a close. I know they are good engines and they were the first to pull the F-body ahead of the mustang after many years of shame but lets face it, everyone wants an LS1 and the aftermarket companies see this. There is already a vast selection of parts out there that will work with the L98 so I am sure there will be plenty still around in 10+ years. I honestly think that with the scramble to get products to the market for the LS1, the LT1 is going to be soon forgotten.

Hey, I hope I am wrong, but I am trying to be practical. I just don't see any incentive for companies to continue researching for and making parts for an engine that had a short life.

RobsWS6

Yes, it is a distributor. I was talking about a conventional distributor. You'll hear about it because nobody says anything when its working. Mine never had a problem. Neither of my parent's cars had a problem. The vented kits aren't terribly expensive, nor the entire unit. The non vented ones are twice the price though...ouch!

And you're probably right about the LT1 going away. Happens with every newer style engine. What little aftermarket the TPI had when the LT1 came out, dried up pretty quick. The LT1 has lost flavor to the LS1. If its any consideration, look at the turbo V6 for R&D. Aftermarket is still coming out with new stuff after all these years. Could be encouraging.

My car weighed in at 3650 with me in it. 6spd and 4.10 gears were a perfect match. Great gear spacing and great economy at the same time. Might not have the low end grunt of a TPI but whipped through the rpm band. But it made quite a bit at 2000 rpm to not bother.

Torque monster, I'll stick with my V6 That thing makes some incredible torque Need to dyno it just to see what its doing as I'm curious. But that's another thread....

90rocz

I've never remember putting down an LT1, all I'm saying is,"that for all of the "improvements" stock for stock, it only managed about a .4 improvement in ET(best case avg, heck it's only rated @30HP more.)...(I'm just trying to bring up the undeserved bad rep the TPI is getting.)
Now with that said, with all of the "improvements of the LS1, it too only managed about a .4 improvement...(I know results are varied but this is the average bests I'm seeing everywhere, believe me I'm seeing more slow ones than fast ones..I don't know if it's the gearing, drivers or what?..)

Ofcourse, ALL of this is just "moot points" once the mods start adding up...then it's up to who does his homework, and plans his combo out with every part accenting each other...
And Ultimately, "Speed costs money, How fast do you want to go?"

I read an article too somewhere that if an Opti' spends too much time over 6,000 rpm it can self destruct. But I'm no expert on them..

Rob, gears alone can make a huge difference...A Mustang guys' first mod.(you and your Dad's got some nice rides. )

MadMax, I gotta correct you on just one thing, "L98's especially '90-92 kept far ahead of the Mustangs..

96LT14u2Nv

LT1 for the cool factor of a swap and b/c u wont have to sink a ton of money into it right away. it is already fairly strong in stock form.

Kevin91Z

I'd spend $2500 to get another 100 horsepower out of my engine. That's not a bad power to money ratio.

But I think you have a lot more left in your combo. I was running a long runner TPI intake and aluminum L98 heads with an LT4 HOT cam and getting 318 RWHP and 419 RWTQ. That's close to 375 and 490 at the crank. I havent dynoed it yet since I put on the SLP fully siamesed runners, but I'm guessing it'll be in the 350 RWHP range.

http://para.noid.org/~thresher/dyno.jpg

RobWS6: The 90-92 TPI's have 9.75:1 compression, and I know the LT1's arent much over 10.3:1, so its not a full point more. However, the 87-89 TPI's were in the 9.3:1 range, so I figure you are talking about those.

RobsWS6

Gears got me .3 sec and no MPH increase. It was all in the 60' times. 2.0 vs 1.87

But it was the single mod that I loved the most. Better than the cam and anything else. Just made the car so much easier and fun to drive. 6th gear was actually useful under 65mph!

RobsWS6

Kevin,
Those numbers are great! But is that time in your sig with those numbers?

I dynoed 324/324 or something like that and ran 12.4@111 in the WS6. You should really be putting down much better numbers than that.

When the TTA was still on running on the stock stuff, I dynoed 318/455 at the rear wheels. I was running 12.1@111.

Just curious as that's where I would think your times would be at.

91 GTA Ramair2

Nice debate there of the LT-1 v.s. L-98.......

But I'm haveing Fun with my TBI. my 91 GTA had a 350 TBI,700r4,3/42's when i got it .....
it would Hold it's own.....
But when i put the 3.73's in it and up the TBI to the 670CFM Holley TB that I gained bunch more.

91GTA Ramair2,350TBI,700r4,3.73's,and295/50r16's.

Best run was a 14.86@95.78mph with the G-tech .
my 87 GTA L-98 350tpi,700r4,3.23 gear's,and 235/55r16's.

best run was 16.11@88.9mph.
on G-tech....

witch I'm Not sure if the time's are right no But i know when i raced the 2 car's against each other the 91 with the 350TBI walked all over the 87 GTA with the 350TPI.

But thats cool Cause i was a TBI fan anyway this juist Helpped that and it have Beaten a few LT-1's on the avenue.....
But we only ran 0-50mph......

I did beat an LS-1 0-20 But that was no real yippy skippy there.My problem with the 350TBI it i was out of go power at 4,750rpm's.

But the 350TPI seemed about Done at 4,300rpm's.

But i am sure my 406 Dual Duce TBI,will stay with an Ls-1 if not beat it. But you know third gen's and traction.......

540hp@6500rpm&580FTLBTORQUE@5,000rpm, my Traction in the 91 is going too be almost non. thats why i need to ditch the P295/50r16's for some 295/50D15 drag radail's..........
so if there is link anyone might have to that size drag radail that would be aswome...........


But as fare as the L-98 V.S. LT-1.......

I'd have to say l-98 it;'s a third gen kepp it third gen..... Don't Down play an LT-1 like that or visa versa.............
depending on your piont of view......