mrr23

and even still if you junkyard everything (and the carb works) your still getting only minimal gains switching. but anyways putting you on the ignore list now (ignoring the ignorant).

ZzBlackZz - to get away from these disbelievers go to www.fl-thirdgen.org or http://www.crossfire.homeip.net/

that way you can get answers to what you are looking for. there's nothing wrong with CFI. as a matter of fact we just took chevyhackers motor apart tonight. getting ready to put the heads, cam, and rockers on this week. pic here http://www.fl-thirdgen.org/forum3/vi...?p=18692#18692

1986MCSS

All i can say is if you are going to throw your money away, throw it my way. CFI is junk, plain and simple. If it is such a great system, why did gm change it after basically 2 years? (i know the intake was great) Oh by the way, GM high tech performance mag. Ran a 1989 Pontiac Firebird Formula, bone stock 305 TPI, and turned a 14.7 quarter mile, i would venture to say that 305 tpi, bone stock, is faster then your 350 CFI was stock.

mrr23

well opinions are like *******s. everyone has one. and seeing as this is your first post, yours stinks. if carbs are such a great thing, then why is there no factory vehicle with one anymore? if TPI was such a great thing, then why did it go away after 7 years? and if the LT1 was such a great thing, then why did it go away after 6 years? so what's your point?

Nitromethane

A 1992 TPI Camaro was faster than a 1988 TPI Camaro stock - whats your point? Ofcourse TPI is gonna be faster, do you really think GM are gonna turn around n say "Well, it'd be interesting to try a new fuel injection system but lets make all the cars from here on in slower".

I'm in the process of going tunnel-ram on my car - go try tuning one of those and tell me carbs are also way easier than crossfire. 2 Carbs vs. 2 Throttle Body's.

Greed4Speed

You still have yet to post some hard numbers as to how much cash your CFI mods would cost. instead you resort to name calling instead of being informative. Looks like noone can have a conflicting opinion than you on this topic and when they can back it up you resort to name calling. Very mature. All your credibility just flew out the window.

Nitromethane

I'd say its not so much having a conflicting opinion as it is that people who "hate" crossfire so much are so closed minded that they aren't open to the suggestion that maybe if they went n bought a ****ing crossfire car n played with it some that they might see its not as terrible as they might think! To say something doesnt suck and give it a shot to see what it can actually do is a far more open minded behavior than to anounce to the world that CFI sucks.

If I remember correctly, the original post was asking for help with his CROSSFIRE system, it never ceases to amaze me at how quick people are to jump at the chance to stir something up in a post that wasn't even directed at them. He was asking wether a carb would be a better route than a crossfire intake, all we have done is try to point out that although ultimately a carb may have the potential to out-perform a crossfire system, there are many things in a crossfire motor that make it pointless to switch to a carb setup. Like it has been said repeatedly in this thread, and all the other anti-crossfire threads, a carb is only part of an engine, every modification we have done to Chevyhacker's motor are identical to the modifications you would have to do to an identical carb motor. If at the end of your modifications, heads, cam, exhaust, headers, etc, you finally decide that you do want to switch to carb, perhaps because you don't have the means or intelligence to do any ECM programming, then go right ahead - but the intake is sitting right on top of the motor, so why spend $650 for a carb swap right off the bat that won't help you all that much, when you can do allll those other things FIRST, and get a much better gain, then decide at the very end wether you'd like to stick with CFI because you're happy with your 13's or low 14's, or if you in fact want to take the motor a notch up without any ECM related headaches and switch to a carb.

Are you really that narrow minded or inexperienced by the way of basic engine operation that you're going to tell me, that touching a crossfire motor is a waste of time?

This is not an issue of engine size, so I don't want to hear anything about upgrading to a 350. And if you were to switch to a 350 - the heads, intake, cam, everything interchanges, so there would still be no money wasted.

mrr23

and it's obvious you can't read either. in some of my posts is links to the car i am refering to. the only cost that is a waste of time in your opinion is the porting of the stock manifold and gaskets. all the other costs are the same exact costs you would incur on any other intake design for a fbody (exhaust, heads, cam, etc..) and my fuzzy math is supported. we've had this conversation over at thirdgen.org and everyone there opposing CFI lost in that one also. your are still losing this battle.

this one has the costs associated with the swap which is the real waste of time

http://www.thirdgen.org/techbb2/show...hreadid=190137

and another one with links to what has been done to the car and results

http://www.thirdgen.org/techbb2/show...hreadid=188702

now where's your proof of switching to carb made it faster? don't have one? what's taking so long? and you never had any credibility to begin with. greed your first post started out good. sticking up for the CFI. but then you degenerated. and i agree with you that having a TPI is a better starting platform. but the guy doesn't have one. and doesn't have a desire right now to swap to one or a carb. so do the right thing and say this is what you can do now that you can still use when you swap to something else. not tell him he just bought a junker and make him feel stupid. agreed? (back on ignore).

FyreLance

Emissions.

Nitromethane

They have 50 state legal carbs.

ZzBlacKzZ

well ive decided to just stick with the cfi for now, and i was reading chevyhackers "how to port your cfi intake." but, theres some things he doesnt explain, like what bits to use. im not going to lie, ive never ported a single thing in my life. so how do i start? what bits do i start with and finish with? or with this do you just use one bit? ive seen the pictures of his intake as he ported more and more of it, so im pretty sure i got down what spots to grind. any info would be apreciated, thanks.

ZzBlacKzZ

i forgot one thing. Is he porting the excact cfi intake off of a camaro, or is he using the intake from a corvette and putting it on his camaro?

mrr23

the porting bits he and i used are carbide bits for aluminum. the 4 pack cost me $180. i use an air grinder. a dremel will not do the trick here. yes it is a corvette one we ported. the only difference is there is balancing holes that are drilled between the runners.

ZzBlacKzZ

well i do have an air grinder. but the bits seem a little expensive. theres no cheaper bits that will grind aluminum?

ZzBlacKzZ

also, what shape bits did you guys use? sorry to go into soo much detail on the grinding process, i just dont want to mess anything up!

chevyhacker

I was able to cut the aluminum with my dremel, however i didn't have the carbide bits so they lasted about 3 mins each - I did not try carbide dremel bits since I called in the heavy guns

The manifold on the 83 Z28 is casting 14057017 and it has balancing holes. From my reading, the 83 & 84s had the balancing holes, although a flowbench doesn't really show much difference between them (ok, all you experts can come tell me that a flowbench doesn't tell the whole story...)

Anyway - my 82 vette has casting number 14031372 however I have not personally opened it, so I can't tell you if it has the balancing holes or not. My reading would lead me to believe it does not.

To my knowledge, the only difference in an f-body crossfire system and a vette crossfire system is the size of the injectors. The 350 injectors are approx 10% larger, but I don't know the exact numbers, so you'd need to research if you need specifics. The Crossfire Injection Forum will have all the details.

I forget all the details of this long post, but in case you haven't had the car on a scanner yet - i'd suggest making sure all your sensors are good, check the egr if keeping it, and keep all the vacuum hose fresh. Those little items go a long way toward a reliable vehicle.

Let me know if you want full size pics for any of my tech articles, or just want more detail.