the_chadster

I'm on my fourth 3rd gen, and have had this problem with atleast 2 of them. Now & then, I hit the key, and nothing happens at the starter. Wait 10-30 mins, and it starts. Doesn't matter if engine / starter is hot or cold. Guages will max out when I turn to the start position, like they normally do when it does start, which makes me think the problem is past the ign switch somewhere. I used to think this was a bad starter or selenoid (sp?), and would replace the starter and it would be fine for 6 months, then start doing it again. It gets progressively worse as time goes on, until it becomes unreliable to drive and I have to change the starter again. I've long passed the days of buying cheap starters, and only buy from Napa or GM / AC Delco, but it still happens. I've also tried changing the ign switch in my 90 Formula 350, and that didn't fix it. I've tried changing the neutral safety switch in my current 91 RS, still happening.

Since I've had this issue on a couple 3rd gens, and know of a friend that had the same issue, I'm assuming this a design flaw somewhere and that some of you out there have had the same issue. If only I could find one of you who knows the fix for it....

I'm about to go for the fusible link that goes to the starter, if nothing else just to eliminate that possibility, but it seems to me that the link would either work, or it wouldn't, not just sometimes.

I also think that since a new starter seems to help for a bit, that maybe as it ages, it requires more power, and that is causing the problem somewhere.

I had a friend with a 84 Z28 with this issue. He wired a toggle switch to the starter and never had the issue again. That is my last resort, as I want it fixed the right way.

Is there a relay in the circuit somewhere? Is there anything other than the fusible link between the starter and ign switch that I need to be looking at?

Any suggestions at all would be GREAT!

PS. Before you ask, the security light is not flashing or staying on when it doesn't start. Didn't on my other cars either

rclearyiii

I would change the battery cables out..pos and neg both. I had a similar problem a long time ago on a 3rd gen and turned out to be bad cables. Just a thought.

Bob

mpilarZ281992

Reminds me of the days in which I had to replace my starter a half dozen times. Once I installed a remote selenoid (located it by my battery), never had a problem again.

krisb410

Install a heat shield on the starter works, so I've read. I haven't had issues on mine, yet. But I would do the big 3 upgrade anyways.

tom2

Later cars with passkey security have a relay to disable the starter as part of the system. Be worth the time to check it. I think (?) it's located in the console under the shift plate toward the front.

BigBadLou

You need to figure out which part of the starter circuit is causing your problem.
This troubleshooting article should help: http://www.austinthirdgen.org/index.php?pid=38

The Starter Enable Relay (controlled by the VATS module), is in behind the left kick panel, by the door lock relay. That's one possible source of trouble.
You said you already replaced the shifter safety switch so that would eliminate that part (however, doublecheck it, you never know).

As for the design flaw, you are absolutely right. It's called a "Chevy".
No matter which one you have, it's hard to start.

Lou

96SSIndeed

i've heard the have problems with shorts in the steering column, my friend had an iroc that he had to move the steering wheel up, crank it, then could put the wheel where he wanted it.

Gtpguy

Sounds like VATs. 89+ What year cars had this problem. But in the 5 thirdgens I've owned, 1985 TA, 1988 T/A, 1989 Firebird, 1991 TA, and now my 1989 GTA, I haven't had a starting issue.

90rocz

Loose or corroded battery connections, are the first place to look.
People some how feel it's ok to leave them hand tight.
Ask yourself this. "Can I remove the cables from the battery w/o tools?"
If yes...THEY ARE TOO LOOSE!...
Use a volt meter and put one end on the bolt the other on the exposed wire. Are you reading over .4v...if yes your connection needs attention.
Whats your battery voltage while cranking? less than 9.6v but 12.6v before.
replace the battery.
If battery is over 3 years old...replace the battery...
If one of the battery cables are swollen anywhere or hot wile cranking, replace it.

carlosz28

the wires in my steering column was my problem. They short easy. I know that I have to replace the whole wire or wires. It was a monster and still is not right. Put a remote start on and your problems are gone. Also, back-up with a push start also. You won't need the ignition again. Just turn the key and push or use the remote start. I have used it for over 6yrs now.

Angelis83LT

Knowing the Year of the car would be helpful. Sounds like the VATS though like stated above. Gives people grief often, especially with our aging vehicles.

Z28SORR

Sounds like BS. My 84 is 25 years old, and has NEVER failed to start.

BigBadLou

The 1984 models were not equipped VATS (which tends to be the culprit often nowadays).
Like I posted before, by following the tech article, one can find the source of the no-start condition and correct it, instead of throwing extra parts (remote starts, VATS defeat boxes) and new starters and batteries at the problem. The problems is usually very simple, such as an old relay or a bad wire.

Lou

ws6transam

Check Neutral safety switch.
Check clutch safety switch.
Check ignition switch.
Check fusible links, they only last "so long".
Check condition of ground wires

X2 on what Lou has posted.

the_chadster

Thanks to all of you for your input. I had actually just parked it because I was frustrated with it and been driving my little Ranger around. I had found the diagram on Austin 3rd Gen ( I assume that's what Lou had posted) and I think I'm going to pull some panels out and start driving it again, and next time it doesn't start, get out the test light and start chasing it. I'm sure I will be in a hurry, or it will be pouring rain when it happens. From everything I've read, and past experiences, I'm betting it's VATS related or the fusible links. I'll let you all know how it turns out. It just sucks that it's intermittent because I won't really know that it's fixed until I can go for a long time with out a problem. Makes it hard to diagnose when I know I can go out there right now and it will start. Been driving it the last few days with no problems.

Question though, if it was VATS related, shouldn't my security light start flashing when it doesn't start?

And, in response to some of you:

It's not the battery / connections - They are all in good shape, and I know how a car acts with that problem, and this is different. I'm pretty sure that the starter is not getting the signal to start, vs not the power to do it with.

Heat shield / remote selenoid could make sense, since I swear a new starter fixes it for atleast 6 months, it just seems to me that since the car is all stock, the problem would be able to be fixed with stock components.

A remote switch is my last resort, but I bet it would fix it.