Well Joe, it sucks for me and alot of other people. I know of afew people who were going to buy one, but won't at two tons. It sucks for them.

Alot of fine people at GM, who have worked on the Camaro, who knew they'd never get Zeta down to the Camaro's target weight. It sucks for them.

GM, which spent $1 billion on Zeta, and all it gets for that investment is a 2 ton Camaro, with a short life-cycle and an underused plant. It sucks for them too.

For CAFE. Sucks.

For gas prices. Sucks.

There is plenty of suckage to go around.

So when are you buying yours?

 

I completely agree that the Camaro has lost it's way at the moment. I applaud all of those who fought so hard to make it happen, but this car, be it 3900 or 4000 lbs is not what a Camaro is supposed to be. I'm sure the new car will be impressive, but so was the Caprice based Impala SS...

Oh, one more thing. Every pound of extra weight on the car be it a base V6 or a Z will adversely affect MPG anf therefore in today's climate adversely affect the Camaro's chance of living a long life so when you ask what difference does 100 or 200 lbs make, well tha answer is it could mean alot...

 

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I agree with BF.


I feel faint.

 

Get used to that feeling.

 

~2 years. That's the soonest I'll be able to. I WILL have it. I honestly have no problems with 3900lbs...or 3899 There's a few people making it seem (from their posts) that this car is the anti-Camaro all because of a few hundred pounds. I'd disagree; but, respectfully, it's fallen on deaf ears up to this point -- me saying anything won't sway opinions.

I just don't see the issue, I guess.

 

so...tell me again...why is the Z/28 the top of the line above an SS now?

 

Anyone who denies that a 3900 - 4100 pound Camaro is heavy is not dealing with reality. I've lusted after this car for awhile, and owned Camaros, and Firebirds. I may or may not still buy a 2010 Camaro.

The 3rd gens were universally reviewed as too heavy at 3400lbs.

The reality is, they used to be dedicated F-bodies. Now the Camaro is a 2-door restyled G8, and the G8 is a family Camaro. The G8 is a great family sized car, but no review forgets to mention how heavy it is, and how well it handles its excess weight.

On the other hand, the auto magazines love the Challenger, and the Mustang GT500KR, excess weight and all. The Camaro will definitely be the best in this class, but we wanted a world-beater. Not just a two ton class beater.

GM has spent too much time and money refining pick-up trucks and SUV's for the last twenty years. Now it's hitting the fan, again. (Anyone here remember the early 1970's?, not GM ,Ford or Chrysler.) So now we have new cars with many compromises, because they were conceived when trucks were GM's cash cow. The cow died.

So now I need to decide...Wait at least 10 months to buy a Camaro, or go buy a Corvette, Infiniti G37S, or BMW 335i. The sad part is I love the new Camaro, but I'm just not as motivated to wait 10 months when I wanted to buy a new sports car months ago.

 

I will be buying mine the end of 09 as long as its competitively priced with the mustang. If a Base V8 M6 with low to average options tops out over 30kish then I will start shopping something else and see what my options are then. Weight is farther down on my list of things to check than others like price, options, modability, etc..

 

Some insiders now act like we're un-intelligent to be surprised by the Camaro's weight - simple physics, ZETA sealed the weight fate, etc.

Well Zeta also shows the future on pricing too. GM has been quoted saying the G8 GXP will cost "just under $40,000". The 2009 G8 GT's are more than $33,000 with premium and sports packs now that they raised the '09 price $1365.

Road & Track guesses the SS will be mid to upper $30,000's. So G8 GXP = Zeta w/ LS3, 6 speed Tremec, Brembos, tighter FE3 suspension. That means a Camaro SS comparibly equipped, could be "just under $40,000". That would be the final nail...Or are we hoping for some kind of magic, like we did for a tolerable weight of 3600 -3800lbs. ?

I sure hope I'm wrong...

 

So reality sucks, then. The fantasy world where you take a 3400 pound gen3 and add 100 hp, more airbags, stability control, stronger chassis, IRS, for no weight gain doesn't suck. It's what everyone wants.

 

So you didn't answer my question. Why a Z/28 if that's the heaviest one?

 

Not if it wants to compete with the Mustang.

 

I think the fate will depend a lot on if the MCE Mustang is anything like what the optimists say it will be... a 3500lb car with 400HP.

 

Isn't that what the optimists said this would be? Bottom line is that we're a very small segment and weight won't be an issue with most buyers. It'll still sell.

For Jason or any of the others....we've heard a lot about the V-6 car (or rather it's impressions), but not a whole lot about the performance of the V-8. I'd be curious to hear how that car stacks up against the V-6 in performance all around. That might take some of the focus off of the weight issue, or at least remove some of the anxiety that some of us have about the V-8 not handling / performing well.

 

The measured weights I've seen for the current Mustang are in the range of 3550 to 3600. Maybe if you get a base GT, it would come in at the 3500 number. The '10 model will have the same 4.6 that they use now, according to the thread on svtperformance. Then they go to the 5.0 in '11. Assuming the 5.0 weighs the same as the 4.6, torque is only going up from around 325 to 360, so there should be minimal added weight to handle that. But it will still have a solid axle, again according to svtperformance. If the solid axle is good enough (or preferred), and you're weight conscious for whatever reason, the Mustang will be the better choice.

If you go back through the archives on this site, you'll see some familiar names begging for an IRS. Those people will not be interested in the MCE Mustang, even if it has the weight they wanted in the '10 Camaro.

Btw, one advantage of getting horsepower from revs instead of capacity is that you don't need to design for more torque. That's how a four seat RX8 comes in a just over 3000 pounds -- it only has ~160 lb ft of torque and only 232 hp.