OK...part 2- what special edition Camaros would you like to see.....
05-18-2007, 12:55 PM
#31
Registered User
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: The Golden State
Posts: 13,711
OK Scott. How about something like this:
I'm going to go a different track here from the "drag-your-hairy-knuckles-on-the-ground" horsepower-overdosed, dragster that outruns an F14, and propose something that might be practical, cheap and easy to do, and would likely build up a bit of volume.
First off, I'd start off with the 300 horse..... V6. The 3.6 DI engine Cadillac's getting next year with it's claimed 272 ft/lbs of torque combined with a high enough axle ratio to match the performance of at least the current Mustang or LT1 Z28 and backed by a 6 (not 5) speed manual overdrive would be about right in the power side. No speed governor please!!!
Next, I'd include competition level suspension and handling package. Spring rates, bushings the works. Tires size should be whatever works the best, though 18" should be about right. Rims MUST be a 5 spoke design. Not the thick slab spokes like the Impala and Cobalt SS have, but more modern thinner spokes. Even the current Z06 rims would be perfect.
I'd also throw in some serious brakes. Even if you have to go aftermarket, these brakes should be able to repeatedly haul the car down like someone just threw an anchor over the side...multiple times...without fade. Calipers should be red. Brownie points for using the drilled discs from the Z06 and the word "Camaro" on the calipers!
The exterior shouldn't have any identifying or unique features or stripes. Spoilers should be optional. A single badge on each fender in place of the "Camaro" on the concept would be the only identifying item on the car besides the bowtie up front, which on this model, should be the "red outlined" bowtie that used to denote performance models instead of the big gold one. The red outlined bowtie combined with the Z06-styled rims with big crossdrilled discs and read "Camaro" calipers peering out would be all the exterior identification it would need!
On the interior, I'd use the "turned aluminum" style trim that was used on Trans Am interiors of the 1970s. The rest of the interior would be either black or light grey. Cloth interior would include either black seats with red seating surfaces or light grey with black seating surfaces. Leather optional, and solid color. Although I'd like to see the leather shifter ball of the 4th gen on this model, I'd want the old fashioned and visible chrome shifter below it. Hurst short throw would be ideal!
I'd keep the standard equiptment list to a minimum. I know asking for manual windows is probally a pipe dream, but I most certainly can live without the heated seats, exterior mirror defrost, or having to buy a navigation system just to get another option. On the flip side, the option list should be as large as possible. Anything you can order or have standard on the top Camaro (save powertrain) should be available.
I'd base price it as low as possible, ideally at least $2,000 below what today's base Mustang GT is going for ($22-23,000 would be in the ball park).
Finally, I'd name it something that clearly states it's mission as a competition vehicle. 1LE would be the obvious 1st choice, but I'd go a different direction since outside of the Camaro enthuisast, 1LE doesn't have any meaning or catchy-ness.
Options:
* Snagging the Grand Prix GXP's "Comp" moniker, ie: Camaro Comp 3.6 (my preference).
* Revive the "Spyder" name from the past, even "Monza" would work (Camaro Spyder or the Camaro with the "Monza" option package).
* Snag a page from the import playbook and call it "R" ("Camaro R" has a nice ring)
* Go back to the model that actually replaced the Camaro SS in the 70s ("Camaro LT").
Although most all other ideas here involve more horsepower or going back to the past, this idea actually address the prospect of pulling in people who look towards imports for their performance fix.
1. You have an technologically advanced, high powered V6. Most younger people are in to high tech and tend to shy away from pushrod V8s. With the power and expected economy of the 3.6 DI, it would be idea for attracting a younger crowd.
2. It would complement Camaro's advanced independent rear suspension. IRS has a reputation (derserved or not) of being superior in handling. Making a version that's affordable and competition level, having a high but not hogwild horsepower level that would be a way of attracting buyers who don't want a stripper, but don't want a percieved gas drinker either.
3. Finally, you'd have a cult car that would shift the image of Camaro and help it survive well into the future. Much like the 5.0 Mustang, you'd have a car that looks like the rest of the line until you see the bulging tires, the Z06-like rims and brakes, the chrome exhaust tips, and the "Comp 3.6" badging, or the "Spyder" or "Monza" script, or the "R" or "LT" logo on the front fenders just like the Mustang's "5.0" badge that needed no additional introduction.
No spoilers (which would encourage aftermarket personalization on one hand, and encourage those of us who prefer a bit of stealth on the other). Keeping standard equiptment minimal to keep pricing down, while allowing those who want to to load up on options. Bringing in the new buyers and enthusiasts who would be crucial to Camaro's survival, and having a bada** V6 that would eat the current Mustang on a handling course, soundly defeat almost anything in braking, and would at least match the current Mustang GT in acceleration and top speed. All the while coming in at $23K in base form.
I'd imagine it can be done for a $3K premium over a base V6 Camaro that's expected to be about $19K. Just the word of mouth would be worth it.
First off, I'd start off with the 300 horse..... V6. The 3.6 DI engine Cadillac's getting next year with it's claimed 272 ft/lbs of torque combined with a high enough axle ratio to match the performance of at least the current Mustang or LT1 Z28 and backed by a 6 (not 5) speed manual overdrive would be about right in the power side. No speed governor please!!!
Next, I'd include competition level suspension and handling package. Spring rates, bushings the works. Tires size should be whatever works the best, though 18" should be about right. Rims MUST be a 5 spoke design. Not the thick slab spokes like the Impala and Cobalt SS have, but more modern thinner spokes. Even the current Z06 rims would be perfect.
I'd also throw in some serious brakes. Even if you have to go aftermarket, these brakes should be able to repeatedly haul the car down like someone just threw an anchor over the side...multiple times...without fade. Calipers should be red. Brownie points for using the drilled discs from the Z06 and the word "Camaro" on the calipers!
The exterior shouldn't have any identifying or unique features or stripes. Spoilers should be optional. A single badge on each fender in place of the "Camaro" on the concept would be the only identifying item on the car besides the bowtie up front, which on this model, should be the "red outlined" bowtie that used to denote performance models instead of the big gold one. The red outlined bowtie combined with the Z06-styled rims with big crossdrilled discs and read "Camaro" calipers peering out would be all the exterior identification it would need!
On the interior, I'd use the "turned aluminum" style trim that was used on Trans Am interiors of the 1970s. The rest of the interior would be either black or light grey. Cloth interior would include either black seats with red seating surfaces or light grey with black seating surfaces. Leather optional, and solid color. Although I'd like to see the leather shifter ball of the 4th gen on this model, I'd want the old fashioned and visible chrome shifter below it. Hurst short throw would be ideal!
I'd keep the standard equiptment list to a minimum. I know asking for manual windows is probally a pipe dream, but I most certainly can live without the heated seats, exterior mirror defrost, or having to buy a navigation system just to get another option. On the flip side, the option list should be as large as possible. Anything you can order or have standard on the top Camaro (save powertrain) should be available.
I'd base price it as low as possible, ideally at least $2,000 below what today's base Mustang GT is going for ($22-23,000 would be in the ball park).
Finally, I'd name it something that clearly states it's mission as a competition vehicle. 1LE would be the obvious 1st choice, but I'd go a different direction since outside of the Camaro enthuisast, 1LE doesn't have any meaning or catchy-ness.
Options:
* Snagging the Grand Prix GXP's "Comp" moniker, ie: Camaro Comp 3.6 (my preference).
* Revive the "Spyder" name from the past, even "Monza" would work (Camaro Spyder or the Camaro with the "Monza" option package).
* Snag a page from the import playbook and call it "R" ("Camaro R" has a nice ring)
* Go back to the model that actually replaced the Camaro SS in the 70s ("Camaro LT").
Although most all other ideas here involve more horsepower or going back to the past, this idea actually address the prospect of pulling in people who look towards imports for their performance fix.
1. You have an technologically advanced, high powered V6. Most younger people are in to high tech and tend to shy away from pushrod V8s. With the power and expected economy of the 3.6 DI, it would be idea for attracting a younger crowd.
2. It would complement Camaro's advanced independent rear suspension. IRS has a reputation (derserved or not) of being superior in handling. Making a version that's affordable and competition level, having a high but not hogwild horsepower level that would be a way of attracting buyers who don't want a stripper, but don't want a percieved gas drinker either.
3. Finally, you'd have a cult car that would shift the image of Camaro and help it survive well into the future. Much like the 5.0 Mustang, you'd have a car that looks like the rest of the line until you see the bulging tires, the Z06-like rims and brakes, the chrome exhaust tips, and the "Comp 3.6" badging, or the "Spyder" or "Monza" script, or the "R" or "LT" logo on the front fenders just like the Mustang's "5.0" badge that needed no additional introduction.
No spoilers (which would encourage aftermarket personalization on one hand, and encourage those of us who prefer a bit of stealth on the other). Keeping standard equiptment minimal to keep pricing down, while allowing those who want to to load up on options. Bringing in the new buyers and enthusiasts who would be crucial to Camaro's survival, and having a bada** V6 that would eat the current Mustang on a handling course, soundly defeat almost anything in braking, and would at least match the current Mustang GT in acceleration and top speed. All the while coming in at $23K in base form.
I'd imagine it can be done for a $3K premium over a base V6 Camaro that's expected to be about $19K. Just the word of mouth would be worth it.
05-18-2007, 02:02 PM
#32
Registered User
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Orlando, Florida
Posts: 127
Except for anniversary cars, aren't special editions usually done near the end of a generation or at least after a car has been out a year or two? Maybe I'm just getting caught up on the meaning of special edition. With that said, I'm all for more packages and options.
I love the Penske color theme and am crazy over the 4th generation Camaro Penske car. For those that think the scheme might be too tacky, Corvette pulled off purple and yellow in 1998.
I'd definitely want to buy something with the Penske colors and I don't care what they call it as long as it isn't Rousch or some other name borrowed from Ford.
I love the Penske color theme and am crazy over the 4th generation Camaro Penske car. For those that think the scheme might be too tacky, Corvette pulled off purple and yellow in 1998.
I'd definitely want to buy something with the Penske colors and I don't care what they call it as long as it isn't Rousch or some other name borrowed from Ford.
05-18-2007, 02:19 PM
#34
Lounge Moderator
Join Date: Aug 1999
Location: Mi Scusi!
Posts: 360
I think a short-run collaboration with Orange County Choppers and/or the guys on Miami Ink would be pretty awesome. Throaty exhaust, more chrome than normal, and unique graphics that you won't see on other Camaros.
I'll echo the nod to something tied in with pride in the USA. A Camaro "Patriot Edition" has a nice ring to it.
And for some reason, just a package called "Black" is striking a chord with me. Something that reminds me of the Camaro in better off dead...only offered in one color, different custom gauge-set, unique chrome accents and some power upgrades. Maybe even only available with a single high-performance engine so it gains a notorious reputation. To where anytime someone races a "Black" and talks to friends about it, ears immediately perk up and respect is given.
I'll echo the nod to something tied in with pride in the USA. A Camaro "Patriot Edition" has a nice ring to it.
And for some reason, just a package called "Black" is striking a chord with me. Something that reminds me of the Camaro in better off dead...only offered in one color, different custom gauge-set, unique chrome accents and some power upgrades. Maybe even only available with a single high-performance engine so it gains a notorious reputation. To where anytime someone races a "Black" and talks to friends about it, ears immediately perk up and respect is given.
05-18-2007, 03:10 PM
#36
Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: San Diego, CA
Posts: 1,193
Why not team up with one of the big name designers (Foose etc) or a big name company in the youth market (Forza etc) and have them do a special edition? Try and pull in some new market that doesn't know the ins and outs of camaro history but is very desierable and lucrative. (Kind of like Ford's Harley Davidson Edition)
Another thing I always thought would be interesting and create some good buzz would be to have "secret option codes" kind of like COPO but for the everyday man. Maybe select dealers or advertizing only through gureilla methods. Make a "secret" option that requires knowledge or research to get ahold of. People want to own or purchase something they feel is unique or special. The idea that it is limited and could one day be "valuable" would be enough buzz for limited production.
Another thing I always thought would be interesting and create some good buzz would be to have "secret option codes" kind of like COPO but for the everyday man. Maybe select dealers or advertizing only through gureilla methods. Make a "secret" option that requires knowledge or research to get ahold of. People want to own or purchase something they feel is unique or special. The idea that it is limited and could one day be "valuable" would be enough buzz for limited production.
05-18-2007, 03:53 PM
#37
Registered User
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: Orlando, FL USA
Posts: 1,232
I agree with Guy about the upgraded V6 package. The Y87 package in the 4th gens wasnt enough. Nor was it really known about. Look at Ford's Pony package on the Mustang V6's. It sells like crazy.
A hopped up V6 motor, some unigue badging, plus some suspension and powertrain upgrades would make an inexpensive (low 20k) powerful Camaro. If you can make it forced induction, even better. Turbocharged? Better yet. And before some start screaming about rice, thats not the direction Im talking. A powerful, forced induction Camaro thats attainable (talking the 20k's here) would appeal to the younger generation and tuner crowds and bring in a whole bunch of new Camaro enthusiasts.
I love V8's, but not everyone who wants a performance coupe is gonna shell out at least 30k to get one or even more to get the uber badass "gotta have" model. Also the more customers you appeal to and get into a Camaro, chances are (if the experience was good) when they need a truck or family car they'll look Chevy's direction first.
A hopped up V6 motor, some unigue badging, plus some suspension and powertrain upgrades would make an inexpensive (low 20k) powerful Camaro. If you can make it forced induction, even better. Turbocharged? Better yet. And before some start screaming about rice, thats not the direction Im talking. A powerful, forced induction Camaro thats attainable (talking the 20k's here) would appeal to the younger generation and tuner crowds and bring in a whole bunch of new Camaro enthusiasts.
I love V8's, but not everyone who wants a performance coupe is gonna shell out at least 30k to get one or even more to get the uber badass "gotta have" model. Also the more customers you appeal to and get into a Camaro, chances are (if the experience was good) when they need a truck or family car they'll look Chevy's direction first.
05-18-2007, 05:58 PM
#38
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Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: At car shows and cruise nights!
Posts: 3,647
I wanna see SS's and Z28's with correct striping like the 1st Gens. I'd like to see a limited Sunoco Z28, a ZL1, (with 427) and I guess Yenko isn't possible?? If by some chance down the line there is an IROC-Z, just let it have characteristics of the originals. (and better handling, etc.) Try to get us hideaways for the RS.
What I really wanna see is a different grill, spoiler, mirrors, and gauges mostly but I guess that's not really the topic.
What I really wanna see is a different grill, spoiler, mirrors, and gauges mostly but I guess that's not really the topic.
05-18-2007, 08:00 PM
#40
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Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: pa
Posts: 1,991
stripper- manual windows and door locks, radio delete, more fiberglass parts (dont know if hood,trunk,fenders and doors are already but should be) air sucking hood maybe a cowl that opens like the old chevelle's, 373's-410's 6 speed auto, solid rearend call it the "friday night edition" afer the street racers
05-18-2007, 11:34 PM
#41
Registered User
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: St. Louis, MO
Posts: 149
1. Pay homage to the Sunoco car in conjunction with the 1LE RPO code.
2. Do NOT build a "in house" ZL1, leave that to GMMG
3. New Pace Car with reference to the '67 (since this could not be done on a 4th gen) or something completely new
2. Do NOT build a "in house" ZL1, leave that to GMMG
3. New Pace Car with reference to the '67 (since this could not be done on a 4th gen) or something completely new
05-19-2007, 08:18 AM
#44
Registered User
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Worcester, MA
Posts: 116
The Judge, Boss, King of the Road...these names need no further explanation. Everyone knows they're looking at a mean machine. Camaro needs a muscle-car moniker like those listed above. So even Joe Nobody sees the car and goes "oh man." I just can't think of a word or phrase to match. This might be an idea that happens after a couple years of production, like the Judge.
05-19-2007, 08:24 AM
#45
Registered User
Join Date: Feb 1999
Location: London, Ontario, Canada
Posts: 61
Another thing I always thought would be interesting and create some good buzz would be to have "secret option codes" kind of like COPO but for the everyday man. Maybe select dealers or advertizing only through gureilla methods. Make a "secret" option that requires knowledge or research to get ahold of. People want to own or purchase something they feel is unique or special. The idea that it is limited and could one day be "valuable" would be enough buzz for limited production.
Last edited by 96ZED28; 05-20-2007 at 07:48 AM.