NEWS: Mark LaNeve: Camaro won't be positioned as a muscle car
03-25-2008 | 11:45 AM
#76
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Posts: 619
i seriously doubt it this time around.
03-25-2008 | 11:47 AM
#77
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Posts: 1,958
From: Kansas City, MO
03-25-2008 | 01:24 PM
#78
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Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 574
From: Richmond, TX
L76 is 360 horsepower.
Ford battled the base 275 horsepower Z28 with a 225 horsepower GT and the 305 horsepower Z28 with a 260 horsepower GT.
Ford has tended to be conservative with their entry V8s once they got into the OHC era. I expect the 2010 GT to be around 350 or 360 horses. So it will be on par with an entry V8 Camaro. No, I do not expect a 400 horse Mustang as the lowest level V8 offering.
Ford battled the base 275 horsepower Z28 with a 225 horsepower GT and the 305 horsepower Z28 with a 260 horsepower GT.
Ford has tended to be conservative with their entry V8s once they got into the OHC era. I expect the 2010 GT to be around 350 or 360 horses. So it will be on par with an entry V8 Camaro. No, I do not expect a 400 horse Mustang as the lowest level V8 offering.
I would say you've "formulated" a thinking in your own head that doesn't exist at Ford. There are far simpler explanations for the the hp gap than "that's the way Ford likes it."
First off, they didn't have an engine. From 96-02 the SOHC and DOHC 4.6 was it. And the DOHC was the Cobra engine. The 5.4 which came out in '97 won't fit into the SN95.
When Ford finally develops the SC DOHC 4.6 for the '03 Cobra, which could have allowed them to drop the NA DOHC into the GT, GM decides to quit. So why bother upping the GT? I wouldn't.
Things are quite different today. Ford knows what the competition is. A 380hp Challenger and a 375-400hp Camaro. And they have the engines to compete.
Ford sent out an interesting survey to current GT owners.
Engine Options are the base 300hp V8
a 370hp 5.0L
and the twinforce 370hp TTV6
Guess which won?
03-25-2008 | 01:42 PM
#80
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Posts: 13,711
From: The Golden State
Great post Guion, except for this part.
A 300 horse Hyundai isn't going to be undercutting the 2010-2011 stang. That car will have a 400+ hp DI 5.0 that gets better mileage than the current 4.6 and it'll priced under $30K.
GM better understand that the overweight overpriced gas hog Challenger isn't the real competition.
A 300 horse Hyundai isn't going to be undercutting the 2010-2011 stang. That car will have a 400+ hp DI 5.0 that gets better mileage than the current 4.6 and it'll priced under $30K.
GM better understand that the overweight overpriced gas hog Challenger isn't the real competition.
The Challenger R/T will have a 5.7 Hemi that will get better fuel economy than the current Hemi in the Charger. The V6 Challenger will have 250 horses and is rated at 25 mpg on the highway.
The prices on the Challenger are going to be surprisingly low. You're making the mistake of basing the "overpriced" label on the SRT8.
I am not saying that there will be a base Camaro (non Z28 or SS) with a V8. I'm saying that there will be:
Camaro (3.6 only available engine)
Camaro SS SS (L76?) this would be the "base" V8 in that the sense that it would be the entry level V8 - the cheapest available V8 Camaro. The "Base" V8 vs. the upgraded V8 the Z28 would offer.
Camaro Z28 (LS3?)
Camaro (3.6 only available engine)
Camaro SS SS (L76?) this would be the "base" V8 in that the sense that it would be the entry level V8 - the cheapest available V8 Camaro. The "Base" V8 vs. the upgraded V8 the Z28 would offer.
Camaro Z28 (LS3?)
Don't doubt that Ford could make a 350 horse GT run with a 400 horse Camaro, at least in the benchmarks car mags and their readers hold near and dear: 0-60 and the quarter mile.
You didn't pay a Corvette price for a 4th gen Camaro, did ya?
03-25-2008 | 01:58 PM
#82
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From: Kansas City, MO
03-25-2008 | 02:07 PM
#83
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From: Kansas City, MO
That's why I had the question mark. The point I was trying to make wasn't really the exact engines as much as 6, hot V8, Hotter V8, with the latter two not available except in SS/Z28 in whatever level and combo that ends up being. I'm assuming SS will be middle and Z28 will be the "special" car. Which is the way it should be. So is jg95 onto something? I'm guessing his thinking is 3.6, LS3, LS9.
03-25-2008 | 02:08 PM
#84
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Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 574
From: Richmond, TX
I notice you're no longer talking about a 325-350hp GT, either.
And never promise more than you can deliver. The new GT will deliver at least 370. And I'm sticking with 400, given the competition and the insiders over on the Ford sites.
And never promise more than you can deliver. The new GT will deliver at least 370. And I'm sticking with 400, given the competition and the insiders over on the Ford sites.
03-25-2008 | 02:16 PM
#86
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Posts: 1,958
From: Kansas City, MO
I said that everything that I had seen in the blogs and car mags had speculated a 325-350 horse 5.0. I then said that I expected we'd end up with 350-360 horses in the GT.
I really hope you're right and that Ford blows my mind on this one, I really do.
I really hope you're right and that Ford blows my mind on this one, I really do.
03-25-2008 | 02:23 PM
#87
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Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 574
From: Richmond, TX
The 300 horse Hyundai coupe will be priced significantly below the price of the current Mustang GT, therefore undercutting it's price.
The Challenger R/T will have a 5.7 Hemi that will get better fuel economy than the current Hemi in the Charger. The V6 Challenger will have 250 horses and is rated at 25 mpg on the highway.
The prices on the Challenger are going to be surprisingly low. You're making the mistake of basing the "overpriced" label on the SRT8.
The Challenger R/T will have a 5.7 Hemi that will get better fuel economy than the current Hemi in the Charger. The V6 Challenger will have 250 horses and is rated at 25 mpg on the highway.
The prices on the Challenger are going to be surprisingly low. You're making the mistake of basing the "overpriced" label on the SRT8.
The Challenger R/T is going to around $30K with 380hp. The Dodge trucks with the MDS still have the worst mileage of the group. Only the Titan is worse. And the Challenger will outweigh the Camaro and stang by at least 350lbs. So go ahead and take out the overpriced part.
L76 will not be in the new Camaro.
All the more reason to accept that the next stang GT will be around 400hp
Ford is great with gearing. The current 300 horse Mustang GT accelerates like an 340 horse LS1 Z28 up to about a quarter mile.
Don't doubt that Ford could make a 350 horse GT run with a 400 horse Camaro, at least in the benchmarks car mags and their readers hold near and dear: 0-60 and the quarter mile.
Don't doubt that Ford could make a 350 horse GT run with a 400 horse Camaro, at least in the benchmarks car mags and their readers hold near and dear: 0-60 and the quarter mile.
If they had built the '03 Cobra in '99, you would have seen a 300hp DOHC GT for the last few years of the Camaro.
03-25-2008 | 03:24 PM
#89
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Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 1,011
I hope ford does bring the guns this time. Though I am not really a Mustang fan, I and every other pony car fan owes Ford a HUGE debt of gratitude for keeping the pony car alive. Plus, if ford gets serious about high horsepower, efficient v-8 Mustang, chances are good that GM will as well, and keep the Camaro going strong! it might also force Chrysler to reduce weight on the Chally in upcoming generations.
