what to expect RWHP??

Need advice but not sure what to expect out of current set up?? I have a 383 lt1,8:1 CR,afr 210 RR,LT4 intake,kooks LT,AS&m TB,S-trim w/2.75 blower pulley,6.6 crank pulley,vortec aftercooler,fuel system up grades,M6 trans,bailey coil,cc306 but I plan on swapping it. Not sure with what cam so any help on that would be appreciated.Possible n02 if im not happy w/ RWHP I planned on YSI but seems to expensive after I've spent 25,000 so far. never thought it would be so F...ing expensive. Any guess at RWHP would help me decide what i need to be feared on street.

im gonna say 560 on a mustang dyno and 610 on a dynojet

Need advice but not sure what to expect out of current set up?? I have a 383 lt1,8:1 CR,afr 210 RR,LT4 intake,kooks LT,AS&m TB,S-trim w/2.75 blower pulley,6.6 crank pulley,vortec aftercooler,fuel system up grades,M6 trans,bailey coil,cc306 but I plan on swapping it. Not sure with what cam so any help on that would be appreciated.Possible n02 if im not happy w/ RWHP I planned on YSI but seems to expensive after I've spent 25,000 so far. never thought it would be so F...ing expensive. Any guess at RWHP would help me decide what i need to be feared on street.

How much boost? We kinda need to know that..:p

Well im not sure. What ever s-trim maxed out is. I think any where from 12-14psi But not sure what to expect with all the mods. and i don't think i have the right cam in it? any opinions on a cam? i also still don't have brad brand tube.

The S-Trim seems to be the weak link. With the setup I would expect to see 550-600 RWHP (thats with the S-trim maxed). With a T-Trim maxed I would say an additional 150 RWHP or so.

What Call911 said! That S-Trim is gonna kill you. Its gonna have to run well past it's max efficency just to supply that thing and it still won't be enough. To be honest, i'd be suprised if you make 10 to 12psi. The S just won't supply enough cfm for a stroker setup like yours. You need at least a T-trim on that setup, although a Y would be sweet. You'll be able to make more boost and without having to push the blowers max rpm limit too. I'd guess somewhere between 520 to 550rwhp just because of the S-trim and assuming your probably currently running somewhere between 6 and 10psi with that pulley combo.

Ken R.

Well at that point should i just spray a 200 shoot?
I'm thinking a 200 shoot set up right $1,600.
VS
Ysi+aftercooler+ass load of me fabbing + possible snout failure+$4,000
It's mainly for street some drag maybe 4 times a summer

Call911 are you saying i could make 800 RWHP with T trim?
and if so is that the best route? Is my vortec after cooler good enough for T-trim to keep cost under $2,000.

Well at that point should i just spray a 200 shoot?
I'm thinking a 200 shoot set up right $1,600.
VS
Ysi+aftercooler+ass load of me fabbing + possible snout failure+$4,000
It's mainly for street some drag maybe 4 times a summer

Call911 are you saying i could make 800 RWHP with T trim?
and if so is that the best route? Is my vortec after cooler good enough for T-trim to keep cost under $2,000.

To be honest, nitrous is the cheepest HP adder out there. Hands down even if you fill the bottle all the time and have a top notch N20 setup.

800 RWHP is a pretty far reach even for a T-trim. I would say that the T-Trim will more likely put you in the 700-750 range at best. The aftercooler will work fine as well with either the S or T Trim. Now you could always have the T-Trim maxed out, and then spray it on top of that. But the cheepest way to get you to 800 RWHP will be the setup you were going to run + a LOT of Nitrous.

Before I went the Forced Induction route, I contemplated a top notch direct port Nitrous system from Nitrous Express. It would have cost me around $3,000 all together with the top notch components (remote bottle opener, bottle heater, window switch, ect.). In the end, I decided to go with a blower setup instead, just because I really always wanted one. The difference price wise was HUGE, as I ended up spending a good $6,000+ just in the blower and the supporting mods like dual fuel pumps, intercooler, injectors, tune, ect. (not to mention rebuilding my motor for the boost which ended up costing me $12,000)

Well sounds like T-trim will do the trick.
I think 700 rwhp should be good enough for street. Car's been off road since 2003 so i can't miss another summer. I'll keep eye out for T-trim, unless some one can tell me why i need a YSI instead.

It all depends on what you are looking for. If you truely will be happy with 700 or so RWHP, then the T-Trim maxed out should do it. However, it always seems like (and I am one of them as well) when you have your T-Trim (or in my case D1SC) maxed out, you always wish you would have upgraded to the YSi or the F1.

Actually, I will be tweaking mine this year with some added timing thanks to a methanol injection kit, so I will probably be at the HP level I was looking for originally (650 RWHP or so). My personall plan was to have a HP level that was on the verge of being too much for my car to accept traction wise. At 590 RWHP, it still hooks great, so I ideally am looking for another 70 RWHP or so that the timing/meth kit will give me.

I have seen guys run around with 800+RWHP, and they have the bragging rights when it comes to dyno days, but whenever they get into a race on the street, or try to get a good time at the track, they almost always get smoked by some 400 RWHP car that is hooking up while they are spinning their tires at 75 MPH.

It all depends on what you are looking for. If you truely will be happy with 700 or so RWHP, then the T-Trim maxed out should do it. However, it always seems like (and I am one of them as well) when you have your T-Trim (or in my case D1SC) maxed out, you always wish you would have upgraded to the YSi or the F1.

Actually, I will be tweaking mine this year with some added timing thanks to a methanol injection kit, so I will probably be at the HP level I was looking for originally (650 RWHP or so). My personall plan was to have a HP level that was on the verge of being too much for my car to accept traction wise. At 590 RWHP, it still hooks great, so I ideally am looking for another 70 RWHP or so that the timing/meth kit will give me.

I have seen guys run around with 800+RWHP, and they have the bragging rights when it comes to dyno days, but whenever they get into a race on the street, or try to get a good time at the track, they almost always get smoked by some 400 RWHP car that is hooking up while they are spinning their tires at 75 MPH.
you must be talking about STS cars or supras. A properly set up lt1 with 800rwhp low 9s all day long

Well at that point should i just spray a 200 shoot?
I'm thinking a 200 shoot set up right $1,600.
VS
Ysi+aftercooler+ass load of me fabbing + possible snout failure+$4,000
It's mainly for street some drag maybe 4 times a summer

Call911 are you saying i could make 800 RWHP with T trim?
and if so is that the best route? Is my vortec after cooler good enough for T-trim to keep cost under $2,000.

snout failure is possible with any blower.
if you want to make 800rwhp, there should be no doubt in your mind about the YSI. IF you want to make 700rwhp you should try T trim but its not guranteed you still make 700rwhp even with it maxed out. I couldnt make 700 with the D1 but the car traped into 9s i just didnt have the right trans/rear to run it.

you must be talking about STS cars or supras. A properly set up lt1 with 800rwhp low 9s all day long

Umm.... Yeah.... I have seen 800+ RWHP Supra's, as well as F-bodies and Mustangs, and even with slicks on them, most of them will rip the tires loose even at speeds almost in the triple digits.

I have pretty much the complete BMR/Hotchkiss/UMI catologs underneath my car for suspension, hence why I still have decent traction at almost 600 RWHP. I know though that I am almost on the edge of loosing traction like the others though.

Heck, I know plenty of guys with 450 RWHP that don't have any drag suspension items done, and they spin almost as bad as some of the higher HP ones.

Bottom line is, anything with the 800+ RWHP level that has a manual transmission, unless the car is setup for an all out drag car, will most likely be spinning all over the place and not be able to get any good times at the track, let alone win a race vs someone with a few hundred less RWHP that hooks up in every gear.

Umm.... Yeah.... I have seen 800+ RWHP Supra's, as well as F-bodies and Mustangs, and even with slicks on them, most of them will rip the tires loose even at speeds almost in the triple digits.

I have pretty much the complete BMR/Hotchkiss/UMI catologs underneath my car for suspension, hence why I still have decent traction at almost 600 RWHP. I know though that I am almost on the edge of loosing traction like the others though.

Heck, I know plenty of guys with 450 RWHP that don't have any drag suspension items done, and they spin almost as bad as some of the higher HP ones.

Bottom line is, anything with the 800+ RWHP level that has a manual transmission, unless the car is setup for an all out drag car, will most likely be spinning all over the place and not be able to get any good times at the track, let alone win a race vs someone with a few hundred less RWHP that hooks up in every gear.

which 800rwhp have you seen i'm just cerious, cuz in lt1 world you can count them on by hand and ls1 is a different story but i'm still cerious. i Hooked with mid 600rwhp on bone stock suspension, stick,10 bolt. Just have to take it easy on the launch and have a decent tire that will hook. But if you are driving on the street i guess you should just shoot for 450rwhp if you want to hook.

which 800rwhp have you seen i'm just cerious, cuz in lt1 world you can count them on by hand and ls1 is a different story but i'm still cerious. i Hooked with mid 600rwhp on bone stock suspension, stick,10 bolt. Just have to take it easy on the launch and have a decent tire that will hook. But if you are driving on the street i guess you should just shoot for 450rwhp if you want to hook.

how did u not manage to hit over 700 with a maxed out D1? i am guessing Auto tranny with and maybe a 9inch?

I hit 640 with a 7.65/4.20 pully combo which neted me 14psi without the intake pipe. that was on stock ported heads. Now i am running AFR 227 heads and 7.65/3.70 pully and seeing 15psi with the intake. I am hoping to be well into 700s with the new combo. The goal is to hit 800 rwhp, i still can step down to 3.4 pully if needed.

how did u not manage to hit over 700 with a maxed out D1? i am guessing Auto tranny with and maybe a 9inch?

I hit 640 with a 7.65/4.20 pully combo which neted me 14psi without the intake pipe. that was on stock ported heads. Now i am running AFR 227 heads and 7.65/3.70 pully and seeing 15psi with the intake. I am hoping to be well into 700s with the new combo. The goal is to hit 800 rwhp, i still can step down to 3.4 pully if needed.

how many lt1s have been in the 9s with d1 alone? i know of 2 maybe. I should of hit it when i still had it but i didnt. I dont know what dyno you all using but i dynoed on a AWD dynojet 640rwhp on a 7.65/34 combo. With no intake pipe and through a restrictive twin intercoolers. I highly doubt you will hit 800rwhp on blower alone but what do i know. if you hit 800rwhp you should be in the low 9s high 8s

To be honest i want to be able to spin wheels at high speeds W/315 on 17'' with out having to slip the clutch. I know it sound stupid but i like getting side ways some times. I plan on another set of drag slick for track, and when looking for race on street.So maybe i should drive w/s-trim for now and skip T-trim for YSI. I really don't know what 550-600 feels like.I've been fighting with rear main leak so i haven't run blower yet.I'm in process of taking motor out for my new 1pc rear main crower crankshaft to replace the 2pc the builder put in it.And ever time i'm on this web site i think don't have enough power.

which 800rwhp have you seen i'm just cerious, cuz in lt1 world you can count them on by hand and ls1 is a different story but i'm still cerious. i Hooked with mid 600rwhp on bone stock suspension, stick,10 bolt. Just have to take it easy on the launch and have a decent tire that will hook. But if you are driving on the street i guess you should just shoot for 450rwhp if you want to hook.

I have seen/ridden in 1 Supra single turbo that dyno'd at 858 RWHP, a Supercharged Saleen with more than 1,000 RWHP, a juiced and blown fox body mustang with 850+ RWHP, and 3 different F-bodies with more than 800 RWHP. All yeild the same results (with the exception of the fox body, since it was an all out drag car), they were dyno queens that couldn't hook worth a sh*t on both the street and the track. The Saleen would leave black lines with the slicks on in 4th gear at over 100 MPH! I'm not saying you can't hook at power levels this high, I am mearly saying it's not easy to do so, and that most will show serious traction issues even with lots of suspension mods and good tires with breeching the 800+ RWHP mark.
how did u not manage to hit over 700 with a maxed out D1? i am guessing Auto tranny with and maybe a 9inch?

I hit 640 with a 7.65/4.20 pully combo which neted me 14psi without the intake pipe. that was on stock ported heads. Now i am running AFR 227 heads and 7.65/3.70 pully and seeing 15psi with the intake. I am hoping to be well into 700s with the new combo. The goal is to hit 800 rwhp, i still can step down to 3.4 pully if needed.


I am running a 7.65 crank pulley and a 3.40 blower pulley with my D1SC combo, and I only see 15.3#'s of boost :( . I have seen guys pull 18#'s before, and heard of others claiming 20#'s. I know with my particular combo of running AFR 180 heads, along with a gargantuan cam, and a big FMIC, all with the small plastic inlet tube from ATI is why I don't see the higher numbers. This year I will be swapping to a custom fabbed inlet tube, and using some methanol to add some timing. I am guessing it will net me at least another 50 RWHP or so. It does get difficult to press the D1 past 16#'s of boost, but with a good set of heads that you have, and a good cam, along with no intercooler will help your boost levels.

Back to the original poster here, like I said before, it totally depends on what you want. If you will be content with 700-750 RWHP, then I believe you can attain that with maxing out the T-Trim, or worst case scenareo, adding a little spray to it. Other than the freak of nature LittleRedZ, I seriously doubt you will hook up at this attained HP level. I have just seen too much evidence first hand that leads me to believe otherwise. It is true that you could just get the YSi blower and set it at a mild level of boost for it and probably attain the same HP level.

call911 is right, with the power level in my sig, through a 6 speed and 315 nitto DR's, i can roll on 80mph 4th gear and spin the tires...granted ive walked over 400rwhp cars while doing so...but it is a scary ride...btw, all stock suspension, cause im broke and in college:D :D

i can nail 2nd and it wont spin at all....315 nittos, LCA, Moser 12 bolt (3.73s)and a TQ ARM are my suspension mods.

i can nail 2nd and it wont spin at all....315 nittos, LCA, Moser 12 bolt (3.73s)and a TQ ARM are my suspension mods.

mm i still say we put my motor in your car...

i can nail 2nd and it wont spin at all....315 nittos, LCA, Moser 12 bolt (3.73s)and a TQ ARM are my suspension mods.

I can also nail 2nd (as long as it starts at a low RPM) and not have it break loose with my Nittor DR 275's. But again, I have pretty much every suspension mod done on my car to help it hook up. But get it on a cold day, or a hit at 3,000 RPM or above, and the tires will break loose as the boost builds quickly even on my setup.

Thats pretty much what I am talking about when I said I wanted to keep something on the "edge" of breaking the tires loose. I can barely fineagle my setup as is and not break it loose too bad even while attaining WOT. I figure I've only got about another 50 RWHP or so, before its just too much to keep up with. This is just my personal goal. Others (such as the original poster of this thread) may want to slip and slide at 75 MPH, it's just not what I am looking to do as I'd rather be able to use all the ponies I have rather than having all that extra power be useless in a race by spinning.

So does any one have an idea of what cam i should run? I'm going to stick w/s-trim for now till i get bored of it then most likely get more boost. Haven't decided witch blower. And while my motor is apart i'm getting pistons coated in case i shoot no2.So in other words i more confused than a stripper. I've got the cc306 and from what I've read it's going to bleed off boost,not what i need especially when i don't have enough to begin with.

one thing you should remember is that the ys1 is alot peakier than the t-trim, for a street setup, i feel the t-trim is better suited. with a ysi, youll have less low end due to the step up ratio, then all the sudden you get blasted up top with power.

also, if youre looking for an aftercooler kit for that s-trim, ive got one ill let go cheap

So does any one have an idea of what cam i should run? I'm going to stick w/s-trim for now till i get bored of it then most likely get more boost. Haven't decided witch blower. And while my motor is apart i'm getting pistons coated in case i shoot no2.So in other words i more confused than a stripper. I've got the cc306 and from what I've read it's going to bleed off boost,not what i need especially when i don't have enough to begin with.

Look man, its simple. This is what it breakes down to,

450-550 RWHP range = S-Trim
550-700 RWHP range = T-Trim
700+ RWHP = YSi
(all figured with the aftercooler)

If you want to tweak the numbers a little, you can add nitrous, or better yet, methanol.

As far as the cam goes, you want a good one for your setup. A CC306 will do fine on either the S or T Trim, but as mentioned on a YSi setup, the boost really doesn't come on until later, and the CC306 doesn't really start making power until up top either, so it may not be the best choice of cam for you then. Basically you want something to give you power until the boost levels increase enough to give you power from the blower. It seems to me that most mid range cams are ideal for this, and not ones such as the GM847 or the CC306. On the other hand, my car is setup with a large cam, and it is perfect for me because it gives my car a chance to build some MPH before the power really comes on, and by that point, I am moving fast enough that traction is still good.

One other consideration is to go with a Procharger. I know the F-1 builds good power down low compared to the YSi that makes it all up top.

Any choice you make, just be sure to get a good set of forged pistons, with a low CR. I would reccomend something around 8.5-1 to 9-1.

If you want an idea of the power curve a big cam and a T-Trim equivilant (D1SC) will look like on the dyno, here's a video of my car when it got tuned.
I have a custom camshaft, 244/254 @ .050, .578/.578 lift, 114* LSA

http://thumbs.vidiac.com/5d911306-59a8-4540-8b66-982b00ebf51d.jpg (http://videos.camaroz28.com/video/5d911306-59a8-4540-8b66-982b00ebf51d.htm)Click here to see Video (http://videos.camaroz28.com/video/5d911306-59a8-4540-8b66-982b00ebf51d.htm)


http://i72.photobucket.com/albums/i177/Fastbird93/BenDyno.jpg

T-Trim equivilant (D1SC)
I would say the T-trim is equivilant to the P1SC IMO, The D1SC is right in between the T-trim and the YSI.

I would say the T-trim is equivilant to the P1SC IMO, The D1SC is right in between the T-trim and the YSI.

Here are the exact cfm numbers;

S trim = 1,000cfm
T trim = 1,200cfm
YSi = 1,600cfm

P1SC = 1,200cfm
D1SC = 1,400cfm
F1 = 1,525cfm
F1R/D1R = 2,000cfm

I would say the T-trim is equivilant to the P1SC IMO, The D1SC is right in between the T-trim and the YSI.

thats arguable

I have seen/ridden in 1 Supra single turbo that dyno'd at 858 RWHP, a Supercharged Saleen with more than 1,000 RWHP, a juiced and blown fox body mustang with 850+ RWHP, and 3 different F-bodies with more than 800 RWHP. All yeild the same results (with the exception of the fox body, since it was an all out drag car), they were dyno queens that couldn't hook worth a sh*t on both the street and the track. The Saleen would leave black lines with the slicks on in 4th gear at over 100 MPH! I'm not saying you can't hook at power levels this high, I am mearly saying it's not easy to do so, and that most will show serious traction issues even with lots of suspension mods and good tires with breeching the 800+ RWHP mark.



I am running a 7.65 crank pulley and a 3.40 blower pulley with my D1SC combo, and I only see 15.3#'s of boost :( . I have seen guys pull 18#'s before, and heard of others claiming 20#'s. I know with my particular combo of running AFR 180 heads, along with a gargantuan cam, and a big FMIC, all with the small plastic inlet tube from ATI is why I don't see the higher numbers. This year I will be swapping to a custom fabbed inlet tube, and using some methanol to add some timing. I am guessing it will net me at least another 50 RWHP or so. It does get difficult to press the D1 past 16#'s of boost, but with a good set of heads that you have, and a good cam, along with no intercooler will help your boost levels.

Back to the original poster here, like I said before, it totally depends on what you want. If you will be content with 700-750 RWHP, then I believe you can attain that with maxing out the T-Trim, or worst case scenareo, adding a little spray to it. Other than the freak of nature LittleRedZ, I seriously doubt you will hook up at this attained HP level. I have just seen too much evidence first hand that leads me to believe otherwise. It is true that you could just get the YSi blower and set it at a mild level of boost for it and probably attain the same HP level.

7.65 and 3.40 i saw about 17-18psi. without the intake(makes a huge difference about 4-5lbs and about 100rwhp)

will procharger D1SC work with vortec after cooler i've got?And Will it be allot more money to change over to procharger than just bolt on T-trim? Also are the crank pulleys completely different because im about to buy custom pulley for $275 dollars to work with ATI superdamper. BTW Call911 CR is 8:1 is this to low?

will procharger D1SC work with vortec after cooler i've got?And Will it be allot more money to change over to procharger than just bolt on T-trim? Also are the crank pulleys completely different because im about to buy custom pulley for $275 dollars to work with ATI superdamper. BTW Call911 CR is 8:1 is this to low?

The aftercooler from Vortec is specifically for the Vortec blowers. I suppose with the right fabrication anything can be done, but it was not manufactured to do so. I would go with a good FMIC like I am running if you go with an ATI blower. I believe the T-Trim is about as much as the D1SC. Call Bob at EPP and tell him CALL911 sent you. He will give you the best deal by far out there on both the ATI blower, and their FMIC. As for the pulleys, I am not 100% sure, but I would guess you need the pulleys from the company that makes the supercharger. 8:1 is pretty low. I would say the lowest to go would be around 8.5:1. I am running 8.8:1 and mine is good to well over 25#s of boost.

yeah 8:1 is pretty low, there are import kids running 35 psi on 8:1. I am running 9.1:1 on my 355, which still gives me pretty good power out of boost. I am looking to run about 17-18 psi

yeah 8:1 is pretty low, there are import kids running 35 psi on 8:1. I am running 9.1:1 on my 355, which still gives me pretty good power out of boost. I am looking to run about 17-18 psi

9.1:1 is a good ratio. It should be good for 17-18#'s. 9.5:1 is where it starts to limit you to safely run more than 17#'s or so.

blazzen:

Please check your PM's.

Thanks,

What is the parastatic drivetrain loss of a LT/LS T-56? I'm making 800hp at the crank and have yet to drive the car. I'm also wondering what kind of power I will make to the wheels.

What is the parastatic drivetrain loss of a LT/LS T-56? I'm making 800hp at the crank and have yet to drive the car. I'm also wondering what kind of power I will make to the wheels.

800 at the crank would yeild somewhere in the 650 RWHP range I would guess.

why so much loss?

I don't under stand how this makes any sense.
some people say m6 = 16% loss and i don't know how true that is, but lets say you don't modify any thing but engine. why would the same m6,rearend,drive shaft loss so much more power now.because 16% of lets say 500fwhp is much more than 16% of 300fwhp?

why so much loss?

I don't under stand how this makes any sense.
some people say m6 = 16% loss and i don't know how true that is, but lets say you don't modify any thing but engine. why would the same m6,rearend,drive shaft loss so much more power now.because 16% of lets say 500fwhp is much more than 16% of 300fwhp?

I don't know "why". I just am basing that number off of numerous cars I have seen do an engine dyno, and then later had a chasis dyno done. I can't provide any more information other than saying, it is what it is.

call911 I didn't mean to pointing finger at, you i just never could under stand why? btw thanks for all the good advice.and to anyone else that gave there .2 cents.

call911 I didn't mean to pointing finger at, you i just never could under stand why? btw thanks for all the good advice.and to anyone else that gave there .2 cents.


Its all good. Cars loose power due to the transfer of power from the motor through the transmission and driveshaft through the rear to the wheels, and then to the ground. But I think you are trying to understand "why" the loss is that much, and I don't know the answer to that.

blown cars also loose as much as 80-100hp on top of the drivetrain loss due to the belt and how hard the motor has to turn in order to turn the blower. the biggeer it is the bigger the loss. So if you putting down 650 through an auto and a 12 bolt, add your drivetrain loss and then add your blower loss and that is what your motor is actually seeing.