dissapointing subframe connectors

man I read posts all the time that are like subframes are awesome, I can feel so much difference, car is so much tigher.

Well I got weld in subframe connectors and I don't feel jack. I think they just added a ton of weight. :confused:

I agree, I never quite understood that myself. If youre a vert owner mabey you would notice a big diff etc. BTW I'm not saying it's not a good mod, it's a great mod. Im just saying it's odd people swear up and down they were able to feel such a big diff.

I have installed welded in Spohn Tube type Sub Frame Connectors four years ago. When people ride in my car for the first time they can not belive how tight and rattle free it is. For your info the car is 1987 IROCZ and its 19 yrs old and I am the original owner.. I would say they they helped.

man I read posts all the time that are like subframes are awesome, I can feel so much difference, car is so much tigher.

Well I got weld in subframe connectors and I don't feel jack. I think they just added a ton of weight. :confused:


as soon as you make some real power you will notice compared to a car without

4th gen chasses are pretty stout to begin with. I have no excessive squeaks or rattles in none of my three 4th gens, they all have over 90K miles on them and none have subframe connectors (one of them makes about 400 rwhp and another makes around 350 rwhp). There are few people who road-race and/or auto-X their 4th gen cars and have no problems without subframe connectors (one of them gets his car checked at an alignment shop frequently, and the chassis hasn't deflected one bit after all the road-racing events). So I am still not sold on their effectiveness, although they might be useful for drag-racing cars that make insane amounts of power and have a good suspension setup that allows them to launch nice and straight.

4th gen chasses are pretty stout to begin with. I have no excessive squeaks or rattles in none of my three 4th gens, they all have over 90K miles on them and none have subframe connectors. There are few people who road-race and/or auto-X their 4th gen cars and have no problems without subframe connectors (one of them gets his car checked at an alignment shop frequently, and the chassis hasn't deflected one bit after all the road-racing events). So I am still not sold on their effectiveness.

sell 2 of those and mod the hell out of one then you will be sold

sell 2 of those and mod the hell out of one then you will be sold

Nah, why have only one of a good thing when you can have three :) Plus cornering fast is more appealing to me than mega horsepower and 10 sec timeslips.

you sell 2 go for 8 sec timeslips lol

My car acually rattles more then it did before. ALot more, most of the noise is comeing from the rear hatch I think.

I have installed welded in Spohn Tube type Sub Frame Connectors four years ago. When people ride in my car for the first time they can not belive how tight and rattle free it is. For your info the car is 1987 IROCZ and its 19 yrs old and I am the original owner.. I would they they helped.

You can't even begin to compare a 4th gen and a 3rd gen for chassis stiffness.

I did sfc's and lca's at the same time so its a little harder to say what did what, but, I noticed the difference in bite off the line, and definitely "feel" more of the road than b4. Unfortunately when the road sucks balls, its like driving on train tracks, and im only 3/4" lowered with bilstein BTS. But at high speeds on good pavement, there is a difference, the car is more stable feeling and high speed lane changes no longer give the car that "shifting" feeling. BTW, I have nitto 555r's on the rear. If you're just spinning street tires from a launch then you just wont understand. The sfc's make the car more rigid and act/react as a whole, not tweak because all that holds the car together is sheet metal. You may not permanently tweak your chassis from alignment to alignment with only 400 HP but I assure you under load like a nasty launch on good tires with nothing but traction, you will definitely twist the chassis w/o sfc's. These things have been around forever guys, and its sure not because they dont do anything. They may not be for everyones ride, but anyone whos serious about racing pretty much uses them so explain that.

Got a set of Global West and the car will sit on 3 jack stands now, it wouldn't before.
Ya will wrinkle the roof if ya hook it hard a few times without them,Or your tops will not fit and leak and worst of all the hatch.

What kind of subframe connectors do you have and was the car level when they were installed? Something doesnt sound right if you have rattles and such. Mine tightened up the car unbelieveably and as in the post above the car will now stand up on 3 jackstands. Before if i took one out you could see the car start to twist.

The car was level and there in solid. I got the granatelli ones.

http://www.granatellimotorsports.com/gmsubframeconnectors.htm

maybe your car was already twisted from a accident or previous owner???

possibly, I had a carfax check a while back it wasn't that good...

I'm not big on the front plate area of the GMS sfcs. That looks like it would weld behind the front frame instead of on it, or the tubing had to go under the front frame instead of fitting between the frames.

I noticed a nice difference w/my sfc install. Much flatter feeling in the curves. I drove on some twisty back roads to and from getting them installed, so I had a good before and after conparison.
Get some good tires and tight curves and give it a try.

Yes, there are people who autox and don't use them. Mainly due to class restrictions.

as soon as you make some real power you will notice compared to a car without



This is exactly correct. The car won't twist around as much - just felt sloppy before the SFC's.

http://www.lt1engine.com/images/personal/rear13.jpg
http://www.lt1engine.com/images/personal/rear14.jpg

I think that might be your problem. When I had my BMR boxed SFC's installed, I had the mechanic use the drive-on car lift. That way, the wheels stayed on the ground as if the car was on the road. And I felt a huge difference when I drove the car home, I could literally feel the sfc under the drivers seat.

o well there stuck now, I'll just grease the sqeaky stuff

That one picture of the SFC on the ground doesn't look like they have much of a mating surface for the connection to the front frame. Definately not what you want.

I agree with Camarocracy. My instructions stated that the car had to be level and had to have the chassis loaded.

Depending on how you welded them, you can grind the welds off and do it over. If you do re-install them, I would put the car on 4 rhino ramps.

If I looked at your pics right you installed them with the suspension hanging? That is incorrect! They are supposted to be installed with the suspension loaded or weight on wheels not hanging.
I wouldn't even hesistate to remove and install correctly!
I installed diamond type SFC's and noticed a big difference on how the car handles rough road much better even with my hardtop car.
Take them off and redo them & you'll be much happier! ;)

I think that might be your problem. When I had my BMR boxed SFC's installed, I had the mechanic use the drive-on car lift. That way, the wheels stayed on the ground as if the car was on the road. And I felt a huge difference when I drove the car home, I could literally feel the sfc under the drivers seat.
You could literally feel it? Like touching it? :lol:

No offense, but I think a lot of people get that psycological effect of some things. Not saying they don't make a difference, but some peoples minds probably make that difference bigger.

Can you get on the navy base out in millington? If you can they have several nice lifts that you can drive onto. They also have everything that you need to do most work on your car, all in the hobby shop.

If I looked at your pics right you installed them with the suspension hanging? That is incorrect! They are supposted to be installed with the suspension loaded or weight on wheels not hanging.
I wouldn't even hesistate to remove and install correctly!
I installed diamond type SFC's and noticed a big difference on how the car handles rough road much better even with my hardtop car.
Take them off and redo them & you'll be much happier! ;)

Exactly. I have the UMI boxed SFC's and I installed them with a buddy at work on the drive on lift. Thats what I read you're supposed to do. Not having your rear suspension loaded, the chassis behind your rear jackstands was loaded in the opposite direction due to gravity. You need the car to sit the way it does when yer driving it. I would totally take a grinder to those welds and cut them off, clean the areas up again and re-weld them. I would almost imagine you have made the stability of the vehicle worse as far as handling goes.

Sort of. I have really acute senses when it comes to cars. I hear everything and feel everything when I'm driving a car [so if anything is wrong, I notice it right away]. And after the sfc's where installed, it just felt a LOT more solid on the drivers side of the car.

You really shouldn't "feel" to much of a difference with them installed under normal driving. However at the track and a little bit of power you will get a straighter launch out of them, they also protect the vehicle from twisting when you have a good torque curve.

Got a set of Global West and the car will sit on 3 jack stands now, it wouldn't before.

ditto for the global west sfc's & the 3 jackstands

Mine will do that on the BMR clones I have. Any SFC should be able to do this.

I have BMR round SFC and noticed the difference in a highway bend I take all the time at 70~75 MPH... Less body roll....:)

i got a set not for traction but since i noticed my passenger t-top starting to not fit easily.

I think that might be your problem. When I had my BMR boxed SFC's installed, I had the mechanic use the drive-on car lift. That way, the wheels stayed on the ground as if the car was on the road. And I felt a huge difference when I drove the car home, I could literally feel the sfc under the drivers seat.

Where did you get yours put on and how much was it?

-Dustin-

I have a 1988 formula 350, ofcourse being a unibody and living around uneven roads like i do you tend to notice all the flexing, what is a good brand of weld in connectors to go with? I'm all for getting that unibody as stiff as possible.