Steve Y

True, 4th gens do everything better than 3rd gens from a performance standpoint. I still like the looks and layout of the 3rd gens better, though.

Marc 85Z28

Based on previous posts, you sounded like you had a clue. But this post disproves that, in several ways.

1. On the average 3rd gens are lighter than 4th gens. Proven over and over again. Usually 100lbs or more.

2. The higher level 3rd gens (IROCs, WS6's, 1LE's etc) did handle better stock for stock vs even the highest trim 4th gen(and many still do). Skidpads of the era averaged .90, with many reaching as high as .93 I've never seen any 4th gen with skidpads documented that high, even with better tread compound and larger 17" wheel/tire combos.

And stepping up to a 4th gen is somewhat of a oxymoron IMO. Newer does not always equal better. I never liked any 4th gen styling, with maybe the exception of the 96-02 WS6 cars. And the performance gain would be a moot point. What performance enthusiast keeps their car stock?

And $3500-$4000 will buy you a L98, 16x8 wheel, 4 wheel disc car in condition that rivals the $7000 4th gen you mentioned earlier. And the performance is just a tad shy of that LT1.

Lets NOT turn this into another 3rd gen vs 4th gen debate. We've got a Ford vs Chevy arguement going here

FIREBIRDMIKE

naw i am still going to have to disagree. The title on my 94 formula says 3260, my 85 WS6 lB9 says 3356. Also, what year L98 ever came close to an LT1? L98 reached at peak in with a g92 car at 235hp in 91/92 models correct??? SO how is that ne where near LT1s underrated 275hp? Your also rigfht when you said you can get a nicely equipped thirdgen for about 3500/4grand, But if you mean in the eyes of something like an TPI iroc or TA its going to be beat. I dont know about where you guys live but around here you cant touch a decent RS with a tbi motor and 16 inch tires for less than 3 to 4 grand. Nice z's and iroc's birds in the thirdgen years are up in the 5grand range. Also dont get me wrong again i prefer my thirdgens, I have had L98 iroc, lg4s lb9s lo3s some standard some not but the first time i drove the 4th gen lt1 it was a whole new car. I am not bashing thirdgens but keep an open mind, dont be afraid of change

FIREBIRDMIKE

BTW FORD SUX

85_305

This guy is actually 200% correct. The IROC, WS6, and ESPECIALLY the 1LE packaged Camaro's will outhandle the HELL out of most, if not all, LT1 cars. Plus, even though 4-gens are all plastic, they are bigger, bigger engines, bigger rims/tires, tranny's weigh more, more heavy-duty suspensions, etc. They DEFF. weigh more though. Mike, the L98 had 345lbs of torque. Tell me how that will NOT hang with and LT1? (Hell.. that will kill many a-great LS1). But in order to hang in the top end you will need a new intake manny/Throttle body, but seeing as though you already paid for your car at less than HALF of what a 4-gen costs, you will have PLENTY of money left overr for that Stealth Manifold
Steve- It is too late to get a 350. I am already putting the 305 together, plus I need all money I make to go into getting the car on the road in freaking 3 months tops (lol). But thanx for the help (I *am* happy btw)

Steve Y

I think the 4th gens out slalomed the 3rd gens which is another component of handling.

Steve Y

Chevy sux.

grannycar

85 305!!no way a 350 tpi hang with ls1/lt1"stock vs stock"?!?!?!? no way man..sorry but the truth hurts.. and stock lt1's usally make 340ish tq stock! and make just as much rwhp as third gen 350 tpi make at the flywheel!! dont forget the lt1's were under rated....but not as much as the ls1's

FIREBIRDMIKE

grannycar is correct, l98s dont even make lt1 rwhp. I Have yet to see an iroc run n e where near the 14.2 to 13.8 range a4lt1s are capeable of. yea tpi has alot of tq but so does n e other fuel injected gm v8. L98s are great but they just arent as devloped as lt1s. An lt1 is a tottally different motor, higher compression, fast burn type of alluminum cyl heads. L98s are i belive a 2 bolt block lt1 is 4 bolt i believe?, also a huge difference in cam shafts grinds.

BTW i forgot who said this in the thread but whoever said that 4th gens have heavier trannies and suspention components is a complete RETARD! 90% of suspention components are interchangeable, the 4l60e is the same tranny as a 700r4 only its electronic, i mean i just dont get it. Like i understand peoples love for thier thirfdgens but the problem is people get to biased, and if its not a thirdgen its junk, I know becouse for a while all i could afford was a thirdgen so everychance to bash on a 4th gen or make my car seem compareable (looks and performance) id take it, Like alot of guys in this thread are doing. Again keep an open mind guys, i love my thirdgens but no thirdgen came close stock for stock to n e 4th gen. SOmeone who is a diehard thirdgen fan in his iroc or ta or whatever id love for him to just hop behind the wheel of one of these 4th gen lt/ls1 cars and come back onhere and tell everyone. Whats different, what did u like what didnt u like, how did it feel? i dotn mind a negative opinion on a 4th gen but back it up with experience. Dont just hate 4th gens becouse of the cocky dork u see one day ridding around beating up and abuseing the thing, hate them or love them becouse u kept an open mind and tried it. If someone says they cant stand lt1s and thier l98 they like way better after they just got out of a 4th gem z ot ta or something than fine......fair enough but i am telling ya if u get the chance try it out

back in my thirdgen days i used to hate every LT1 and 5.0 stang to ride by. It was jelousy. I was jelous inside that my tbi rs camaro(at the time) couldnt hold a flame to either car. Until i rode a 5.0 89 lx stang than i was in love, it was so fast i couldnt hold the *** end down, then i drove the 4th gen bird and thats all she wrote, for me though n e way

85_305

Granny Car.. the sad part is, a '92 L98 has 2hp more, and 55lbs more torque than your 95 T/A. All it takes to make a L98 a hi/low 13 sec. car is a throttlebody swap.
FirebirdMike-The L98 has a 4bolt main actually (just like the LT1) And by the way, i DO like the 4th gens. They are VERY nice cars. But I see you dont believe me that they will be manhandled by a properly working IROC, 1LE, etc.. go in and make a post in the third-gen section or the lounge asking which handles better.. I guarantee you that the majority will be on the 3rd gens side
But TBI in ANY Camaro is very poor performance-wise. It takes some know-how and some money (Gunny for example) to get a TBI moving.

OttawaZ

Hey Guys,
I thought all LT1s were two bolt mains? I thought you had to have them splayed to get four bolt mains? It doesn't matter to me what gen it is as long as the person driving respects there ride, and treats it right. Have a nice weekend.

Mike

grannycar

are you dumb 85 305?!!? those numbers are at the wheels lol.. with a 18% drivetrain loss that is 286ish hp..and 336 lbs tq.. thats with bad gas and ign problem too.. ive seen corvette 350 tpi's only put down 210 rwhp.. and plus..the the curve on lt1's are sooooooo much flatter.. sorry dude but you must be really confused to think that i was talking fwhp..geez

I burn rice too

The LT1 was a 2 bolt main in the F body, unless it was replaced by the dealer during warranty. (GM doesn't sell replacement LT1's anymore). The Vette is the only ones to get the 4 bolt mains, as in most years. The only other way to get a 4 bolt main in an F body was if you're lucky enough to have one of the few LT4 cars in '97.

85_305

LOL.. are YOU focking dumb? Why in the FOCK would I be talking about fwhp???? I am talking rwhp.

I Burn Rice Too: Actually.. you are right. I forgot that all F-bodies get 2 bolt mains ALL the time (except the L98) and the Vette's get 4-bolt mains ALL THE TIME. I was for some reason thinking that the F-Bod LT1 was 4bolt..

OttawaZ: Thanx for your input and you have a nice weekend as well

grannycar

"Granny Car.. the sad part is, a '92 L98 has 2hp more, and 55lbs more torque than your 95 T/A" qouted from you..thats what im talking about! you read my sig.. and that hp is at the rear wheels..350 tune ports make only 245 flywheel horsepower which is only around a sucky 210ish rwhp. i made 243 rwhp with a missfire and cheap gas so my timing was being pulled..my dyno looks like the rocky mountains..and my tq is around 340ish..stock! i know tpi are rated at 345 flywheel hp..and plus the curve is a hellava better on an lt1..even look at what firedirdmike said..lol think before you speak man,,lol