You got me

But Ive got a 400 block sitting outside, that has 6.0" bushed rods going in it, and a 3.875 crank. I dont mind spending big money on Ross pistons or something cause I need good ones that will stand up to a little nitrous anyway

And the 305 would probbaly move pretty good with a convertor. And if I had went with a more sensible cam than just the biggest one I could afford Even in its condition now it will take stock LT1s

 

here is my hooptie....

1978 z28
350 .030 over
cast crank,good rods,KB slugs( I know its a time bomb)
TFS Heads with K motion springs
Lunati Solid roller 600/610 242/250 dur on a 106 lsa.
Vic Jr Intake.
Chuck Nuytten 825

Running super comps with a mandrel 2 1/2 in exhaust and 2 chamber flows. exhaust dumps after the mufflers.

6 point cage

manual Valve Th350 with a TCI 9" 4000 stall.

rear is a stock 8.5 with a spool,4.56's, c-clip elims,tubes welded,mosier axles and a set of custom ladder bars

Im running 2 Holley Blues one for engine side one for nitrous side.

car has been 10.97 with current setup on a 125 plate and 11.95 on the engine(that was in great air)

Ray

 

Angel - I have a huge 4-core custom rad with dual Flexalite electric fans and 160 degree thermostat. The car normally runs 178-185 degrees on a hot day in normal city driving. I am thinking of going with an Edelbrock Victor or Stewart aluminum water pump to save a few pounds and for additional cooling. I am also running over 11:1 compression to boot. The car runs great, and only gets over 200 degrees if it gets really hot out combined with heavy stop and go traffic. Otherwise, no real problems. So far, the engine has never overheated in even the worst summer heat (and this has been a year of record temps in Vancouver).

400's do tend to run a little warmer than a 350, but nothing like the horror stories some guys like to perpetuate about these engines. I just smiled when I was told I'd blow head gaskets, the engine would over heat, and so on. A buddy of mine ran a 413" small block years ago, and it lasted for over 2 years of daily driving (in the summer) and going to the strip on the weekends. He never blew a headgasket either.

The key to it all is to have a first-rate cooling system in the car before you install one of these engines. Think big-block cubes ina small block package, and design your cooling system around a big blocks needs, and I'd say you'll be just fine.

Dave

 

I shouldnt have run the 5.565 rods, but they're holding up good. At the time I didnt want to spend $600 or so on pistons that will work with a 5.7" rod combo. The stock rods will hold up for what I'm doing.


I too run the 5.565" stock rods. Some guys like to say they aren't any good - and I won't say they will take unlimited power - but I think they are better than what some guys may think. The one big advantage to using them is you do not need to run a small base-circle cam and/or grind the rod bolt bosses down on 3 or 4 rods as you do when you go to a 5.7-6.0" rod and use the 400's 3.75" stroke crank.

Dave

 

yep. thats another reason I stuck w/5.565 's

too many people automatically discount 'em, but I've seen ALOT of all motor 383's running 5.565's in the low 12's, spinning up to 6500 rpm and held together just fine.

 

Yep - I think the key to longevity with the 400's and the 383 stock short-rod engines, is to keep the RPM's at 6500 max. For more RPM, I'd go with a good 5.7- 6.0" rod.

Heck if Joe Sherman can coax 604HP @ 6750 RPM out of a short-rod 400 with ported GM 292 heads, they can't be all that bad.

 

Yea, but I wasnt really talking about them not being able to stand up to the power. Its just too short, the rod ratio sucks then. As if it werent bad enough on 383+s even with 5.7s. Who cares about a small circle base cam its like an extra $20.

My block I got bare anyway so I had to buy new rods, like I said Im going with the Eagle 6.0" 3d rods, cause they are bushed and already stroker clearanced.

 

Yea, but I wasnt really talking about them not being able to stand up to the power. Its just too short, the rod ratio sucks then. As if it werent bad enough on 383+s even with 5.7s. Who cares about a small circle base cam its like an extra $20.


A short rod motor pulls harder on the intake charge sooner than does a long rod motor; the primary difference (aside from sidewall loading) is the long rod dwells at TDC longer. I'm not going to argue about which is better - all I can tell you is from my experience with the 400's - and from others I know who run them - is the short rod issue is not really that big a deal. These things make a lot of power regardless of what rod length you use. As I posted earlier, if Joe Sherman can knock out 604HP with a short rod 400 and steel heads, they can't be all that bad.

As far as the small base circle issue, if a guy is on a budget and doesn't want to wait to have his cam ground special, the short rod 400 offers the ease of using any cam that might be on the shelf down at the local speed shop that would work for the application.

Just my .02

Dave

 

The cams I was looking at were Herbert Roller cams, and they didnt say anything about having to wait for it to be ground special. But I didnt specifically ask about them yet so Im not gonna argue.

And I also agree that 5.565 rods are good for a guy on a budget. I mostly got into this because Bartonek had Dart heads, a blower, and all these lavish parts.....then stock short rods

And does this Joe Sherman have a website? Id like to read about that set-up

 

Dirt: did you know you can also buy 5.565" rods in 4340 ? hehehe...I didnt know that..

DarthIROC: unless you want me to tear into what you have and what little you know, I'd suggest you stop the bashing on my setup.

 

Im not bashing your set-up at all, I just thought it was odd. Most people go to 5.7's when they build a motor to the extent you did

But if you wanna compare small block IQs lets rock. But lets start tommorow, Im going to bed for tonight.

Edit: And if you meant tear into me about my 305 have fun, I built that motor a year or so ago when I didnt know nearly as much as I do now. Pretty soon Im gonna see how much No2 stock crank and rods, that 305 can handle The only thing I will regret losing are my speed pro pistons

 

Just retard the timing and get enough additional fuel. My friend is running 100 shot on a cast-piston 1965 Mustang I6. Chevy High Performance got up to a 300 shot on a close-to-stock 350. In fact, the bottom end may have been stock, I can't remember.

 

My cast cranked 350 has been together for 3 summers and turns 7000 every pass. Its made many many passes on a 150 shot. I know im running on barrowed time but that will change this winter.

 

And does this Joe Sherman have a website? Id like to read about that set-up.

Not that I know of. You must be fairly young if you don't know who he is. Joe has been around a long time. He was the very first guy to create the 383 engine combo, which was around 1978. At that time he worked for Edelbrock as an engine builder. Over the years, he - like noted engine builder extrordinaire, Dave Vizard - gained their stellar reps from coaxing enormous power out of budget engine combos.

As far as 604HP out of the short-rod 406 is concerned, that info came out of an old issue of Car Craft from years ago. As cool as that is though, Joe has improved on that a bit by getting over 600HP out of a 365" street small block, which was the engine that won him $75,000 in the 2002 Engine Masters competition put on by Popular Hotrodding Magazine.

Joe's ideas make for interesting reading. You can read in great detail about his winning engine here: Joe Sherman's 600+HP 365" street small block

Happy reading.

 

Dirt: did you know you can also buy 5.565" rods in 4340 ? hehehe...I didnt know that..

Yep - I knew that. Manley sells forged 5.565" rods. I also just remembered, Mike Morgan's 10-second Nova which was featured in the April 1999 issue of Car Craft, runs these rods and makes 585HP @ 7000 RPM.