How many M5s do they sell? It hardly constitutes a huge chunk out of BMWs sales. The M5 is going to get more skepticism for the motor it has; it is a flagship car, and BMWs top performance sedan.

Many of you guys on here would often jump down someones throat if you labeled the Camaro as strictly an ethusiast car, and yet many of you are trying to it up like the German luxury machines are the sole realm of enthusiasts. Most Audi, BMW, and Mercedes owners I have talked to or known are not enthusiasts, and don't know much about their engines, except for maybe the amount of cylinders it has. I would bet most of them don't even know what a pushrod is.

My point is, if GM could dump the money from the Northstar engines into refining a pushrod engine that could match the German engines in NHV, then eventually people who might put a stigma on it would start to look past it after enough time. Cadillac used the be the exclusive domain of the old man driver, but after enough time of building convincing performance sedans, their image has turned around on them. Stigmas can dissolve.

 

But she knows how smooth her engine is though

 

I own one each of the GM V8's (baby Northstar DOHC in my '98 Aurora, LS1 in my '04 GTO). They are appropriate powertrains for the vehicles that they are in - the smooth, humming symmetry of the Northstar in the luxury-oriented Aurora, and the shaking, growling beast of the LS1 in the GTO). Each would seem out-of-place in the other vehicle, if you swapped them. Not much in terms of performance modifications for the Northstar besides CAI/hollowing out the airbox (it's constricted for noise-suppression reasons - not so much on my Aurora anymore :-)

The LS1 is a packaging dream, the Northstar a packaging nightmare, but they each have their place. GM has been focusing moreso on the LSx side of late, while most of the DOHC work has been on the HF3.6 and 2.8 motors (with a detour to a blown Northstar for the V-Series caddies). Development dollars have shifted to the "UltraV8" line which will eventually replace the Northstars... bear in mind the Northstar came out in the early 90's, while the LSx series powerplants followed 4-5 years later. So, of course the LSx series will seem be more powerful... wait for the new Ultra powerplants and we'll review this situation again.

 

What does 2 cams and 32 valves have to do with NVH? I would think the block structure, accessory attatchement and overall balance of the engine (via firing order, crank design, power produced per cylinder, etc) would have a much greater effect than the number of valves and cams an engine had. My own opinion is that DOHC 32v V8 sounds more refined and advanced than OHV 16v V8.

 

And why couldn't an LS engine be as smooth???? Everybody keeps spouting that off for the reason of the Northstar's existence, but I don't understand why. Obviously if the pushrod motors went into the Caddies they would be heavily tweaked for NHV.

 

Perception is reality.


Future reviews:

"GM cheaped out and went back to the less-complex, less expensive powerplant in their luxury line."

"The primitive growl of the LSx line is perfectly at home in the Corvette, GTO, and Camaro, but does not fit the driving characteristics luxury car buyers demand."

I'm just telling you what Consumer Reports and Car and Driver would say. To you that doesn't matter, but I'm telling you that dropping the Northstar motor would be virtual sabatoge to Cadillac's resurgance.

 

MY GXP needs premium, so I am not sure that all 5.3's run on Premium. Also, the aftermarket for the DOD vehicles has been stunted because of the complexity.

While the LSx engines are great...Cadillac would get laughed out the room if they tried to take on Mecedes with it on the world theatre. Perception is everything

 

I've yet to drive a pushrod-powered car that had a motor that was quiet enough and had little enough NVH to become acceptable, much less impressive, in a luxury car.

That's not to say it's not possible. I'm sure it might be. But it may be for that reason that people just don't associate a pushrod motor with a true luxury car. I'd love to see GM stick the LS2 in a Caddy STS and quiet it down to near inaudible noise and vibration levels, then see how people respond to it... it definitely wouldn't bother me. The LS2 has great power AND great milage.

 

Sounds like a good Buick doesn't it?

 

nope.. 440tq at the flywheel

 

It won't for long. DOHC "Ultra" V8 will replace it soon

 

AH-HA confirmed the original Ultra was killed a while ago and the new idea is to improve the N*. I expect DI and a VVT system but that is about it.

 

Yeah, but Consumer Reports adn Car and Diver haven't said what you stated they might say, so there is no way to know that is what they would say about it. Perhaps you have ignored me everytime time I have wrote "an LSx engine with NHV levels appropriate for a luxury vehicle". If they could build a smooth pushrod engine, people wouldn't care how it moved the car. Not everyone reads Car and Driver and forms an absolute opinion; some people actually test drive cars. If the engine was smooth, I really can't see Car and Driver complaining about how its valves open, at least not in any length.

 

I haven't skipped over it at all. Right or wrong, the point isn't necessarily even about how smooth the motor is.

Perception is everything.

Luxury car buyers typically have to keep up with what the guy down the street drives...and I'm sure a few of those guys keep up with the latest and greatest...pushrod motors will never be perceived as "latest and greatest". Sorry, I love the LSx line too, but that's just the way it is.

 

If that is true, is something going to be done about displacement? DI should put the Northstar at about ~360HP, but what the Northstar could really use is a 5.0L version. Cadillac needs to be able to get 400HP N/A out of that engine platform.