What hole have I been in. I really like this car and I think it looks halfway decent. It sure is price nicely agaisnt a 300 and other models. They just need to do 2 things and I would think about picking one up. Put that 6spd from the C6 and Cadillac in it and make it RWD. I think would be the only things I would change.......ok and some more power (300hp sounds nice). The interior looks good, and if that is where Buick is going I think things will be looking up for them soon.

 

So you would change the whole drivetrain and then it would be an acceptable car?

Unless Buick gets a performance car, I don't see them going RWD. There is no reason for it. They are cruisers, not any more or any less. There are plenty of RWD options out there(maybe not within GM yet).

 

Pair a mostly unchanged 1995 Aurora chassis w/ an antiquated 3.8L V6 and 4-speed auto, release it as an all new premium Buick model for 2006, and see if people believe you.

Why is GM still trying to fool people?

The northstar and magnetic ride suspension are cool options but end up pricing the car over 40k IIRC which places it in the way of competition I doubt it can run with.

 

Ouch!

 

Didn't we already cover the chassis issue (or non-issue) in some other threads? I do agree about the 3800 and 4 speed auto, though.

On the one hand, 200 hp and 4 gears is MORE than adequate for about 75% of the buyers of that car, many of whom probably never apply more than 50% throttle anyway. But my personal feeling/wish is that the 3.6L VVT should be the base engine. Obviously the transverse six speed auto will come when it is ready (Saturn Aura gets it as an '07, hopefully others will get it in '07 as well). Unfortunately, I'm sure the 3800 has a huge cost advantage over the 3.6L, and knowing the target audience of the car, I can understand why they put it in. They figure they are going to sell, say 140k (whatever the LeSabre and Park Ave sold) of these every year, and probably 75% of those sales are to people who don't give a hoot about the engine/transmission. As long as its quiet, reliable, offers "good pickup", most will be happy with it. When GM is struggling to make money, it would be hard to justify a $2000 engine over a $1200 dollar engine (making up numbers) when most outside the media or enthusiast world will care. For those ~25% who do care, the Northstar is available. Remember that the LeSabre never had more than the 3800 (and the slightly bigger Park Ave had the 240 hp 3800 s/c as its top dog), and the LeSabre has been the best selling "full size" car for years.

Point is, while I too wish for a more potent and image-friendly base engine, I understand why they did what they did given the need for profits right now, and possibly volume limitations on the 3.6 (?). Of course, as volumes go up on the 3.6L VVT (and its variants), the cost should come down...

As far as the rest of the car goes, I personally think it is very classy and attractive looking. People buying the 3800 versions of the car will be more interested in the looks, the interior, the ride, the quiet. Those looking for the sportier Northstar flavor, however, might be drawn to the Avalon's 280 hp V6 (with a fuel economy advantage over the N*), or the new 280 hp Passat for that matter. In my personal view, the Buick loses some points there in fuel economy, but makes up for it with prettier styling, a nicer (though simpler) looking interior (at least compared to Avalon), and the subjective advantages of a nice V8 vs. a nice V6 of similar power.

 

okay Threxx... have you ever driven a lasabre with the 3800 & a 4 speed?

i dont know if its the same... but i'm pretty sure its 90% the same...

that Lasabre had some *****! much more then most other cars i've driven... who cares if that 3800 only has what 200 hp? my parents camry (1998) has 194 hp, probably more like 170 but still they(my parents) think that is way to much power, and an impala with a 3800 or what not, would run circles around the competition... i wouldnt call the 3800 antiquated...

 

The 3.0/3.3 Toyota motor is antiquated, as is the 3.8. They both are.

That's why they've both been replaced or are in the process of being replaced for the most part. Toyota has been in the process of putting the all new GR-series 3.5L in all of its models that were using the 3.0/3.3 when they get a redesign. I don't blame GM for having an existing model with the 3.8, just as long as they plan on replacing it with the new generation V6 when it comes time to redesign. But this is a "brand new" 35k dollar car and they decided to go in with the old and out with the new - the opposite of what I'd have hoped and expected.

 

as soon as GM gets completely done designing the direct injection then we'll have some good things, that should be by 07 ym...

 

Yes, we've been over this before.......NOT the same exact chassis.

Further, the 3800 goes away next year. It's called capacity. There is only so much capacity at the moment for the newer V6s........the Northstar will appeal to a younger buyer. The Traditional Buick Buyer sees the 3800 as Fort Knox. (YES..........WE TALKED TO THEM!!!)

I can't imagine anyone on this site that the Lucerne is targeted toward. There's a thread on this forum (when I typed this) that talks about the fact that GM has to stop producing overlap models. Well.......the Lucerne is not an overlap model.

Damned if we do and damned if we don't.

(I'm cranky tonite.......way too much time working on the long island autoshow.)

 

Maybe I am the exception, but I am 28 and I will be buying a Lucerne.

Contrary to the popular beliefs of this board, not every car needs 500 horsepower, a 6 speed manual option, and RWD with IRS.

I am with the group that fbodfather referred to as thinking that the 3800 is Fort Knox. All of the 3800's I have ever seen have ran forever. They were either sold before the death of the engine, or had something else go wrong with the car, which caused the ownership to terminate. In short, I have never seen a 3800 fail.

I'm sorry, I just remembered that I did see one fail. But, there was a TSB for it. The intake was allowing coolant to enter the engine and caused a hydrolock situation. This was not the engines fault, but a failure in the intake.

I don't need the Northstar. I already have a Camaro. I travel a lot for work. For me, I want quiet, reliability, comfort, ride, mileage and looks out of my work car. The Lucerne provides all of this. Better than any other GM car in its price range.

Now that fbodfather dropped the bomb that the 3800 is gone next year, I wonder what the base engine will be? The 3.6?

 

Thanks for chiming in, Scott. I'm with ya... btw, your post didn't really come across as cranky, so don't sweat it.

General Z: Nice post. Interesting to hear someone who is actually considering purchasing the car chime in with what he is looking for in a DD.

 

The 3800 is FORT KNOX , lol . My 97 SSE bonnie had 208,000 when I traded for the SS , and my dads 93 Bonnie currently has 32x,xxx . Both cars lived most of their lives easy on the highway , but man . If I were buying a Lucere , I wouldnt wince one bit at a 3800

 

Bulletproof!!!

I am really debating now if I should get the 3800 model, or wait until next year and get the new base model engine.

I'll bet that the price will increase next year. Plus, the new engine won't have the 3800 reliability tag.

 

I don't have any problem with the Lucerne. By all accounts from people who have worked on it, seen it, or driven it is that it's a good car.

As was said before, it's not a car the majority of the people on this site would consider, but IMO it hits and goes beyond it's target audience.

Buick isn't going to lure any Toyota or even many Chevy buyers. But there are people who swear by Buick, and Buick has one of the world's most loyal repeat customers.

It's not a Chrysler 300C, but then again it doesn't have to be.

 

Damned straight. And a very nice product for Buick it is. Frankly, I think it's styling hits an absolute bullseye for it's segment. It's interior is a huge leap forward from the car it replaces. It's also alot of value for the money. The available NS is just the frosting on the cake.

I just find it to be one very attractive product. Kudos to Buick.

BTW RP, thanks for taking the time to show me around (and let me get in and poke around) the Lucerne that was on display at the Chicago show. That car really impressed me.