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UAW considers reopening contracts to aid Big 3

Old Dec 4, 2008 | 10:11 AM
  #16  
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Update:

UAW agrees to eliminate job bank and delay VEBA payments
Old Dec 4, 2008 | 02:12 PM
  #17  
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Originally Posted by Adam4356
Blaming the government for the Big Threes poor business makes no sense. As does the justification that the Big three need money because AIG and Citi got some.

Those aren't arguements, those are just baseless rants.
Look, here are the facts:
Aig and Citi = BAD business decisions, as proven by their near-collapse, prevented ONLY by a HUGE infusion of Federal $, with very little to no hearings, fuss or complaint. It was simply deemed "neccesary" for the good of the country.
The Big Three = (I would argue) LESS bad business decisions than either AIG or Citi, yet they're being grilled by asshat Congress members. One or more of these companies going under at this fragile time in our economy would (I believe) be near-catastrophic for ALL OF US. If the economy was in good shape, I would absolutely not favor a bailout of any of them. And "bad business decisions"? The big three for years produced, and sold at a nice profit, EXACTLY the kinds of vehicles the American consumer wanted. That = GOOD business decisions. If anything, they are guilty of having bad foresight, but not many people two years ago predicted anything like this current financial situation we're in, except maybe Peter Schiff.
Finally, it is an absolute FACT that the Big Three are not on a level playing field compared to foreign automakers. Part of that is their own fault, since they agreed to those ridiculous union contracts. Perhaps a BK would allow them to shed those bad contracts. However, there are other problems they face that will not be so easily remedied, such as the subdsidization of many of their foreign competitors by their respective governments.
Besides, if the automakers get their bailout, maybe all this doom and gloom will begin to go away. I've got "thread fatigue" from all of Mdactons' "FEMA Camp" posts
Old Dec 7, 2008 | 01:30 PM
  #18  
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I just find it ironic that people easily side to eliminate programs like the "job bank", that give laid off people free money to remain solvent, yet side to give the Big 3 BILLIONS of FREE dollars...I don't think dollar amounts would even come close by comparison...my $.02
Old Dec 7, 2008 | 01:36 PM
  #19  
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Originally Posted by 90rocz
I just find it ironic that people easily side to eliminate programs like the "job bank", that give laid off people free money to remain solvent, yet side to give the Big 3 BILLIONS of FREE dollars...I don't think dollar amounts would even come close by comparison...my $.02
Its a loan they will pay interest on, not FREE dollars.
Old Dec 7, 2008 | 01:43 PM
  #20  
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I'll admit I haven't been watching it closely lately, the whole bail-out issue is a sore spot for me, as I've watched these companies chip away at any labor expenses incurred by blue collar workers and continue giving golden parachutes to CEO,s and high execs. When the dollar amount costs to companies should support the opposite...
Old Dec 7, 2008 | 01:51 PM
  #21  
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Originally Posted by 90rocz
I'll admit I haven't been watching it closely lately, the whole bail-out issue is a sore spot for me, as I've watched these companies chip away at any labor expenses incurred by blue collar workers and continue giving golden parachutes to CEO,s and high execs. When the dollar amount costs to companies should support the opposite...

if not then may I suggest you relook into it. Its not as much like you say. there is no golden chute for these guys..
that was forthe banks who got us in this mess now. and this mess is holding up credit..to sell cars..this loan is to tide the big 3 over till credit starts flowing again.
Ford does not need the loan. GM was doing okay till the implosion and Mercedes Benz basically sold off a deflated ballon to Cerberus and thats why ythey are asking for $$$.
Old Dec 7, 2008 | 01:52 PM
  #22  
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Originally Posted by super83Z
Its a loan they will pay interest on, not FREE dollars.
The issue is that the Detroit Three are asking for a bailout (and yes, that's what it is)...it doesn't matter whether the money comes in the form of cash just given to them, direct loans that (in theory) will be paid back, loans guaranteed by the Government or lines of credit.

Most people who were against the bailout of the financial institutions are also against bailing out Detroit and mostly for the same reasons.

That aside, one can understand the reasoning behind trying to keep the financial system running even if one doesn't agree with it...unfortunately; our economy runs on credit; if that credit stops; the economy stops...the whole economy stops.

Bailing out a particular company/industry is a different matter; that's taking a much larger step into private business - a step that everything about free enterprise and entrepreneurship finds abhorrent.
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