Things I'd suggest to fix GM.
03-17-2005, 03:15 PM
#1
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Things I'd suggest to fix GM.
I don't like making hay if I can't make suggestions for fixing the problem.
GM has talent, money, resources, and ability. Yet they are outflanked by much smaller Ford & outearned by the comparative pipsqueek, the Chrysler division.... let alone Toyota (Toyota is worth SIX TIMES GM'S MARKET VALUE!!!
).
GM's common wisdom is being proved wrong at every turn. The public WILL by RWD sedans in volume, the public WILL continue to buy sports coupes if you keep them fresh, the public DOES care about the materials in the interior, SUVs ARE NOT the cureall for profits, you CAN'T keep a factory going and figure out how to sell the vehicles it produces later, rebates DON'T move stale cars or make the public forget about buying better and flashier cars across town.
What do I think GM needs to focus on instead? Getting new vehicles out. There's some people at GM-NA who criticise how Holden "jumps over" some process. Yet Holden manages to get the same or better results for less money. A concept many in GM-NA still can't comprehend, and never will.
Keeping product the focus here, some suggestions for a better GM:
1. Quit playing games with their "approval" claims.
GM is deluding only themselves. GM says 18-24 months from concept to production, but the reality is that they need development time before it's approved. Concept to product can be anywhere from 4 years (Solstice) to nearly a decade (the next F-body).
2. Elminate any position capable of 2nd guessing a product decision.
Having to second guess second guessers after a decision has been made means that there's too muany people working at GM. Alot of this was on display in the book "All Corvettes Are Red". In more recent times, both Cobalt and C6 Vette almost came out with cheap material because someone along the way made those decision after specs were done. Lutz had to get involved by throwing his weight around to get material quality back to where it was originally supposed to be.
3. Elimiate half the studies and a third of the decision makers.
There was actually a comittee formed to study if the next Trailblazer should be capable of right hand drive for export. This seemingly no brainer decision was decided when Bob Lutz did an end run and made the decision himself in favor of both side drive, saving months or more of wasted time.
Why does a product chairman even have to deal with something this stupid???
4. Quit overlapping products.
Why does a Bonneville ride like a LeSabre? What is the purpose in having both a Solstice and a Sky? Does Buick even really need both a LeCross and a Lecerne? If you are going to have multiple cars on the same chassis, they should not only look different, but should also ride different, handle different, and where feasible, have different powertrains. The person who buys a base Grand Prix shouldn't be the same person who buys an base Impala.
5. Price it and mean it.
No one takes GM's pricing seriously. GM already does this with Saturn. Next, GM should do this with Cadillac. Then Pontiac. Then finally, Chevrolet. Having a no incentive GTO or Solstice in the showroom next to a G6, Grand Prix, Bonneville, Sunfire, & Vibe with $2,000+ cash back probally isn't smart.
6. Finally, if something works, don't screw with it.
Despite Holden being the only successful and profitable arm of General Motors right now, GM has been getting increasingly involved with them. Holden is starting to feel the influence of GM North America (Holden IS infact losing their station wagon... Ford Australia will be laughing to the bank!). Holden's profit margin on the new Zeta cars is starting to look like it's going to be thinner than their last group of cars. It's also starting to look like GM-NA may drop the UTE in the next edition as well.
GM has talent, money, resources, and ability. Yet they are outflanked by much smaller Ford & outearned by the comparative pipsqueek, the Chrysler division.... let alone Toyota (Toyota is worth SIX TIMES GM'S MARKET VALUE!!!
).GM's common wisdom is being proved wrong at every turn. The public WILL by RWD sedans in volume, the public WILL continue to buy sports coupes if you keep them fresh, the public DOES care about the materials in the interior, SUVs ARE NOT the cureall for profits, you CAN'T keep a factory going and figure out how to sell the vehicles it produces later, rebates DON'T move stale cars or make the public forget about buying better and flashier cars across town.
What do I think GM needs to focus on instead? Getting new vehicles out. There's some people at GM-NA who criticise how Holden "jumps over" some process. Yet Holden manages to get the same or better results for less money. A concept many in GM-NA still can't comprehend, and never will.
Keeping product the focus here, some suggestions for a better GM:
1. Quit playing games with their "approval" claims.
GM is deluding only themselves. GM says 18-24 months from concept to production, but the reality is that they need development time before it's approved. Concept to product can be anywhere from 4 years (Solstice) to nearly a decade (the next F-body).
2. Elminate any position capable of 2nd guessing a product decision.
Having to second guess second guessers after a decision has been made means that there's too muany people working at GM. Alot of this was on display in the book "All Corvettes Are Red". In more recent times, both Cobalt and C6 Vette almost came out with cheap material because someone along the way made those decision after specs were done. Lutz had to get involved by throwing his weight around to get material quality back to where it was originally supposed to be.
3. Elimiate half the studies and a third of the decision makers.
There was actually a comittee formed to study if the next Trailblazer should be capable of right hand drive for export. This seemingly no brainer decision was decided when Bob Lutz did an end run and made the decision himself in favor of both side drive, saving months or more of wasted time.
Why does a product chairman even have to deal with something this stupid???
4. Quit overlapping products.
Why does a Bonneville ride like a LeSabre? What is the purpose in having both a Solstice and a Sky? Does Buick even really need both a LeCross and a Lecerne? If you are going to have multiple cars on the same chassis, they should not only look different, but should also ride different, handle different, and where feasible, have different powertrains. The person who buys a base Grand Prix shouldn't be the same person who buys an base Impala.
5. Price it and mean it.
No one takes GM's pricing seriously. GM already does this with Saturn. Next, GM should do this with Cadillac. Then Pontiac. Then finally, Chevrolet. Having a no incentive GTO or Solstice in the showroom next to a G6, Grand Prix, Bonneville, Sunfire, & Vibe with $2,000+ cash back probally isn't smart.
6. Finally, if something works, don't screw with it.
Despite Holden being the only successful and profitable arm of General Motors right now, GM has been getting increasingly involved with them. Holden is starting to feel the influence of GM North America (Holden IS infact losing their station wagon... Ford Australia will be laughing to the bank!). Holden's profit margin on the new Zeta cars is starting to look like it's going to be thinner than their last group of cars. It's also starting to look like GM-NA may drop the UTE in the next edition as well.
03-17-2005, 03:31 PM
#3
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Re: Things I'd suggest to fix GM.
I'd like to add...
NO hubcaps on Buicks or Pontiacs!!!!!!!!! These models are supposed to be upscale from Chevrolet. Why does a $24K Buick have caps, but a $20K Cobalt has nice 18" rims? $20K+ cars should all have rims. 17" rims should also be avalible on ALL Pontiacs, not just GTP/GXP editions. This is the excitment division. No matter what the car cost it should look execiting and sporty.
NO hubcaps on Buicks or Pontiacs!!!!!!!!! These models are supposed to be upscale from Chevrolet. Why does a $24K Buick have caps, but a $20K Cobalt has nice 18" rims? $20K+ cars should all have rims. 17" rims should also be avalible on ALL Pontiacs, not just GTP/GXP editions. This is the excitment division. No matter what the car cost it should look execiting and sporty.
03-17-2005, 05:28 PM
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Re: Things I'd suggest to fix GM.
Originally Posted by guionM
I don't like making hay if I can't make suggestions for fixing the problem.
6. Finally, if something works, don't screw with it.
Despite Holden being the only successful and profitable arm of General Motors right now, GM has been getting increasingly involved with them. Holden is starting to feel the influence of GM North America (Holden IS infact losing their station wagon... Ford Australia will be laughing to the bank!). Holden's profit margin on the new Zeta cars is starting to look like it's going to be thinner than their last group of cars. It's also starting to look like GM-NA may drop the UTE in the next edition as well.
6. Finally, if something works, don't screw with it.
Despite Holden being the only successful and profitable arm of General Motors right now, GM has been getting increasingly involved with them. Holden is starting to feel the influence of GM North America (Holden IS infact losing their station wagon... Ford Australia will be laughing to the bank!). Holden's profit margin on the new Zeta cars is starting to look like it's going to be thinner than their last group of cars. It's also starting to look like GM-NA may drop the UTE in the next edition as well.
Is that true??? WTF??? What imbecile decided to get rid of the wagon?? Do they realise how much Holden make on fleet sales with the wagon??? Also the UTE??? Holden need to bring Hannenberg out of retirement in Germany and **** that Yank off back to Cadillac.
03-17-2005, 05:29 PM
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Re: Things I'd suggest to fix GM.
At the end of the day it's pretty obvious to anyone who follows this forum that there are too many upper-middle-layer decison makers and it takes too many folk too damn long to approve or reject something. How about a setup where the top few people are making the decisons THEY see fit and then have the power to make sure stuff happens pronto. By all means realy on guys further down to gather your intelligence... but at the end of the day... the top men have to make hard decisions in public and go with those decisions and not have to p***y around appeasing some corporate 'board'.
All this f**king around - oh we're gonna do this platform / product, no we're not, yes we are, no we're not. Boll*cks!! The top executives like Wagner, Lutz and co. should have their hands completely untied from all the red-tape and crap, so they can just make the decisions they're paid large amounts of money to make and then stand by them and cut out the 'approved by committee' bul**** that seems to plague GM. And do something about these clueless nitwits who keep saying crap like 'There's no market for a [MODERN] RWD musclecar' and 'The Cobalt SS is today's ponycar'
which both Ford and Chysler are proving is a crock a crap.
This isn't a swipe at Lutz and Wagner at all... I'm just saying let them do their damn jobs instead of tieing their hands.
As for the Unions.. I don't think they really care what product their members are building (the whole CAW f-body thing is a weird one off case). Also, Ford and Chrysler also have to deal with Unions surely... yet they seem to be at least on the way up after some dicey times (but maybe I'm way off an that one).
End rant.
All this f**king around - oh we're gonna do this platform / product, no we're not, yes we are, no we're not. Boll*cks!! The top executives like Wagner, Lutz and co. should have their hands completely untied from all the red-tape and crap, so they can just make the decisions they're paid large amounts of money to make and then stand by them and cut out the 'approved by committee' bul**** that seems to plague GM. And do something about these clueless nitwits who keep saying crap like 'There's no market for a [MODERN] RWD musclecar' and 'The Cobalt SS is today's ponycar'
which both Ford and Chysler are proving is a crock a crap.This isn't a swipe at Lutz and Wagner at all... I'm just saying let them do their damn jobs instead of tieing their hands.
As for the Unions.. I don't think they really care what product their members are building (the whole CAW f-body thing is a weird one off case). Also, Ford and Chrysler also have to deal with Unions surely... yet they seem to be at least on the way up after some dicey times (but maybe I'm way off an that one).
End rant.
Last edited by Z28Marcus; 03-17-2005 at 06:22 PM.
03-17-2005, 05:31 PM
#6
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Re: Things I'd suggest to fix GM.
Originally Posted by Z28Marcus
At the end of the day it's pretty obvious to anyone who follow this forum that there are too many upper-middle-layer decison makers and it takes too many folk too damn long to approve or reject something. How about a setup where the top few people are making the decisons THEY see fit and then have the power to make sure stuff happens pronto. By all means realy on guys further down to gather your intelligence... but at the end of the day... the top men have to make hard decisions in public and go with those decisions and not p***y around.
All this f**king around - oh we're gonna do this platform / product, no we're not, yes we are, no we're not. Boll*cks!! The top executives like Wagner, Lutz and co. should have their hands completely untied from all the red-tape and crap, so they can just make the decisions they're paid large amounts of money to make and then stand by them and cut out the 'approved by committee' bul****.
End rant.
All this f**king around - oh we're gonna do this platform / product, no we're not, yes we are, no we're not. Boll*cks!! The top executives like Wagner, Lutz and co. should have their hands completely untied from all the red-tape and crap, so they can just make the decisions they're paid large amounts of money to make and then stand by them and cut out the 'approved by committee' bul****.
End rant.
EDIT : Some more info from www.ls1.com.au
http://www.ls1.com.au/forum/showthread.php?t=36963
Last edited by AnthonyHSV; 03-17-2005 at 05:44 PM.
03-17-2005, 05:53 PM
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Re: Things I'd suggest to fix GM.
Originally Posted by Z28x
I'd like to add...
NO hubcaps on Buicks or Pontiacs!!!!!!!!! These models are supposed to be upscale from Chevrolet. Why does a $24K Buick have caps, but a $20K Cobalt has nice 18" rims? $20K+ cars should all have rims. 17" rims should also be avalible on ALL Pontiacs, not just GTP/GXP editions. This is the excitment division. No matter what the car cost it should look execiting and sporty.
NO hubcaps on Buicks or Pontiacs!!!!!!!!! These models are supposed to be upscale from Chevrolet. Why does a $24K Buick have caps, but a $20K Cobalt has nice 18" rims? $20K+ cars should all have rims. 17" rims should also be avalible on ALL Pontiacs, not just GTP/GXP editions. This is the excitment division. No matter what the car cost it should look execiting and sporty.
03-17-2005, 06:13 PM
#9
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Re: Things I'd suggest to fix GM.
Better question is why does Kappa even exist...I would love to see how much the platform cost. Solstice is not Pontiac's halo car...GTO is..so why does it exist? Kappa is supposed to lose money...again...why? How many people you think the Solstice is going to pull into Pontiac dealerships? If it pulls people into dealerships...why do you want to sell them $20K Kappas in a showroom full of $25-$40K vehicles? Will it make a difference to justifty the cost? I hope Saturn gets it's new cars soon...It will be funny to see the look on peoples faces when they come into look at a Sky and see the rest of Saturn's lineup.
That being said...
Why is GM spending $5 Billion on Saturn? They say it is because Saturn has good customer service rankings...and current Saturn owners need something to move up to...but I say that is complet FUBAR. Take that $5 Billion and give Chevy cars that can compete with Honda and Toyota...not the current ones that are a grade below. Chevy is GM...yet they continue to build cheap cars that cater to people who have trouble paying their bills. Toyota is not having it's current succes by catering to that clientel. Chevy is a powerful brand...and GM needs to cash in on it. Cobalt is a good step in the right direction.
I also doubt there is a place in the Buick anymore. I really think their entire clientel would be happy with a nice big Chevy sedan like Toyota does with the Avalon, and Nissan with the Maxima. Yet GM is spending $3 Billion on revitalizing them.
Also, when GM redesigns a car, they do it on the cheap. The new Malibu was a $900 million dollar program. Sounds like a lot, but for spent $3 billion on the catfish Taurus in the early 90's. GM needs to put it's money where it's mouth is and design better cars.
That being said...
Why is GM spending $5 Billion on Saturn? They say it is because Saturn has good customer service rankings...and current Saturn owners need something to move up to...but I say that is complet FUBAR. Take that $5 Billion and give Chevy cars that can compete with Honda and Toyota...not the current ones that are a grade below. Chevy is GM...yet they continue to build cheap cars that cater to people who have trouble paying their bills. Toyota is not having it's current succes by catering to that clientel. Chevy is a powerful brand...and GM needs to cash in on it. Cobalt is a good step in the right direction.
I also doubt there is a place in the Buick anymore. I really think their entire clientel would be happy with a nice big Chevy sedan like Toyota does with the Avalon, and Nissan with the Maxima. Yet GM is spending $3 Billion on revitalizing them.
Also, when GM redesigns a car, they do it on the cheap. The new Malibu was a $900 million dollar program. Sounds like a lot, but for spent $3 billion on the catfish Taurus in the early 90's. GM needs to put it's money where it's mouth is and design better cars.
03-17-2005, 06:16 PM
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Re: Things I'd suggest to fix GM.
Originally Posted by AnthonyHSV
Is that true??? WTF??? What imbecile decided to get rid of the wagon?? Do they realise how much Holden make on fleet sales with the wagon??? Also the UTE??? Holden need to bring Hannenberg out of retirement in Germany and **** that Yank off back to Cadillac.
03-17-2005, 06:42 PM
#11
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Re: Things I'd suggest to fix GM.
Very good suggestions - the most practical I've seen. For the most part, GM cannot immediately take care of health costs and pensions. They can change there design process.
What is so depressing about GM is that anyone can see what is wrong with them except GM. How is it that GM has not had a major shakeup of its product developement process. If the Camaro makes it to production it will probably be by 2008 at the latest - they should have had one ready for about the year 2000.
This is the one aspect in which I'm a bit dissapointed in Lutz. I realize he's only one guy, but with Wagoner's backing, why didn't he just start cutting out the fat in the vehicle developement process?
What is so depressing about GM is that anyone can see what is wrong with them except GM. How is it that GM has not had a major shakeup of its product developement process. If the Camaro makes it to production it will probably be by 2008 at the latest - they should have had one ready for about the year 2000.
This is the one aspect in which I'm a bit dissapointed in Lutz. I realize he's only one guy, but with Wagoner's backing, why didn't he just start cutting out the fat in the vehicle developement process?
03-17-2005, 07:12 PM
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Re: Things I'd suggest to fix GM.
Originally Posted by dav305z
Very good suggestions - the most practical I've seen. For the most part, GM cannot immediately take care of health costs and pensions. They can change there design process.
What is so depressing about GM is that anyone can see what is wrong with them except GM. How is it that GM has not had a major shakeup of its product developement process. If the Camaro makes it to production it will probably be by 2008 at the latest - they should have had one ready for about the year 2000.
This is the one aspect in which I'm a bit dissapointed in Lutz. I realize he's only one guy, but with Wagoner's backing, why didn't he just start cutting out the fat in the vehicle developement process?
What is so depressing about GM is that anyone can see what is wrong with them except GM. How is it that GM has not had a major shakeup of its product developement process. If the Camaro makes it to production it will probably be by 2008 at the latest - they should have had one ready for about the year 2000.
This is the one aspect in which I'm a bit dissapointed in Lutz. I realize he's only one guy, but with Wagoner's backing, why didn't he just start cutting out the fat in the vehicle developement process?
It just makes no sense to me having a CEO with little to no power to restructure.
It's ludicrous having a product chairman needed to essentially be a firefighter, putting out issues that typically should be settled as part of the final approval.
And why in Gods name is a company with a mere 24% of the market (20% discounting rentals, fleet sales, and sales to those attached professionally to the company... numbers straight from business week!) running multiple divisions and cars that overlap?
I still think GM will get it together. If they can make it till 2008, not skimp on their upcoming products & fire ANYONE who suggests freezing ANY new vehicles currently in the pipeline as a way to save money, things should start getting better.
But looking seeing the changes at Holden is giving me alot of pause.
03-17-2005, 07:17 PM
#13
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Re: Things I'd suggest to fix GM.
From an assemblers point of view, don't skimp on materials. I've seen some really GOOD ideas for nought b/c of bargain materials, especially mechanical and interiors.
03-17-2005, 08:06 PM
#14
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Re: Things I'd suggest to fix GM.
Originally Posted by Z28x
I'd like to add...
NO hubcaps on Buicks or Pontiacs!!!!!!!!!
NO hubcaps on Buicks or Pontiacs!!!!!!!!!
On another note, I wonder how much money is spent "second guessing" decisions....paperwork, manhours...resources wasted...money wasted.
I'm a GM fan. Not because they're the best performing outfit out there, but because they have so much potential. They can do good products, they're putting some great stuff out now...and they can do better.
03-17-2005, 10:27 PM
#15
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Re: Things I'd suggest to fix GM.
Originally Posted by R377
Funny thing is, I had this exact thought with respect to Mercedes the other day. I was waiting to pull out from a gas station and a black Merc (the small, crappy ones) was on the street right in front of me waiting for a light to change. Having nothing to do but look at it, I noticed it had steelies and hubcaps. On a Mercedes! Talk about going downmarket! I wonder if you can even buy a Hyundai Sonata with steel rims anymore? To me that says a whole lot about what Mercedes is doing wrong nowadays.
