Lets see here...
MSRP
Deville DHS=$44,995
DTS= $49,595
Seville SLS= $46,095
STS= $50,405
CTS Base = $30, 345-$34,000 (no firm numbers on Cadillacs website.

That said, I don't think the CTS currently has many disadvantages to an STS, matter of fact it is a newer platform and is RWD. Compared to the rest of Cadilac's sedan lineup the CTS is almost outta place price wise and the expensive cars still sell well.

Actually you go as far as to say that the $50,000 CTS-V when comapared to other Cadillac's is on par pricewise or a steal....and the current base CTS is teh deal of the century. This is all relative to other Cadillac's which though as stated are expensive....sell well at that price level.

 

 

So if, say I rebodied a j-body, called it a "cimmeron" and charged $30,000 it would still be "in line with cadillac pricing" and wouldn't seem overpriced?

Charging a $20,000 premium for a performance package that is based on a pushrod (i.e. inexpensive) engine that can be purchased for $17,000 (including a pick-up truck) seems a bit overpriced to me. BTW, that $20K is an INCREMENTAL cost increase, since you don't get it in addition to the engine and transmission that is in the $30K base model.

At $40K, it's a screaming good deal.
At $45K it's a cool but pricy car.
At $50K it's overpriced.

 

I think Cadillacs as a whole are overpriced. I thought the CTS was their effort to have a decent car but still compete pricewise?

 

Damn its been a while since I've posted. Been too busy recently.

The CTS-V will be a low production car. Only a few thousand a year. Did anyone notice all the testing in Germany they did for that car? I'm guessing that the research and development costs for the CTS-V are very high since the original plan was to NOT have a V8 inside of it. a 3.6L turbo V6 was the original plan. These developmental costs will push the price high because it needs to be distributed over few few cars. I think $45-$50k will sound right. The engine may be a shelf part but test is not something you can pull from a Cavalier and write off as a zero cost. This is a much different car from a 70,000 unit a year f-body.

 

I didn't know they put an LS6 in a pickup! I'd like to pickup one of those $17,000 pickups with one in it!

 

The LS6 is based on the same engine used in the truck.

 

Don't think the CTS is in the same catagory as the Cimmaron. We aren't talking about an LS6 Cadillac "Impala" here.

Just the same, though it is a very pricey car which I'm not likely to buy, it is pretty unrealistic to think simply because it costs only $xxxx to produce a certain engine, the increase in price should also only be $xxxx when placed into a car.

Personally, I would have priced it about $45,000 (hey, afterall it's a Cadillac, not a Chevy!)

Just for comparisons, the BMW 540 6 speed runs $55,800, & the LS V8 about $43,000.

 

I think that the CTSv is "competitively priced", but I find it humorous that they took a $30K base vehicle, optioned it up to the $35-38K mark (which takes maybe $1000 of extra purchased parts), swapped out the stock powertrain for one that is much more powerful but no more expensive than the stock engine and tranny, and then marked it up an extra $15K. Ya gotta love marketing.

 

Ah, but compare prices to the BMW M5. Same horsepower numbers, after all, right?

 

Obviously the only reason you think this is becuase YOU CAN'T AFFORD ONE.

Look. Your paying for performance and the whole package. The sum of the package, not the parts themselves. And, for GM to set the price lower than 50K is STUPID. They are in the buisness to make money, and people will buy everyone made even at that price.

 

A fresh look at this: they are producing limited numbers of CTSv, only 3000 (or whatever it is).

They have a goal to sell all 3000. They can sell all of them for $42,000. And they can sell all of them for $52,000.

Since they don't have to worry about getting rid of those cars, they don't have to worry about price.

I can understand if they were producing 40,000 CTSv's per year for three or four consecuritive years, wanting to sell them all. Then it would be wise to reduce the price.

NOW, Since you would not be buying this car for $45,000 and since you're not buying it for $50,000 - stop complaining.

With such limited production numbers it makes as much sense to talk about price reduction as trying to reason with Ferrari to cut their prices from $200,000 to $170,000 so that MORE people could AFFORD it (but NOT necessarily buy it).

 

General Motors is not making Ferraris.

The fact that GM charges however much they can fleece the consumer for is kind of the point of discussion in another thread, fact of the matter is, just because they CAN charge more, doesn't mean I'm happy when they DO charge more. This is just going to lead into them saying "Oh, people would pay $35k for a Camaro SS, let's make the F5 $38k!"

The more the General is pricing themselves out of the market, the more likely they are to start overpricing the cars I particularly want, as well.

And as I've always said, I thought GM was supposed to give value.

 

The thing is...Cadillac's cars sell fine at that price level...ie. it's customers will pay $45-50,000 for thier cars. Imagine ging in a Cadillac dealer and looking at a $52,000 STS, then you see the CTS-v? For the prospective buyer (someone who can afford a $50,000 car) it is a good deal.

Chevy's entire V-line is based off a truck motor, and they are some if the smoothest most powerful engines made. I am sure Ford would kill for a V8 that could get 25-30 mpg on the highwat, be smaller a lighter than the modular engine, and still make 400+ HP without a supercharger. The LS6 is by no means low tech...and saying so just cause it has pushrods shows true ignorance.

The Sigma Chassis is among the most refined RWD chassis in the world and deserves no comparisions to the Cimmaron or J-body. Last time I checked BMW priced the 3 Series from the low $30,000's all the way up to $50,000+ for the M3, and thie owners aren't bitching. And at $30K with the CTS you get alot more car.

The sad bottom line is GM is a business. They have a winning car in the CTS-v that when compared to other cars in the showroom like the STS is a steal. It it marked up alot...maybe, will they still sell everyone of them?...You bet your *** they will.

 

To be honest, the CTS is in the same category as the Catera. Catera Touring Sedan, get it? As a Catera replacement, this car is an awkward size somewhere in between the 3 and 5-series BMW. Why, you might ask? It's because this car was originally an Opel Omega replacement, a car that would compete in the old Ford Granada market in Europe. An amazing design choice if you ask me, because this market segment died 5-years ago over there.

Is the CTSv a BMW-beater? In this country, my answer would be still be a no. It's too square and narrow in stance to feeling sporting, and the interior is still cheap looking. Worse yet, it's a Cadillac. However, in Europe it will be a real joke. Any CTS will be a car will zero prestige, zero credibility, and after a couple of years, near zero resale value.

Cadillac has alot to learn if they think that one $52k car will turn around their image, especially in the world beyond the United States. Even Lexus started at the ground floor, and that brand at least had Toyota reliability. If Cadillac want to take on Audi, BMW and Mercedes with a collection of "spare parts," they should at least price the CTSv a bit closer to it scrap value.

Now I can appreciate that GM, much like Superfly, is "trying to get over," but the CTSv is a bit too much for me to swallow. If a car has a warmed over Camaro motor and tranny, not to mention styling that's worse than a 1980 Seville, it shouldn't cost $50-large.