Ok, here's a topic loaded with landmines....but what the heck, it's been slow around here lately....so let's see some action!

Personally, I feel Pontiac did a much better job of leveraging their SLP connection than Chevy did.

 

Good post. My answer is no DEFINETLY. I think its stupid that they "needed" SLP (a performance parts company that overprices everything WAY TOO MUCH by the way) to make like 15 more HP, slightly change the appearance, and turn a Z28 (The top model Camaro legend) "into" an "SS" and making the Z28 take 2nd place. SS?? Why couldn't GM do it themselves?? Same with the RS. And they should have kept calling it Z28 SS IMO. If anything the SS should have been the 2nd place model sent out and modded into a Z28 or something. And even that would have been stupid. Next time GM, do it all yourselves like it was and like it should be, and get the models right. Keep in mind, for there to be a Camaro, Z28 is nessesary, SS is not. Give it (back) what it deserves.

 

When I think Chevy performance, those millions of SS cars pale in comparison to the mighty IROC-Z28 :-D Damned third gen Z28 fanatics. Not the world's fault that there's no third gen SS!

Anywho, I don't really think SLP was neccesary. GM could benefit from an internal performance group, like SVT, but I think it weakens their image to have to outsource the SS and such.

 

Maybe they don't compare in some ways. Me being a Third Gen dude though doesn't have much to do with my opinion on the SS thing. If you'll recall, there wasn't much SS in the 2nd Gen either, or in the begining of the 4th. And the 1st and early 2nd, well, the Z28 could take the bigger engined SS and handled better, being IMO the REAL top performance model. The car that became synonomous with and distinctly Camaro and created a history and legend with it. At least the IROC-Z28 was an upgraded Z28 that had real differences from the regular Z28 in engine choice, handling, looks, and performance options. It still upheld and promoted the Z28 name, even when they stopped making the regular Z28 for a few years. And all the work was done by GM. They did it right then. They used to anyway.

Definetly, I agree. But IMO they don't even need any1, just themselves to create performance options, more exciting models, interest, and Anniversary cars and Special Editions that have some kind of special performance AND looks. More than just a looks thing with really little performance differences, if there even are any.

 

M*I*L*L*I*O*N*S!!!!!!!!!..........


How many millions?!

 

I think Pontiac benefitted from it's association with SLP.

When SLP came out with the Firehawk it was good for Firebird and Pontiac immediately capitalized on it by bringing the program in house and giving us a new revitalized WS6 package.

I think when we look back on the 4th gen ,years from now, we will consider the WS6 TAs and Formulas as the definative 4th gens.

Running out of time now, but let's just say that I am far less impressed with the way Chevy handled their SLP connection..........

 

OK, please explain how SLP hurt the Camaro again? SLP was only doing what Chevy wanted out of the car. They created a nice looking package, and while some may argue its worth in the grand scheme of things I know of plenty of people who bought SS's and supported SLP and their products. Did you know that SLP puts on annual F-body shows, one of which I attended last year? Complete with drag racing events and nice prizes to the winners. SLP has been very supportive of the F-body community, actual content in their conversions notwithstanding. I guess my point is that perhaps you could argue that they didn't greatly help F-body but I, in no way, see how they hurt it.

And could we PUH-LEASE get off the Z28/SS thing. It's like a newspaper running the same %$#^ editorial every day for the past 6 months.

 

I agree w/ Z28Wilson...

I don't see how SLP hurt Camaro... about the only complaint I have heard about SS's compared to any other Camaro is the paint quality on the hood that they install...

And I've only heard that a few times...

 

continued........


......but suffice it to say that Pontiac used SLP as an effective tool to bring back a pretty nice WS6 package.

They didn't call it the SLP TransAm Esprit...later dropping TransAm from the name and calling it the Firebird Esprit...the"ultimate" Firebird. While at the same time trying to snuff out any image or heritage that Trans Am or Formula might have had for Pontiac.

......I think you guys can guess where I'm going with this.

 

I think SLP fit more in line with where Pontiac took the Trans Am than with Camaro.

I see Trans Am (and by association, Firebird) as a more flamboyant and upmarket f-body. SLP fit right in with that idea. But Camaro is not and never has been a flamboyant performance car, let alone an expensive one.

To those of you who own SS', don't take this as a slam against you or your cars, but I think that the whole concept of the SS Camaro is misguided from a historical and position standpoint, though both GM and SLP cleaned up financially on that car.

There is no way in creation that the equipment on that car justifies the markup, and the goods that that car does have historically was on the Z28. Hood scoop, low restriction exhaust, suspension geared toward maximum handling, it's all items that should have been Z28.

But also just as important, I question why GM couldn't do all this inhouse. Whenever you go to an outside source for something like this, I may be wrong, but I feel it would tend to make a vehicle more expensive.

 

Chevy would have had to authorize the use of the SS name and logo... so the call on the whole thing wasn't really SLP's... it was Chevy's...

I don't think Chevy or SLP 'tried' to snuff out the heritage of the Z28 name.

Plus it's not the first time... Remember the IROC-Z Z28 (85-87) ? The IROC-Z was a package added to the Z28... that later became the IROC-Z in 88,89 and 90 by itself. Z28 was dropped altogether.



A

 

Oh..let me make something clear...I'm not putting any blame on SLP. SLP was a supplier who was willing to take the finacial risk of developing an F-body package for GM to sign on to. GOOD FOR THEM!

I'm blaming GM for not capitalizing on it properly for the Camaro....and instead of gaining from it , they went down the path of alienating enthusiasts.

....I could never see Pontiac doing that!

 

Oh no, Darth? Let me tell you, from conversations I had with GM people at the time....I got the opposite impression. Not so much SLP in that regard but certainly Chevy.

If not for a letter writing campaign initiated at the time, the Z/28 might have been history.

The reason I may appear like a newspaper running the same editorial at times (as Z28 WILSON said), is I want Chevy to know that their is a hard core group of enthusiasts out there that hasn't forgotten Camaro's true heritage.....and next time we want them to get it right.

 

Personally , I think the Z28 name is more inportant to Camaro. I think it is unique to Camaro, and SS runs across many Chevy models.

Z28 has also been a part of Camaro for more model years.

However , to say that Chevy purposefully tried to ruin the Z28 name is really rather silly. They own the Z28 name ... why would you want intentionally try to ruin your own property?!

 

They own alot of names Darth.....and have done a poor job of protecting many of them.