SLP Engineering/Automotive Group Essentially Gone
Originally posted by 99SilverSS
And lets not forget how many times the 4th Gen Z28 or Trans Am was tested in major magazines?? Not many, 5-6 times in 9 years wasn't much. But the SS and Firehawk were tested several times and that helped to keep attention on the car. Did it help sales? I'd be hard pressed to say it hirt sales. With the Mustang selling nearly 2 to 1 vs F-body in the late years the SS and Firehawk were able to be different enough to get noticed by the media.
And lets not forget how many times the 4th Gen Z28 or Trans Am was tested in major magazines?? Not many, 5-6 times in 9 years wasn't much. But the SS and Firehawk were tested several times and that helped to keep attention on the car. Did it help sales? I'd be hard pressed to say it hirt sales. With the Mustang selling nearly 2 to 1 vs F-body in the late years the SS and Firehawk were able to be different enough to get noticed by the media.
Magazines will typically use a manufacturers' top model (regardless of it's name) for road tests....especially for comparos. Manufacturers, also, like to supply the press with their top models (regardless of it's name), for road tests. I can't really remember a magazine testing a Firehawk, WS6, Z28SS or SS more than once (not including the transition from LT1 to LS1) individually. They won't typically test the same car over and over every year, unless there is some significant change in a model.
The comparos are a different story. The Mustang VS Camaro shootout is a longstanding institution at many mags, (C&D, R&T, MT, etc.).
Certainly if no SS was available, the Z/28 would once again be pitted against the top Mustang.
The performance results....I suspect...would have been identical.
Last edited by Z284ever; Aug 22, 2003 at 12:57 AM.
That really sucks, they had good people over there at SLP Engineering. They always answered my questions and even helped me out with a "dealer" issue. I am very happy with the SLP options I got on my car. The staff over there genuinely cared about the cars that went thru there. I wonder if GM's Performance Division will be able to provide the level of attention when the Camaro returns.
Originally posted by Z284ever
Don't know if I really buy your premise. In fact, I think that it's abit of a reach.
Magazines will typically use a manufacturers' top model (regardless of it's name) for road tests....especially for comparos. Manufacturers, also, like to supply the press with their top models (regardless of it's name), for road tests. I can't really remember a magazine testing a Firehawk, WS6, Z28SS or SS more than once (not including the transition from LT1 to LS1) individually. They won't typically test the same car over and over every year, unless there is some significant change in a model.
The comparos are a different story. The Mustang VS Camaro shootout is a longstanding institution at many mags, (C&D, R&T, MT, etc.).
Certainly if no SS was available, the Z/28 would once again be pitted against the top Mustang.
The performance results....I suspect...would have been identical.
Don't know if I really buy your premise. In fact, I think that it's abit of a reach.
Magazines will typically use a manufacturers' top model (regardless of it's name) for road tests....especially for comparos. Manufacturers, also, like to supply the press with their top models (regardless of it's name), for road tests. I can't really remember a magazine testing a Firehawk, WS6, Z28SS or SS more than once (not including the transition from LT1 to LS1) individually. They won't typically test the same car over and over every year, unless there is some significant change in a model.
The comparos are a different story. The Mustang VS Camaro shootout is a longstanding institution at many mags, (C&D, R&T, MT, etc.).
Certainly if no SS was available, the Z/28 would once again be pitted against the top Mustang.
The performance results....I suspect...would have been identical.
YOur correct the magazines will take the top models of each car line to test. Unless the test is best bang for the buck. And in this case the SS is the top model for a Camaro. For Pontiac its debateable weather the WS6 or Firehawk was better or even worth mentioning.
And saying the results performance wase between the SS or a Z28 while close in a straight line. The SS has a bit more handling capaility, and thus a better example to test against the competition.
Last edited by 99SilverSS; Aug 22, 2003 at 08:55 AM.
Let me fine tune my post about SLP.
I'm not downplaying the "image boost" they did for Camaro, nor am I downplaying their quality of work, nor am I downing the people who worked there. What I am highlighting is that to say (as the primary post tried to) that SLP Camaro SSs are going to be ledgendary as other Camaros in history is pure hype, and nothing more.
2002 Camaro SSs typically go for around $22-25K around here (about $2K over regular Z28s). 2001 Mustang Cobras (there were no 2002's sold in the US) typically go for $23-25K out here, a good $2-8K more than regular GTs, and matching the 1 year newer SSs. What's worse, '99 SS typically go for the same price as '99 Mustang GTs out here.
Also, the SS looks exactly what the regular Z28 should look like. While the decision (somewhat misgided IMHO) was made to make the base model & Z28 look identical, SLP created a real Z28 look that the Camaro team lost track of. That's what the charm of the SS is, it steps in where the Camaro team failed in remembering that Z28 is much appearance as performance.
The odd thing is it seems now some have confused an appearence package with ledgendary cars with real performance upgrades, and that's a pretty sad state of affairs.
SLP made good looking quality Camaros, and kept a certain amount of intrest in the line. But in the end, $3,600 was way too much for what you got, and performance upgrades wasn't part of it.
I'm not downplaying the "image boost" they did for Camaro, nor am I downplaying their quality of work, nor am I downing the people who worked there. What I am highlighting is that to say (as the primary post tried to) that SLP Camaro SSs are going to be ledgendary as other Camaros in history is pure hype, and nothing more.
2002 Camaro SSs typically go for around $22-25K around here (about $2K over regular Z28s). 2001 Mustang Cobras (there were no 2002's sold in the US) typically go for $23-25K out here, a good $2-8K more than regular GTs, and matching the 1 year newer SSs. What's worse, '99 SS typically go for the same price as '99 Mustang GTs out here.
Also, the SS looks exactly what the regular Z28 should look like. While the decision (somewhat misgided IMHO) was made to make the base model & Z28 look identical, SLP created a real Z28 look that the Camaro team lost track of. That's what the charm of the SS is, it steps in where the Camaro team failed in remembering that Z28 is much appearance as performance.
The odd thing is it seems now some have confused an appearence package with ledgendary cars with real performance upgrades, and that's a pretty sad state of affairs.
SLP made good looking quality Camaros, and kept a certain amount of intrest in the line. But in the end, $3,600 was way too much for what you got, and performance upgrades wasn't part of it.
Originally posted by guionM
Also, the SS looks exactly what the regular Z28 should look like. While the decision (somewhat misgided IMHO) was made to make the base model & Z28 look identical, SLP created a real Z28 look that the Camaro team lost track of. That's what the charm of the SS is, it steps in where the Camaro team failed in remembering that Z28 is much appearance as performance.
Also, the SS looks exactly what the regular Z28 should look like. While the decision (somewhat misgided IMHO) was made to make the base model & Z28 look identical, SLP created a real Z28 look that the Camaro team lost track of. That's what the charm of the SS is, it steps in where the Camaro team failed in remembering that Z28 is much appearance as performance.
Before I say what I'm going to say.....I hereby EXCLUDE Red Planet from these comments .
Here goes....
As far as I personally could see...the brand team of the time had very little in what I would consider to be "Camaro Enthusiasm". Sure, they knew how to speak some superficial words....but a gut check would tell you that they could very easily replace the word "Camaro" with the word "Venture", with no other change in their syntax.
Some on the team displayed incredible lack of knowledge regarding the Camaro's history....and frankly, my impression was, that they could care less....they were merely "punching their ticket" until the next job came along.
Since the brand team also included Corvette...that's where many, "on the team" put their emphasis and interest. Doing things with "Corvette" would land them that choice sales job at Trucks...... Interest in Camaro was a one way ticket to career purgatory. So not too many people were interested.
These were the chaotic conditions which created the Camaro model re-alignment.The Smith/Zarella Brand Management strategy at GM was an undeniable failure. Maybe the Camaro was hurt worst of all.
Last edited by Z284ever; Aug 22, 2003 at 01:08 PM.
I really hope someone can answer my questions I posted before...
1) If auto group is closing, who is working on Thunderbolt, GTX, and GTO development?
2) If GTO gets farmed out like Firehawks did, won't these people magically have a job opening again?
I personally love SLP, and all I can say is while the performance difference was not substantial, the cars were well done, and obviously many people were willing to pay to have something different. And out here, an SS sells easily for 4k more than a Z28, model year to model year.
1) If auto group is closing, who is working on Thunderbolt, GTX, and GTO development?
2) If GTO gets farmed out like Firehawks did, won't these people magically have a job opening again?
I personally love SLP, and all I can say is while the performance difference was not substantial, the cars were well done, and obviously many people were willing to pay to have something different. And out here, an SS sells easily for 4k more than a Z28, model year to model year.
Originally posted by Jason E
1) If auto group is closing, who is working on Thunderbolt, GTX, and GTO development?
1) If auto group is closing, who is working on Thunderbolt, GTX, and GTO development?
Originally posted by Jason E
2) If GTO gets farmed out like Firehawks did, won't these people magically have a job opening again?
2) If GTO gets farmed out like Firehawks did, won't these people magically have a job opening again?
The LT1 / LT4 SS's were the same deal as the Firehawk, only after Chevrolet took the SS "in-house" starting with the 98 model year did SLP become a supplier to Chevrolet. They continued to offer "second sticker" Y2Y content installed simultaneously with the GM upgrades.
Furthermore, I believe that with the advent of the GM Performance Division, the intent at GM is to keep future performance products in house, relegating SLP to the aftermarket.
If anyone can correct or elaborate on this, I'd love to hear it.
I didn't mean the "farm out" comment the way it was taken...I know how the Hawks worked. I ordered some directly from SLP myself for dealer stock...10 total for '02...
I thought I read in either Motor Trend, or Automobile, that SLP was working on a package for the GTO, which included a Ram Air hood to make the '04 Goat owners happy...I KNOW I read that somewhere...is this wrong?
I thought I read in either Motor Trend, or Automobile, that SLP was working on a package for the GTO, which included a Ram Air hood to make the '04 Goat owners happy...I KNOW I read that somewhere...is this wrong?
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