Threxx

These two statements seem to contradict each other.

Z284ever

GM has a reputation to overcome for putting some pretty crappy "leather" in their cars. The 4th gen's was pretty pathetic. I will say that the leather in my CTS is several orders of magnitude better than that.

I drove a 2003 Ferrrari 360 Spyder at an auction last weekend. It had about 14,900 miles on it. It's leather was truly fantastic and showed virtually no wear. On the other hand, both the driver and passenger side window lift buttons had peeling paint, and on the auction stage, it overheated and nearly caught fire.

Pick your poison, I guess.

Threxx

Exotic/low-volume/hand-built cars are chock-full of problems like that. Being it's an Italian car I'd expect the leather to be great.

BTW, how much did it sell for at auction?

jg95z28

And that's just one of the reasons the Ferrari has a much steeper price tag. Don't get me wrong I love nice leather seats. However if you're suggesting GM needs to put Ferrari quality leather in their Chevrolet products, I'd have to say you're off your rocker. Perhaps in a $100k Blue Devil Corvette, but in a $30-40k Camaro?

Z284ever

It got up to $150,000 when it started to stink and smoke, at that point everyone stopped bidding. The owner wanted $180,000 for it.

JakeRobb

Interesting thread.

:subscribe:

Robert_Nashville

Which is perhaps why GM should consider a truly good cloth or, God forgive me, vinyl for its seats...if it's a choice between something that will wear well vs something that looks and smells good (for a while), I'll take the long wearing option every time.

Z284ever

I was merely pointing out the dichotomy of perfect leather seats and peeling power window buttons. BTW, the 360's seats were not power operated, they were adjusted manually. I liked that.

Patrick Davies

To be quite blunt, the "leather" in the 3rd and 4th Gen cars was a total joke, not worth anywhere near what the option cost.

Our other car is an Acura RSX (which is basically a nicely appointed Honda Civic coupe). Its leather is of a much higher quality than any of the "leather" GM used in the F-bodies. The RSX cost $28,000 Canadian brand new. The Firehawk listed for $38,000 (for the Trans Am) plus $7000 for SLP options. And its "leather" is more plastic than cow hide.

So I don't buy the "we put a low grade of leather in the Camaro/Firebird because otherwise the price would have to go up significantly" argument. Thats a lot of hogwash.

I think GM needs to find a new leather supplier.

Maybe find out where VW gets theirs (the leather in the Bug and Golf/Rabbit is just as good as that in the Acura, and a hundred times better than GM's).

(And while they are at it, maybe GM should find out who supplies VW and Acura with their interior plastics too).

jg95z28

If the seat height were also able to be adjusted manually, I'd prefer that as well. I have to set the leather power driver's seat on my Z28 all the way to the floor and all the way back. I can't even sit comfortably in the non-power passenger seat. (No height adjustment.)

blue 79 Z/28

another point i think people are missing as a factor of wear is, the lack of 'seat' under you. im sorry to say but i am a gm fan but if you have been in other cars especially japanese or german, you will agree that gm cant make a seat. its the lack of design and support/materials. the seats are made flimsy and have no supporrt or firmness comapired to competition. and its throughout the classes from cavaliers vs civics, to bmw/merc. vs caddy. one thing i hope gm does is outsource their seat/interior manufacturing to one of those companies lol then the cars will be a ton better. gm im telling you this now and its what every customer cares about! its the quality of the interior and the seat that makes a car. you got a sore butt on a crappy seat. its annoying and you forget everything else except how you hate to drive and listen to the squeaks cracks and rattles of the interior on a piece of foam on a wire frame numbing your butt lol my dad has a 98 regal GS supercharged with 40,000kms so about 25,000miles or so, and you cannot go more then an hour in the car without a painful butt, theres no positive feel just a flat non supportive seat with some foam. the car is immaculant and practically new condition to boot. also theres a crack or snap sound from the hard plastic under the window when it heats up or gets cooled. it creaks and snaps. and half the lights in the hvac have crapped it already. stuff like this shouldnt happen, but its nothing new to north american cars.

1. hard plastics are a NO NO, yet they creak their way into everything! 2. fasten stuff down, dont be afraid to use more then just a few plastic snaps, screw stuff down! bolt it, use 8000 fasteners. just dont make things lose! even our 05 2500HD silverado with 6000miles has a little rattle, a 2183rpm exhaust drone at a specific resonance that will make your eyeballs explode. and a lose door panel on the bottom 3. research the competition furiously, clearly they are doing something right, so see what it is and start to advance on it, improve improve improve!

i pray that the new camaro is good, if i hear one rattle, squeak, or crack or have a butt ache on a seat that doesnt add up to competition. ill drive it though the dealer window because theres no way i want to buy a cheap interior hahaha keep this in mind i can get a slightly used c55 amg for the same as a new camaro, and i will be compairing when the time comes

/rant

JakeRobb

That was a little overboard, if you ask me.

I own four GM cars, and the seats are all fine (it'd be nice if the GN had some more bolstering, but it's not uncomfortable). Better than the seats in the Honda Civic I used to own.

If you honestly think that now is the time for GM to start researching/thinking about build quality, material quality, rattles, and all of the other things you mentioned, you've been out of the loop for a long time.

Go check out an '07 Silverado, a CTS-V, a Saturn Aura, a C6 Corvette, and an '06 Impala LTZ.

Trust me, they've got it figured out. It's just that GM has more models to update (in the US market) than any other manufacturer. It'll take a couple more years for them to get all the way through each of their lineups, but the newest redesigned models are all right up there with the competition.

blue 79 Z/28

umm our 05 silverado is the same as an 07 practically. and yes ive seen all those cars, and im sorry to say but a cts-v has NOTHING on a bmw or merc. ive been in all of them and there is a huge gap there. i guess its just in how picky you are. and tastes. my family has owned countless GM vehicles, in the dozens. but its getting tiring watching the competition pull away year after year. in case you havent noticed the market shows us this in a general consensus and its not just gm but NA manufacurers in general.

GRNcamaro

the 07 classic is the same as your 05 the new 07 is differenthttp://www.chevrolet.com/silverado/

JakeRobb

Your '05 is based on the older GMT800 platform. As of the 2007 model year, GM trucks (aside from the "classic" pickup truck models, as mentioned) are now based on the ground-up redesigned GMT900 platform. It's better in pretty much every way, and is absolutely as good as any other truck platform on the market right now.

Has your family owned countless 2006 or 2007 GM models that are freshly redesigned? I doubt it. If you actually read the content of my post, rather than deciding that I'm a GM fanboy that thinks they have never done anything wrong, you'll see that I agreed with you that their cars needed work.

The part of your post I took issue with is the part where you say GM needs to research the competition and see what they're doing, as if you think they're not already doing that.

The 2007 models I listed, plus the 2006 Impala, have been redesigned, and based on these cars, it's obvious that GM is turning things around already.