Saturn L likely to be cancelled this year
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Saturn L likely to be cancelled this year
Redesigned just last year & the plant is running at 22% of capacity, sales down 78% from the same month last year, dealers have a 151 day supply!
http://www.detnews.com/2004/autosins.../d01-77424.htm
And the Aztec has had a longer lifespan?
http://www.detnews.com/2004/autosins.../d01-77424.htm
And the Aztec has had a longer lifespan?
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I don't know much about the L-Series...why has it been such a disaster? It isn't a bad looking car, comes with a nice V6, right? Is it price or is it just the odd-man out in a flooded midsize market?
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When production of the L-300 does end, the Wilmington plant will be retooled to build the 2006 Pontiac Solstice, a two-seat convertible. At January’s North American International Auto Show in Cobo Center, GM unveiled the Saturn Sky and Chevrolet Nomad concept vehicles, which are built on the same basic structure as the Solstice — the Kappa architecture in GM parlance. The automaker has said it is likely a similarly-based vehicle will be added to the Saturn lineup.
So what is going to be the Saturn Kappa car?
So what is going to be the Saturn Kappa car?
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Originally posted by jawzforlife
When production of the L-300 does end, the Wilmington plant will be retooled to build the 2006 Pontiac Solstice, a two-seat convertible. At January’s North American International Auto Show in Cobo Center, GM unveiled the Saturn Sky and Chevrolet Nomad concept vehicles, which are built on the same basic structure as the Solstice — the Kappa architecture in GM parlance. The automaker has said it is likely a similarly-based vehicle will be added to the Saturn lineup.
So what is going to be the Saturn Kappa car?
When production of the L-300 does end, the Wilmington plant will be retooled to build the 2006 Pontiac Solstice, a two-seat convertible. At January’s North American International Auto Show in Cobo Center, GM unveiled the Saturn Sky and Chevrolet Nomad concept vehicles, which are built on the same basic structure as the Solstice — the Kappa architecture in GM parlance. The automaker has said it is likely a similarly-based vehicle will be added to the Saturn lineup.
So what is going to be the Saturn Kappa car?
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Re: Saturn L likely to be cancelled this year
Originally posted by guionM
Redesigned just last year & the plant is running at 22% of capacity, sales down 78% from the same month last year, dealers have a 151 day supply!
http://www.detnews.com/2004/autosins.../d01-77424.htm
And the Aztec has had a longer lifespan?
Redesigned just last year & the plant is running at 22% of capacity, sales down 78% from the same month last year, dealers have a 151 day supply!
http://www.detnews.com/2004/autosins.../d01-77424.htm
And the Aztec has had a longer lifespan?
Also since production is ending early, does that mean Solstice will start early?
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Re: Re: Saturn L likely to be cancelled this year
Originally posted by Z28x
it came out in 1999 so 2005 is 7 model years, thats not too bad, Isn't the Aztek died after this year too?
it came out in 1999 so 2005 is 7 model years, thats not too bad, Isn't the Aztek died after this year too?
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Re: Re: Re: Saturn L likely to be cancelled this year
Originally posted by jawzforlife
It came out in 1999, but was just redesigned last year.
It came out in 1999, but was just redesigned last year.
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Re: Re: Saturn L likely to be cancelled this year
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Z28x
Also since production is ending early, does that mean Solstice will start early?
________________________
I would say the chances are very good for an early Solstice start since L series is the only car built there. Supposedly some solstice's were run through the wilmington plant late last year.
Fwd and rwd spaceframe cars can be built on the same line, so I dont believe retooling will be as lengthy as at another plant. Hydroforming the frame rails will be new at this plant, but is already done elsewhere.
The first saturn fwd prototypes were built on the rwd fiero line.
The fiero project manager Hulki Aldikati mentioned that it would have only required one hour to change the lines over if production saturns and fieros would have been built in the same plant. Note to GM: Hulki would be the perfect person to oversee the kappa development, in fact he should be a vice pres. of the company.
Also since production is ending early, does that mean Solstice will start early?
________________________
I would say the chances are very good for an early Solstice start since L series is the only car built there. Supposedly some solstice's were run through the wilmington plant late last year.
Fwd and rwd spaceframe cars can be built on the same line, so I dont believe retooling will be as lengthy as at another plant. Hydroforming the frame rails will be new at this plant, but is already done elsewhere.
The first saturn fwd prototypes were built on the rwd fiero line.
The fiero project manager Hulki Aldikati mentioned that it would have only required one hour to change the lines over if production saturns and fieros would have been built in the same plant. Note to GM: Hulki would be the perfect person to oversee the kappa development, in fact he should be a vice pres. of the company.
Last edited by gtjeff; Mar 4, 2004 at 10:46 PM.
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Re: Re: Re: Saturn L likely to be cancelled this year
Originally posted by gtjeff
The first saturn fwd prototypes were built on the rwd fiero line.
The fiero project manager Hulki Adacti mentioned that it would have only required one hour to change the lines over if production saturns and fieros would have been built in the same plant. Note to GM: Hulki would be the perfect person to oversee the kappa development, in fact he should be a vice pres. of the company.
The first saturn fwd prototypes were built on the rwd fiero line.
The fiero project manager Hulki Adacti mentioned that it would have only required one hour to change the lines over if production saturns and fieros would have been built in the same plant. Note to GM: Hulki would be the perfect person to oversee the kappa development, in fact he should be a vice pres. of the company.
The 1st Saturn coupe test mule was built in October 1987 by the same group at the same place.
The 1st Saturn 4 door prototype was made in June 1988 and the coupe was made in September 1988. It wasn't made at the Fiero plant. Try GM Tech Center.
The pre-production sedan was made at the Saturn plant in March 1989 with the 1st coupe made in November. It was made at Spring Hill, not at the Fiero plant.
Fiero was assembled by a massive single purpose machine (biggest single assembly machine at the time if I remember correctly) that precisely put all the stamped steel subframe in position & welded it all together simultaneously, and an equally large machine precisely positioned the structure and simultaneously drilled all the mounting points for the plastic body panels.
You could not assemble anything but Fiero structures in this machine. I also don't believe that Hulki Aldikati ever said anything about it taking an hour to convert a plant to produce both Fieros & Saturns, knowing whats involved in just adding an engine option, let alone an entirely different structure.
I know you are a Fiero enthusiast, and I like the cars myself. But spaceframes aren't the cure-all for the auto industry. Saying that all spaceframes are the same & can be built on the same assembly line is like saying Ford can convert an F150 plant to also make Lincoln Town Cars because they are both body on frame designs.
The basic proportions of the base 2M4 car remained the same in this new design; remember, since the plasic panels bolted to the space frame, no major deviations were possible without changing the space frame itself.
Technically, you can say Fiero was a unibody, not a spaceframe. Corvette & Solstice are genuine spaceframe cars, as is the Viper & the Ford GT.
Fiero is called a spaceframe because it's inner unibody carries the structure's load, while on a Camaro the rear fender skin is part of the body & carries loads.
Finally, being that the Solstice is done already, and is in a way a scale model of the Corvette than a Saturn, I don't think Hulki Aldikati will be involved there. He has moved on to greater things (it has been over 20 years since he had a hand in Fiero).
Especially since he became Chevrolet's Chief Vehicle Engineer in 1983, left to become president of Entech in 1986 & was tapped as an advisor for Saturn's vice president of engineering in 1990 (because of the plastic on body assembly engineering.... GM is perfectly capable of creating a unibody, er... spaceframe on their own).
Again, Fiero is a great car. Pontiac engineered it to accept larger engines in the future, and planned to do just that. But the car was engineered that way.
It wasn't because of some magical ability of spaceframes.
Last edited by guionM; Mar 2, 2004 at 07:56 PM.
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I had a few minutes and wanted to post what is written about Fiero's assembly.
"
"
http://www.fierofocus.com/articles/a...o-history.html
Fiero was innovative from a manufacturing standpoint. Though is was in essence a unibody, it's assembly and quality was groundbreaking.
Solstice is innovative from a development standpoint. Though the basic car itself exists already in Corvette form, it's speed and money saving methods of development and built in flexibility is also groundbreaking.
"
...Three basic modular subassemblies (front, rear and compartment floor) are welded together as the first step in the assembly process. The remaining substructures are attached in a single framing station, using the Single-Tool concept. While in this single tool weldment, the space-frame is automatically pierced so that "net" attachment points for other chassis components (such as the cradle for the engine/drivetrain) are precisely made...
One of the assembly steps that ensures precise fit of the body panels is the Milling and Drilling of the Fiero's space frame. The "mill and drill" machine is a single fixture that prepares the space-frame for the location of the body panels. This is achieved by machining, or "milling", 39 separate body mount pads located on various points of the space-frame. The machine also uses a "master" gage point on the door frame ring to locate all the holes on the mounting pads for precise "drilling". This process is a worldwide industry first.
One of the assembly steps that ensures precise fit of the body panels is the Milling and Drilling of the Fiero's space frame. The "mill and drill" machine is a single fixture that prepares the space-frame for the location of the body panels. This is achieved by machining, or "milling", 39 separate body mount pads located on various points of the space-frame. The machine also uses a "master" gage point on the door frame ring to locate all the holes on the mounting pads for precise "drilling". This process is a worldwide industry first.
http://www.fierofocus.com/articles/a...o-history.html
Fiero was innovative from a manufacturing standpoint. Though is was in essence a unibody, it's assembly and quality was groundbreaking.
Solstice is innovative from a development standpoint. Though the basic car itself exists already in Corvette form, it's speed and money saving methods of development and built in flexibility is also groundbreaking.