Really why the F-Body died?
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Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 4,306
From: Jersey Shore
Re: Really why the F-Body died?
Originally Posted by redzed
Compare the shape of the Malibu Maxx to a 1981 Escort and I think you'll see the inspiration. The Maxx is a dismal design with poor packaging priorities.
I dont like Mustangs (as we all know) but I think the last gen was MUCH nicer looking then the 4th gen Camaros.
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Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 416
Re: Really why the F-Body died?
big al...how in the world could you say that a 4th gen is ugly???? Bland maybe, but ugly...Most definitely not, however, the third gen ROFLMAO that was just 4 wheels and an excuse. Those things are uglier than the fox body mustangs. Atleast with the 4th gens they had ***** to back up their looks....cant say that for third gens 
Registered User
Joined: Sep 2001
Posts: 1,308
From: Calgary
Re: Really why the F-Body died?
huh--I think 3rd and 4th gens looks great. A thirdgen IROC-Z holds a slight edge for me-seeing the dashboard move and ride harshness suck though. But I can see the hood.
4th gens are much tighter and ride better--can't see the hood and the wipers are not hidden at all.
And for the day they were made in--thirdgens backed up there looks just fine--performance wise. The 305 auto in LG4/L03/LB9 variations, kinda sucked though--but the 350 TPI and 305 TPI 5 speed were great. IN fact--they should have been the only engines in the IROC, Trans Am/Formula.
4th gens are much tighter and ride better--can't see the hood and the wipers are not hidden at all.
And for the day they were made in--thirdgens backed up there looks just fine--performance wise. The 305 auto in LG4/L03/LB9 variations, kinda sucked though--but the 350 TPI and 305 TPI 5 speed were great. IN fact--they should have been the only engines in the IROC, Trans Am/Formula.
Thread Starter
Registered User
Joined: Feb 1999
Posts: 2,947
From: Springfield,OH. U.S.A.
Re: Really why the F-Body died?
It's not just a conspiracy theory, it's a prospect....A theory says, "If I buy a Lotto ticket I could win a million dollars", once I buy the ticket however, it's NO LONGER A THEORY!!!but a prospect.(Altho this was made in "jest" there IS SOME PROSPECT TO THE IDEA....)
GM doesn't have a heart to care about anyone, this is BS, they HAD TO REMAIN IN PRODUCTION and relocate, retrain per agreements with the CAW and Canadian Govt. An agreement which they broke anyways and owed Canada some $300 MILL for, and was the reason they didin't withdraw from Canada completely...but expanded operations elsewhere.
Don't believe the headlines, there's way more that went on behind the scenes that has only recently been surfacing..
Another "Goodwill " display toward the CAW workers in that area 
, to ensure they couldn't be forced to honor their agreements..
Yes, I'll bet there is! 
http://www.caw.ca/news/videonews/arc...ike_Impact.asp
http://www.caw.ca/news/videonews/arc...ant_Future.asp
http://www.caw.ca/news/videonews/arc...Pact_Lobby.asp
http://www.caw.ca/news/videonews/arc...trike_Over.asp
http://www.caw.ca/news/videonews/archive_index.asp
July 29, 1999 
GM DID NOT DO ANYTHING TO GET OUT OF THEIR CAW CONTRACT!!!!
GM lived up to every part of their contract with the CAW over the Ste. Therese plant......and then some!!
GM extended production of the F-body long after it was practical, for those layed off GM provided a pension or job placement. GM also worked with the local and provincial governments for over a year to find a buyer or another use for the plant, GM gave quite a bit of money to local colleges and entities to help develop other businesses and education in the area, and lastly (but not finally) GM EXPANDED employment at their Oshawa Canada plants that more than offset the job losses at Ste. Therese.
GM lived up to every part of their contract with the CAW over the Ste. Therese plant......and then some!!
GM extended production of the F-body long after it was practical, for those layed off GM provided a pension or job placement. GM also worked with the local and provincial governments for over a year to find a buyer or another use for the plant, GM gave quite a bit of money to local colleges and entities to help develop other businesses and education in the area, and lastly (but not finally) GM EXPANDED employment at their Oshawa Canada plants that more than offset the job losses at Ste. Therese.
Don't believe the headlines, there's way more that went on behind the scenes that has only recently been surfacing..
They also made a point of bulldozing the F-body plant as soon as they could.
, to ensure they couldn't be forced to honor their agreements..
Finally, there's good reason GM isn't talking about a future Camaro.
While GM makes a record 6.7 billion dollars US in 1997, there still is no word on the future of the St. Therese plant, nor of a second model for the facility
Buzz Hargrove,
CAW National President
"Once people start looking at this company, remember it's still the largest company on the fortune 500 list with $178 billion in revenue last year. It made $23 billion in profit since 1993, a five-year period, that's not a bad place to have your money given the environment around the world today. So there'll be some short term concern and moving away from GM but long term, GM is going to be around , they'll be strong".
CAW National President
"Once people start looking at this company, remember it's still the largest company on the fortune 500 list with $178 billion in revenue last year. It made $23 billion in profit since 1993, a five-year period, that's not a bad place to have your money given the environment around the world today. So there'll be some short term concern and moving away from GM but long term, GM is going to be around , they'll be strong".
http://www.caw.ca/news/videonews/arc...ant_Future.asp
http://www.caw.ca/news/videonews/arc...Pact_Lobby.asp
http://www.caw.ca/news/videonews/arc...trike_Over.asp
Hargrove says the strike and all of the hardship it created throughout North America, could have been avoided if GM had only listened to the needs of its workers in Flint and not the advice of Wall Street analysts. He feels GM underestimated the strength of the UAW and the militancy of the American autoworker
Buzz Hargrove
CAW National President
"The companies are making incredible profits because of the efforts of our members. Our quality, our productivity, our efforts to reduce waste, to control costs, are unprecedented in the industry at all three companies.
Our success should mean we can do our bargaining this time without any sacrifice on the part of our membership by having to go to the street to support their just demands.
Wages are an issue for our members in the plant. We've earned the right to improve substantially our wages, our cost of living, time off the job is absolutely key."
CAW National President
"The companies are making incredible profits because of the efforts of our members. Our quality, our productivity, our efforts to reduce waste, to control costs, are unprecedented in the industry at all three companies.
Our success should mean we can do our bargaining this time without any sacrifice on the part of our membership by having to go to the street to support their just demands.
Wages are an issue for our members in the plant. We've earned the right to improve substantially our wages, our cost of living, time off the job is absolutely key."
Last edited by 90rocz; Feb 21, 2005 at 01:57 AM.
Thread Starter
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Joined: Feb 1999
Posts: 2,947
From: Springfield,OH. U.S.A.
Re: Really why the F-Body died?
Ok GM Getting involved with Holden????? GM has owned Holden for a very LONG time. They just decided it was about time they imported some of the stuff they have over there.
Registered User
Joined: Mar 2001
Posts: 13,713
From: The Golden State
Re: Really why the F-Body died?
Originally Posted by 90rocz
GM doesn't have a heart to care about anyone, this is BS, they HAD TO REMAIN IN PRODUCTION and relocate, retrain per agreements with the CAW and Canadian Govt. An agreement which they broke anyways and owed Canada some $300 MILL for, and was the reason they didin't withdraw from Canada completely...but expanded operations elsewhere.
Don't believe the headlines, there's way more that went on behind the scenes that has only recently been surfacing..
Don't believe the headlines, there's way more that went on behind the scenes that has only recently been surfacing..
Registered User
Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 2,472
From: South Bend, Indiana
Re: Really why the F-Body died?
Originally Posted by Big Als Z
I dont like Mustangs (as we all know) but I think the last gen was MUCH nicer looking then the 4th gen Camaros.
Fawk you Al, 4th gen Camaro's are among the most beautiful vehicles, or objects of any kind for that matter, to ever be created. I am right, you are wrong. The end....and your mom is fat.
Originally Posted by 90rocz
It's not just a conspiracy theory, it's a prospect....A theory says, "If I buy a Lotto ticket I could win a million dollars", once I buy the ticket however, it's NO LONGER A THEORY!!!but a prospect.(Altho this was made in "jest" there IS SOME PROSPECT TO THE IDEA....)
GM doesn't have a heart to care about anyone, this is BS, they HAD TO REMAIN IN PRODUCTION and relocate, retrain per agreements with the CAW and Canadian Govt. An agreement which they broke anyways and owed Canada some $300 MILL for, and was the reason they didin't withdraw from Canada completely...but expanded operations elsewhere.
Don't believe the headlines, there's way more that went on behind the scenes that has only recently been surfacing..
Another "Goodwill " display toward the CAW workers in that area , to ensure they couldn't be forced to honor their agreements..
Yes, I'll bet there is!
http://www.caw.ca/news/videonews/arc...ike_Impact.asp
http://www.caw.ca/news/videonews/arc...ant_Future.asp
http://www.caw.ca/news/videonews/arc...Pact_Lobby.asp
http://www.caw.ca/news/videonews/arc...trike_Over.asp
http://www.caw.ca/news/videonews/archive_index.asp
July 29, 1999
GM doesn't have a heart to care about anyone, this is BS, they HAD TO REMAIN IN PRODUCTION and relocate, retrain per agreements with the CAW and Canadian Govt. An agreement which they broke anyways and owed Canada some $300 MILL for, and was the reason they didin't withdraw from Canada completely...but expanded operations elsewhere.
Don't believe the headlines, there's way more that went on behind the scenes that has only recently been surfacing..
Another "Goodwill " display toward the CAW workers in that area
, to ensure they couldn't be forced to honor their agreements..Yes, I'll bet there is!
http://www.caw.ca/news/videonews/arc...ike_Impact.asp
http://www.caw.ca/news/videonews/arc...ant_Future.asp
http://www.caw.ca/news/videonews/arc...Pact_Lobby.asp
http://www.caw.ca/news/videonews/arc...trike_Over.asp
http://www.caw.ca/news/videonews/archive_index.asp
July 29, 1999
Registered User
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 1,881
Re: Really why the F-Body died?
Originally Posted by Meccadeth
Fawk you Al, 4th gen Camaro's are among the most beautiful vehicles, or objects of any kind for that matter, to ever be created. I am right, you are wrong. The end....and your mom is fat.
Holy crap!
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Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 254
Re: Really why the F-Body died?
Originally Posted by Big Als Z
Here is the truth...I killed the fbody. I had to put it out of its missery cause the 4th gens are so damn ugly.
Registered User
Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 2,472
From: South Bend, Indiana
Re: Really why the F-Body died?
Originally Posted by falchulk
Would you mind telling me the cause for your "holy crap"? I read it all, hell I knew about it before but I still cant draw a line between that and why the fbody died.
Registered User
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 178
Re: Really why the F-Body died?
To get back to an earlier post, could somebody explain to me the difference in safety features between an '02 Mustang & the '03 & '04 models? as far as I know they're the same & don't incorporate the A-pillar airbags. So, if the Mustang didn't need them then why did the F-bods? It's a shame the 4th gens couldn't get those last 2 years. I would have liked to have seen the Firebird go out with a 35th Anniversary Trans Am with an LS-6 engine & ZO6 front brakes! That would have been the ULTIMATE killer & collectible Firebird. 
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