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A question for Red Planet

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Old Dec 2, 2005 | 06:09 AM
  #1  
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A question for Red Planet

With the tension about the anticipated unveiling of the Camaro concept being built up so thick that you could pretty much cut it with a knife at this point, I thought I'd take the opportunity to ask a question that I, (and I think a few others), have been wondering about for quite some time.

It's been said in the past that there is just as strong an enthusiast base within GM as there is in the private sector, so I imagine the reaction over the upper management's announcement to resurrect the Camaro would have been similar to one of ***** Wonka's Golden Tickets being dropped into the middle of GM headquarters. That being said, how was the creative process of a project of this magnitude governed? Did Bob Lutz line everyone up outside his office door, bring them in one at a time, and ask them each why they thought they were worthy to work on his beloved Camaro?
Was it more of a rank and file type mandate where the senior guys who have been involved in projects like this in the past got first dibs? Did they all gather round Bob and take turns drawing straws? Or did Bob just tell the entire design team, "Ok folks, it's open season, show me the best you've got?" I'd appreciate you sharing as much as you feel comfortable with...
Old Dec 2, 2005 | 07:15 AM
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Re: A question for Red Planet

I dont belive he is gunna answer it here, but it will be in his much famed book that is coming out "Camaros are from Mars, Mustangs are for Pussies"....or something like that.
I belive that it started from the original team coming up with ideas back from the late 90's for a 5th gen. After the call was made to can it, Im sure that there was always a set of designers and engineers (as well as a certain man from Mars) that were still in love with this car, and kept pushing design ideas, and trying to create ways to fit Camaro back into the budget and get them back on the road. I think that with the help of several people at the top, they finaly got what they wanted, on top of outside pressure to create a name plate that for the past and most recent 35 years, has formed a very large enthusiasts base.
I belive thats the jist of it, the "real" story will hit bookshelves by 08?
Old Dec 2, 2005 | 10:51 AM
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Re: A question for Red Planet

"Camaros are from Mars, Mustangs are for Pussies"

Well, thesoundandthefury, there's at least one employee of GM that drives a 1st gen around from time to time, or so I've heard, and I believe another designer owns one as well.

Most of the designers for GM work on ALL of the GM cars, it's not like they just had one guy do it, they all contribute I believe. I've been trying to figure out who drew the actual designs for the 4th gen (which I haven't been able to find/see) for years without success. Apparently, there were so many people involved with the project, and so many recommendations being made, that the idea was changed multiple times. (With a lot of success I might add, because those '93 to '97 Camaros are some of the most beautiful, and unique looking cars ever designed).

Tom Peters is credited for designing the C6 by many people, but I believe John Cafaro is the chief designer for the Camaro and Corvette, and has been for over a decade. I believe Jerry Palmer is retired, but he was the executive director of design. Irvin W. Rybicki was the vice presidents of design back in the 80s and worked on the 3rd gen... and that's about the only people I know of.

If GM starts handing out golden tickets to see the Camaro, I want to be the first in line .
Old Dec 2, 2005 | 11:46 AM
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Re: A question for Red Planet

Originally Posted by Brangeta
"Camaros are from Mars, Mustangs are for Pussies"

Well, thesoundandthefury, there's at least one employee of GM that drives a 1st gen around from time to time, or so I've heard, and I believe another designer owns one as well.

Most of the designers for GM work on ALL of the GM cars, it's not like they just had one guy do it, they all contribute I believe. I've been trying to figure out who drew the actual designs for the 4th gen (which I haven't been able to find/see) for years without success. Apparently, there were so many people involved with the project, and so many recommendations being made, that the idea was changed multiple times. (With a lot of success I might add, because those '93 to '97 Camaros are some of the most beautiful, and unique looking cars ever designed).

Tom Peters is credited for designing the C6 by many people, but I believe John Cafaro is the chief designer for the Camaro and Corvette, and has been for over a decade. I believe Jerry Palmer is retired, but he was the executive director of design. Irvin W. Rybicki was the vice presidents of design back in the 80s and worked on the 3rd gen... and that's about the only people I know of.

If GM starts handing out golden tickets to see the Camaro, I want to be the first in line .
Carafo headed 4th gen Camaro development in the Chevy II studio, it is mentioned in ACAR.
Old Dec 2, 2005 | 01:01 PM
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Re: A question for Red Planet

Originally Posted by Brangeta


Tom Peters is credited for designing the C6 by many people, but I believe John Cafaro is the chief designer for the Camaro and Corvette, and has been for over a decade. I believe Jerry Palmer is retired, but he was the executive director of design. Irvin W. Rybicki was the vice presidents of design back in the 80s and worked on the 3rd gen... and that's about the only people I know of.
Cafaro was on design for trucks after C5, the last I heard. Peters had a lot to do with C6.... make no mistake.

Wayne Cherry was succeeded by Ed Welburn as head of Global design in 2005.

Lutz has a LOT of final say.
Old Dec 2, 2005 | 01:29 PM
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Re: A question for Red Planet

Originally Posted by 91_z28_4me
Carafo headed 4th gen Camaro development in the Chevy II studio, it is mentioned in ACAR.
Do you remember the quote from Tom Peters in ACAR, when discussing his concept that lost out to Cafaros, the subject of exposed headlights came up. Tom said something to the effect of, exposed headlights are not right for a Corvette, pop ups are Corvette tradition, ect. But of course, exposed headlights ended up being part of his C6 design. Not trying to flame him or anything, it was just kind of a funny quote coming from him when I re read it. I don't think theres any questioning the performance of the fixed lights over the popups that they replaced.
Old Dec 2, 2005 | 03:01 PM
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Re: A question for Red Planet

Originally Posted by thesoundandthefury
With the tension about the anticipated unveiling of the Camaro concept being built up so thick that you could pretty much cut it with a knife at this point, I thought I'd take the opportunity to ask a question that I, (and I think a few others), have been wondering about for quite some time.

It's been said in the past that there is just as strong an enthusiast base within GM as there is in the private sector, so I imagine the reaction over the upper management's announcement to resurrect the Camaro would have been similar to one of ***** Wonka's Golden Tickets being dropped into the middle of GM headquarters. That being said, how was the creative process of a project of this magnitude governed? Did Bob Lutz line everyone up outside his office door, bring them in one at a time, and ask them each why they thought they were worthy to work on his beloved Camaro?
Was it more of a rank and file type mandate where the senior guys who have been involved in projects like this in the past got first dibs? Did they all gather round Bob and take turns drawing straws? Or did Bob just tell the entire design team, "Ok folks, it's open season, show me the best you've got?" I'd appreciate you sharing as much as you feel comfortable with...
Not going to steal Red's thunder (in the unlikely even he answers your question before Camaro's unveiling), but the basic design for a 5th gen Camaro was created years ago.

To make matters worse, alot of the ideas were hidden in plain sight as "concept" cars.

I suspect there will be alot of areas of familiarity when we see the car.
Old Dec 2, 2005 | 03:28 PM
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Re: A question for Red Planet

so were getting something that MIGHT..and I say MIGHT look dated?? like the SSR..we saw it how long before and now were like .."ehh"..and we have seen the twig and berries of the 5th gen splattered all over GM's concepts..to me this could sound like another SSR, weve seen it already car with no real bang.
case in point, the Dodge Challenger...awsome car and looks great but we have seen it before....

know what IM saying?
Old Dec 2, 2005 | 04:50 PM
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Re: A question for Red Planet

Originally Posted by guionM
Not going to steal Red's thunder (in the unlikely even he answers your question before Camaro's unveiling), but the basic design for a 5th gen Camaro was created years ago.

To make matters worse, alot of the ideas were hidden in plain sight as "concept" cars.

I suspect there will be alot of areas of familiarity when we see the car.
So in other words you mean the "SS" sedan concept from 2003 and the NOMAD concept from 1999

Last edited by johnsocal; Dec 2, 2005 at 04:55 PM.
Old Dec 2, 2005 | 07:46 PM
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Re: A question for Red Planet

Originally Posted by guionM
Not going to steal Red's thunder (in the unlikely even he answers your question before Camaro's unveiling), but the basic design for a 5th gen Camaro was created years ago.

To make matters worse, alot of the ideas were hidden in plain sight as "concept" cars.

I suspect there will be alot of areas of familiarity when we see the car.

Wasn't it mentioned on here that the 5th gen would have many 2nd gen cues?
Old Dec 2, 2005 | 08:04 PM
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Re: A question for Red Planet

I like this one:
"Camaros are from Mars, Mustangs are from Uranus"


So in other words you mean the "SS" sedan concept from 2003 and the NOMAD concept from 1999
Probably, in exagerated form, and a thin 4-door diguise.
I think being here like we are, and seeing and hearing all of the conceptual stuff over the years, I don't expect to be as shocked as the average Joe...Pleased, but not so shocked.
Old Dec 2, 2005 | 10:17 PM
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Re: A question for Red Planet

Originally Posted by guionM
To make matters worse, alot of the ideas were hidden in plain sight as "concept" cars.
Don't think so...
Old Dec 2, 2005 | 10:18 PM
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Re: A question for Red Planet

Originally Posted by johnsocal
So in other words you mean the "SS" sedan concept from 2003 and the NOMAD concept from 1999
I don't think so...
Old Dec 3, 2005 | 01:35 AM
  #14  
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Re: A question for Red Planet

I really hope it isn't based on any of the previous concept cars, because I think they were all shi...ooty.

The first Nomad concept was one of the ugliest cars I've seen in years from GM.

The SS concept was ok, but looked like a stretch limo RX-8 and I'd imagine you'd have to drive it like a boat.

The 2nd Nomad concept based on the Kappa platform is alright, it's cute and all, but it isn't a Camaro.

Heck, the closest thing that looks like a Camaro that Chevy have conceptualized was the Borrego . And it's definitely ugly as all get out.
Old Dec 3, 2005 | 02:33 AM
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Re: A question for Red Planet

Originally Posted by Brangeta
That thing looks awesome.



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