Chris 96 WS6

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2005/...in674120.shtml

The point is states like CA are considering taxing motorists on miles driven, because the proliferation of hybrids and other fuel saving technologies are cutting into their gasoline tax revenues.

Way to destroy any incentive we have to buy a fuel efficient car....

Government is an animal that will consume everything in sight if not kept in check by budget-growth-conscious legislators. CA has had a particular lack of those for years....

Darth Xed

Boy, this really is the perfect circle, is it not?

The governement pushes and pushes for better MPG vehicles, and since the manufacturers do as they are told, and spend billions over the years in bettering MPG performance... a cost that is always passed on to the comsumer in some fashion (higher vehicle prices over time) ... fuel consumption goes down per vehicle... just like they wanted.

Now... since less fuel is used, they get less tax money on it... uh oh. So, the solution is to create yet another tax to make up for it.

So, short term and long term benifit to the typical citizen: Nothing. In fact, you lose out on the deal.

:blah:

Ramune

I wonder how people are reacting on the Prius/Inisght/Whatever websites.

Z28Wilson

I wish these liberals would make up their minds. They've been pushing the righteousness of driving hybrids and other fuel-sipping cars down our throats for years, now they realize they aren't making enough money off them so they have to shift their view again? I honestly would be laughing if this plan didn't have a chance to affect me.

Chris 96 WS6

The dirty little secret is that the consumer pays for EVERYTHING. Any tax you levy on a business gets built in to the cost of the good or service....in the end you end up paying it as part of your purchase.

Ad income tax, state income tax, property tax, gas tax, local occupational taxes, state sales tax, and dozens of other unique local things like special assessments and millage fees and you have an out of control government pig at the trough of the private citizen. I know I sound like a broken record to some but this is just ridiculous.

Here we have the one state that has championed environmentally friendly automobiles and high MPG cars and in the same breath they are totally destroying the personal, micro level incentive for making such a purchase. If they were not so addicted to taxation as a way to fund all their programs this would not be an issue.

Z28Wilson

I have a hard time believing Ahhnold would ever let this pass in CA.

Darth Xed

I think this would absolutely crush the new car market...

Unless they plan to retro fit these milage monitoring devices to older cars to allow them to stay on the road, a lot of folks are going to simply hold on to their older cars to avoid paying this tax.

I would think, because of this, that the automakers would fight this idea tooth and nail.

Also, there are inherant flaws in this system. What if you are a farmer or other significant property owner, and a good portioon of your milage is on you own land... how do they differentiate?

What if I take my car to the drag strip? Can I deduct 1/4 mile for each run?

poSSum

I don't have time to read the article but wouldn't it make more sense to simply increase the gas tax thereby encouraging even more fuel efficient vehicles and not adding another division of tax bureaucracy?

92RS shearn

Hmm ok, so I will take my beater with a few 5 gal jugs to the gas station and fill them up come home and refuel. So it looks like I only drive 100 miles a year, oh well, must work from home .

It always amazes me how many different ways politicians can think of to make us part with our money. I guess we should all just take public transportation.
Its like driving a rental car, pay per the mile, unbelievable.

Chris 96 WS6

I like Ahnod and a lot of what he's done out there, but his budget crisis fix was smoke and mirrors. They just borrowed a bunch of money against bonds to fund the government in the short term. They are still pinched for dollars in the long term in a bad way.

Taxes are going to have to go up massively in a state that already suffers from an 8% tax on income plus a 7% or so sales tax, and oppressively high home prices and therefore oppressively high property taxes, OR cut program funding massively, which the Dem controlled legislature will never go for. So, I expect them to raise taxes and maybe make a few token cuts.

The result will be a mass exodus (which has already begun, hence rapid growth in Nevada and Arizona) of any skilled, employable people.

Darth Xed

Another perfect loophole!

Chris 96 WS6

This reminds me of the cigarrette tax and the tobacco lawsuits. I personally cannot stand smoking, and it is unhealthy for sure, but if it is so evil as everyone tells us, why didn't they just ban it? Because the states are addicted to the cigarette tax.

Then you have the billions the cigarette companies are paying to the states as part of the settlement......

ProudPony

Take this bit of wisdom from a "conspiracy theorist"...

Government and big industry are intimately conjoined - always have been, always will be - despite what some would like to think. How so? Just look at the people that currently hold the highest offices in our government... GW - Oil Man/Energy Man (Arbusto Oil, Enron, and Halliburton), Cheney - oil man(Halliburton, KBR, and others), Condy Rice - oil chick (Chevron Oil). I can go on and on. Clinton's group was no different, just the industry was more tech-based than energy-based. This has always been the case - even good ol McNamara got the tap on the shoulder to leave the car business for big government - GM and Ford both have had their share of executive crossovers into politics.

So government will legislate that the poor wage earning bastard gets bled every chance they can do it. As long as it's "legal".

The topic of this thread is really no different than insurance on your car (at least in my state). Liability insurance used to be a privelidge for the wealthy - to ensure against loss. Government steps in and says that it is now mandatory for all licensed vehicles to carry liability at minimum. The next step was to regulate the insurance rates so that there could be no bickering about how much is paid.
So my state requires me to carry the insurance, and they also dictate what I will pay for it (provided I don't want to walk).
Yeah, THAT'S fair. Ever hear of a monopoly? Aren't they illegal in the US?
I guess not so long as the government is the monopolistic leader in charge.
At least some sap of an insurance slaesman gets to take his slice of profit when he converts my government mandate into a private "for profit" sale.

As for the policy in Cali - I guess the greedy bastages couldn't sit back and wait for a boat-load of folks to buy the hybrids before popping this little money making gimmick on 'em.
I hope it backfires and they don't sell a friggin' one until legislation blocks this hanessy of greed.

Darth Xed

I saw this coming as soon as the words "monitoring devices" were uttered.

I'm with you for the most part on this one, but for pretty specific reasons. First, they are outright saying they want going to do it, so there's really nothing secret or behind the scenes so much. and secondly, this piece of equipment is dedicated for a specific reason, and offers no other benefit to the user.

centric

You needed more proof that taxes are evil?

It comes down to this: ANY system in which the transaction is more complex than "pay your money, get your product or service" is going to be MORE costly and inefficient than the simple one:

Auto rebates
Health insurance
Government redistribution of tax revenue

Sometimes I wonder if the natural condition of humanity is bureaucracy, the way we like to overcomplicate everything.