Automotive News / Industry / Future Vehicle Discussion Automotive news and discussion about upcoming vehicles

GM in talks to buy Chrysler

Thread Tools
 
Search this Thread
 
Old 02-16-2007, 11:48 AM
  #1  
Registered User
Thread Starter
 
johnsocal's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 1969
Location: Southern California (SoCal)
Posts: 1,912
GM in talks to buy Chrysler

http://money.cnn.com/2007/02/16/news...ion=2007021612

Report: GM in talks to buy Chrysler Group
Sources say the No. 1 automaker may buy the DaimlerChrysler's struggling auto unit, according to a report.
February 16 2007: 12:36 PM EST
NEW YORK (CNNMoney.com) -- General Motors is in talks to buy DaimlerChrysler AG's struggling Chrysler group in its entirety, according to several reports.

According to the reports, sources in Germany and the United States said high-level talks between GM (up $0.02 to $36.46, Charts) and DaimlerChrysler (up $2.45 to $72.70, Charts) executive are taking place.

Last week, Chrysler Group announced it would be cutting about 13,000 workers over the next three years as a part of reconstructing plans. Reports also said its German parent was considering cutting Chrysler itself as it weighs a sale or spin-off the unit.

Talks of an alliance between GM and DaimlerChrysler was first reported last week in Germany's Manager-Magazin.

The German publication said DaimlerChrysler Chairman Dieter Zetsche had met with GM Chairman Rick Wagoner about a possible sale of Chrysler to the automaker.

Other unnamed sources said to be familiar with the discussions confirmed the reports for Reuters and the industry newspaper Automotive News.

DaimlerChrysler employed J.P. Morgan Chase & Co. to consider options for the Chrysler Group, to help the automaker explore strategic options, according to reports.

DaimlerChrysler has long tried to reverse the drop in sales with previous cost-cutting moves but slipped into the No. 4 spot last year behind Toyota in the United States..

Renault Nissan's Chief Executive Officer Carlos Ghosn expressed interest in the past in buying the automaker.
johnsocal is offline  
Old 02-16-2007, 12:48 PM
  #2  
Registered User
 
guionM's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: The Golden State
Posts: 13,711
I have to ask the very basic question that no one in the media seems to be asking:

"What reason does GM have to buy Chrysler???"

Genaral Morors Corperation is a far bigger player in every market Chrysler is in. Chrysler is essentially an import company in Australia. They have essentially a token presence (admittedly growing) in Europe. Every automotive platform Chrysler has, General Motors has.

General Motors is also scrapping every penny they can in order to fund their product assult, and barely has more in the bank than Ford currently does.

Chrysler does have Jeep. Chrysler bought AMC in order to get Jeep. MercedesBenz bought Chrysler primarily to get Jeep (and Chrysler's cash stockpile). It's concievable that GM would buy Chrysler just to get Jeep if they had the money...... and DaimlerChrysler wasn't enacting a plan to downsize Chrysler and bring it's product development and parts sharing closer to Mercedes Benz.

I was holding Chrysler stock when MB approached them, and I don't see the same chain of events happening this time around that happened back then. No mail, no "chatter", nothing besides newspaper speculation. There's always a kernnel of truth to every rumor, while I believe something is up, under the circumstances I don't believe GM is going to have a rep show up at Dieter Zetsche's office with a check and walk out with the keys to the Chrysler Division.



What I DO believe is there's the likelihood that General Motors will enter into an allience with Chrysler where both benefit. I can see the Renault/Nissan-like allience proposal from last summer taking effect here, where GM & Chrysler share subsystems, combine purchase power, or co-develop chassis. General Motors is open to cheaper ways of getting new product out. Chrysler is small enough not to be a threat, and unlike the proposal earlier last summer, GM wouldn't have to ceed control of their company in order to get modest benefits.

Dieter Zetsche's plan for a revised Chrysler involves shrinking the company. Jeep is highly profitable, and although I can see GM willing to buy it, Jeep (save the Commander) isn't the problem at DCX. Chrysler's revitalization plan involves Chrysler using more MB parts, coordinating development of new models with Mercedes Benz (the 1st of which may involve the next ML or GL series SUVs), and finally, buying out another 13,000 blue and 1000 white collar workers, and making Chrysler a very small company.

Chrysler's next 4 cylinder engine is a joint development with 3 other car makers. Ford & GM co-developed a 6 speed automatic transaxle that both are using in FWD cars. It's not far fetched for GM to co-develop the next gen small FWD chassis since the current one was codeveloped with Mitsubishi (which Damiler seems to be pulling away from).



Again, I'm not anywhere near sold on the idea that GM is "buying" Chrysler.

Looking at a allience?... Sure.

Combining development resources?... I can see that.

Buying Jeep?... I think it's unlikely, but still possible.

Buying the entire Chrysler corperation?....
GM does what's in GM's best intrest. Not only don't I see anything there in GM's best intrest, Daimler is already starting on moves to rescue Chrysler (or at least most of it).

I'd have to say not.
guionM is offline  
Old 02-16-2007, 01:32 PM
  #3  
Registered User
 
PacerX's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Posts: 2,979
Emotionally, my heart tells me that the only hope for the American automobile industry at this point is the merger of GM + Ford or GM + Chrysler.

What does GM get...

Well, Jeep is the centerpiece.

They get minivans, and although they don't sell in as huge of numbers as they used to, they still sell.

And, they eliminate a core competitor who has an excellent styling group.
PacerX is offline  
Old 02-16-2007, 01:33 PM
  #4  
Registered User
 
Good Ph.D's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Mack and Bewick
Posts: 1,600
Even if Jeep is the money tree everyone says it is, why does GM need it. They've got GMC, and more importantly Hummer, which I cant imagine is any more watered down then jeep is after the liberty and what not...
Good Ph.D is offline  
Old 02-16-2007, 01:42 PM
  #5  
Registered User
 
96_Camaro_B4C's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Indianapolis, IN
Posts: 3,650
Originally Posted by guionM
I have to ask the very basic question that no one in the media seems to be asking:

"What reason does GM have to buy Chrysler???"
This is what I've been trying to get across to some of my coworkers who have been emailing back and forth about this...

No freaking way GM will outright buy Chrysler from DCX.
96_Camaro_B4C is offline  
Old 02-16-2007, 01:54 PM
  #6  
Registered User
 
ProudPony's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Yadkinville, NC USA
Posts: 3,180
Originally Posted by PacerX
Emotionally, my heart tells me that the only hope for the American automobile industry at this point is the merger of GM + Ford or GM + Chrysler.
I said the exact same thing 3 years ago.

The age-old rivalry between Ford and GM has really died down - almost to non-existant. Look who they compare themselves against in TV ads... not each other, but imports. Likewise, Toyota and Honda shoot at Ford and GM.

It should resound of sibling rivalry... two brothers can wrestle and fight and pick with each other all they want, but when someone from outside the family takes aim at one of the brothers, they better be ready to tangle with the whole family! We should band together and look out for each other - it's going to be a matter of survival.

Honestly, I'd love to see a JV with Ford and GM. I think they would complement each other pretty well. Ford has had some great designs that never got to production. They move fast and radically - things GM doesn't do well. Likewise, GM has a huge powertrain group with great products. Extensive resources all over the world, and manufacturing might 2nd to none. GM has outstanding plant efficiencies and leads in initial quality. Ford has been on an unbelievable tear with good launches, great interiors, and almost no recalls on vehicles produced since 2004.

20 years ago, I'd have told you to bite me... today, I think we need to stop quibbling between ourselves and look out the window at the REAL threat coming down the street (or across the ocean).
ProudPony is offline  
Old 02-16-2007, 02:18 PM
  #7  
Registered User
 
nightwave's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: S. Indiana, USA
Posts: 123
The reason I don't see a merger happening is overlap. Dodge competes with Chevrolet and Pontiac, Chrysler with Buick and Cadillac, Jeep with Hummer and GMC. GM has enough nameplates already. They don't need more.

However, if the talk is a joint venture I'm all for it.
nightwave is offline  
Old 02-16-2007, 02:19 PM
  #8  
Registered User
 
PacerX's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Posts: 2,979
Originally Posted by nightwave
The reason I don't see a merger happening is overlap. Dodge competes with Chevrolet and Pontiac, Chrysler with Buick and Cadillac, Jeep with Hummer and GMC. GM has enough nameplates already. They don't need more.

However, if the talk is a joint venture I'm all for it.
Chrysler in now way, shape or form competes with Cadillac.

Buick, yes...

Cadillac?

Not on your life.
PacerX is offline  
Old 02-16-2007, 02:38 PM
  #9  
Registered User
 
georgejetson's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 689
Originally Posted by PacerX
Chrysler in now way, shape or form competes with Cadillac.

Buick, yes...

Cadillac?

Not on your life.
Not anymore, that's for sure. DCX has a different division to compete with Cadillac.
georgejetson is offline  
Old 02-16-2007, 04:23 PM
  #10  
Registered User
 
apyah's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: canton michigan
Posts: 138
I work for chrysler now if that happens I can get a discount on a camaro lol
apyah is offline  
Old 02-16-2007, 05:17 PM
  #11  
Registered User
Thread Starter
 
johnsocal's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 1969
Location: Southern California (SoCal)
Posts: 1,912
Deeper alliance but no buyout-

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/17186900/from/RS.4/

GM buying Chrysler? Don’t count on it
Deeper alliances between automakers likelier than merger, analysts say
ANALYSIS
By Roland Jones
Business editor
Updated: 11:49 a.m. PT Feb 16, 2007

Of the many stories swirling around Detroit concerning Chrysler’s future, reports that rival General Motors is in talks to purchase the struggling automaker are the most eye-catching. But don’t count on seeing a merger of the two automakers.

A trade publication reported Friday that GM, the world’s biggest automaker, is in talks to purchase Chrysler from its German parent company, which put it on the block this week by saying it is considering all options for its struggling U.S. division. But while the two companies might cooperate more closely on future products and technologies, an outright purchase of Chrysler is unlikely, analysts say.

The report by Automotive News cited unidentified sources in both Germany and the United States. GM declined to comment other than to say it routinely has discussions with other automakers.

Talk of the deal comes after DaimlerChrysler revealed its long-awaited turnaround plan for its money-losing U.S. division. The company plans to cut about 13,000 jobs — 16 percent of its North American work force — in a bid to profitability by 2008.

Jim Hall, an automotive analyst at consulting company AutoPacific, points out that GM already bears a heavy burden of $5 billion to $7 billion a year in health care and pension costs for current and retired employees. That’s money the world's biggest automaker can’t spend on product development or marketing, and taking on similar obligations at Chrysler would increase those costs by a minimum of 30 percent, he said.

“I don’t think the acquisition is realistic,” Hall told CNBC. “Car companies talk all the time, but in the end this has to make sense for the shareholders, and if I’m a GM shareholder I don’t want to hold a piece of Chrysler.”

George Magliano, director of automotive industry research for the Americas at Global Insight, said that GM and Chrysler match each other in their problems and deficiencies, which include their pension and healthcare costs, their efforts to reduce factory capacity in the face of shrinking sales.

“So this is not complementary,” he said. “Their product line-up is similar, and they both have gaps when it comes to small and family cars, and on top of that you’d have to wrestle with both GM and Chrysler’s recoveries at the same time.”

Still, Magliano cautions against dismissing outright talk of takeover.

“This doesn’t seem to be an idle rumor — there seems to be some substance here because while no one is confirming it, no one is denying it either,” he said. “And some are saying this is a defensive move on the part of GM, because there’s a long list of those that might want to grab Chrysler — a Chinese manufacturer or a private equity group. And for GM it could be a quick way to pick up some market share.”

A more plausible scenario for is the prospect of Chrysler and GM building deeper ties by sharing vehicle technologies and architecture, including common components, to reduce costs, analysts say.

“I don’t doubt that these two companies are talking,” said Hall of AutoPacific. Ford and GM have developed a transmission together, he said, and it has been very successful. Developing components together to cut costs is a good idea, he added, but an outright purchase “will not happen.”


Reports in The Wall Street Journal and The New York Times Friday said Chrysler and GM have held discussions related to developing a large sport utility vehicle like the Chevrolet Suburban or Tahoe, which Chrysler doesn’t have in its current product lineup. The Journal also said the two are looking at sharing small cars developed by a unit of GM in South Korea.

Despite the growing popularity of smaller, more fuel efficient cars, there is still a sizable market for large SUVs although it is expected to shrink a little, said Tom Appel, editor of Consumer Guide Automotive, which offers buying advice. In 2006, GM sold 425,000 units of its large SUVs, including the Tahoe and Suburban, up slightly from 2005, he said.

“Chrysler doesn’t make a large SUV,” he said. "They have large midsize SUVs, like the Durango and the Aspen, but they are not selling well because it seems consumers either buy a large one or they go for crossover vehicles.” Crossovers, based on car platforms, are the fastest-growing segment of the U.S. vehicle market.


“I see value for both sides here,” he continued. “Chrysler can purchase a large SUV from GM and put on it the design influence they want, and they don’t have to pay for the research and development, while GM, which has spent multiple billions of dollars developing their new big SUVs, gets more exposure and they don’t have to pay for the advertising and marketing — they just build a few more.”

Chrysler already has alliances with GM, including one to develop gasoline-electric hybrid engine technology. If a deeper product-building alliance works, closer ties could be forged in the future, he said.

“[An alliance over SUVs] is a start, and it’s possible I could broaden to other technologies and product alliances,” Magliano said. “Everyone is looking for something in this market, so we wouldn’t rule out an alliance broadening.”

Last edited by johnsocal; 02-16-2007 at 05:19 PM.
johnsocal is offline  
Old 02-16-2007, 05:23 PM
  #12  
Registered User
 
KLee's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 1999
Location: Honolulu, Hi USA
Posts: 370
Product overlap would definitely occur if there were to be a full scale buyout.
KLee is offline  
Old 02-16-2007, 05:30 PM
  #13  
Registered User
 
SSbaby's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Melbourne, Australia
Posts: 3,123
The article is meaningless IFF Chrysler is purchased by a rival car maker. I don't see GM offering their platform to a Toyota or Nissan, for example.

Sometimes I wonder how analysts earn their keep!
SSbaby is offline  
Old 02-16-2007, 06:39 PM
  #14  
Registered User
 
5thgen69camaro's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Annapolis MD
Posts: 2,802
Originally Posted by nightwave
The reason I don't see a merger happening is overlap. ...

...Jeep with Hummer and GMC. GM has enough nameplates already. They don't need more.
There is no H2 or H2 variant competitor at Jeep. Likewise there is no Wragler competitor at Hummer. H2/Wrangler would compliment eachother. The 5cyl H3 is still bigger than the 4DR wrangler unlimeted. it maps more dimensionally to the the V8 Grand Cherokee which is kind of like comparing the Range Rover and the Discovery to me. Hummer Jeep would be a great match up. I think a wrangler type vehicle would be good for hummer.
5thgen69camaro is offline  
Old 02-16-2007, 08:55 PM
  #15  
Registered User
 
camaro_guy_z28's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Pittsburgh PA
Posts: 104
Is Dodge/Chrysler/ now owned by a german company or was that jeep, or am i just crazy? Someone please explain this all to me if possible. Thanks
camaro_guy_z28 is offline  


Quick Reply: GM in talks to buy Chrysler



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 10:42 AM.