ImportedRoomate

Got this from another board, discuss:

"The talk around Detroit right now is just how bad GM is right now. GM sales for November fell a huge 16% over same time last year. If you now the right places around the Detroit metro area, you can find storage lots full of hundreds of unsold GM vehicles, not unlike Chrysler's leasing of the Sate Fair grounds in 1974 to park 5,000 unsold "C" body vehicles after the Arab oil embargo. GM market share slipped to a post-Great depression low of 24.8%, less than 4 points away from Ford. There is quiet talk out at the GM Tech Center that GM could be out of the car business within 4 years! GM's debt load is horrific, 290 Billion dollars. GM's credit rating, at one time AAA, has fallen to one level above "junk". GM's pension and health care costs are sky-rocketing and we all know about their European operations (disaster). Suppliers are desperately trying to realign themselves with other customers. We have people in England right now consulting with an Indian based engine company who is purchasing the Vauxhall V6 engine line and retooling it to make their engines in India.
The Vauxhall plant is dead, the line equipment is being sold-off and
the line is only three years old! We are watching the elephant die.

One can only imagine what will happen to Detroit if GM fails or goes
through a major restructuring!

GM & Fiat are meeting in Zurich, starting today to determine the fate
of Fiat car division, including Fiat, Alfa Romeo & Lancia, i.e. the whole
thing. GM entered into a contract to purchase Fiat car division
several years ago, offering to purchase at a fixed price the division,
regardless of what subsequently happens. That contract is due to expire and as such Fiat has the right to "put" their car division to GM at a price now far above what it is currently worth! GM will either have to pay BIG money to buy the contract back, or take over Fiat car division, a horrible
loser. (I know you are saying to yourself; "What kind of idiot would enter
into a contract like this?" The answer is GM!) I told you they were bad
business managers! Now I am simply telling you how bad they are! Aztec
may actually be the best they can do!

Fiat car has been in trouble for years. Their market share declines every
month, costs are rising and Fiat no longer has the money to bring out
new models. Last year they had 8% of the European market. Today, they have 6.7% and continue to decline against the Japanese. GM risks losing it's credit rating if it takes over Fiat. GM is already trying to get rid
of 20% of it's European workforce and restructure Vauxhall and Opel, both
hemoraging billions of dollars in losses. GM has managed to "manage"
their credit rating, at one time at AAA, the highest possible, down to
BBB+, the lowest investment grade there is, one level above "junk". If
they get their rating lowered one more time, GM debt will no longer
qualify for inclusion into most pension plans, any investment grade bond
funds and the traditional debt markets will be closed to GM! So,
either GM pays, or GM PAYS! If GM pays big money to buy back the contract so they do not have to take over Fiat, this payment will not only be charged against Euro operations (already crippled) but you will actually be giving money to your own competitor to help your competitor finance the design of new models that you, yourself cannot afford to bring to market!

Wow! And these people went to college?

GM's paranoia about being broken-up ran deeper than people think. GM is
said to have maniplated union contract negotiations, offering higher and
higher pay and benefits to run smaller, weaker auto companies out of business. They practiced predatory marketing practices by forcing major
cosmetic changes on all their vehicles every year to break the smaller
car companies that could not afford the annual die changes (Nash, Hudson,
Studebaker). They targeted specific brands to grab market share, such
as the assault on Packard by Cadillac. None of these things are illegal,
but all were successful. But when added together, the question of
violation of the Sherman and Clayton anti-trust acts began to emerge. The end result of internal restructuring resulted in the ill-fated GMAD
(General Motors Assembly Division). This corporate structure where GMAD had all the political power resulted in the look-alikes of the '70's and finally the "Chevymobile". Then came CPC/BOC groups, followed by Car Platform Groups, followed by what they have now, which they call Brand Management, but is really Purchasing Department control. GM hit their high water mark in the early sixties companion with the Justice Department's successful drive to make DuPont sell their controlling interest in GM, which they had owned since 1921. Dupont was gone, Mr. Dupont's hand picked manager for his "investment", Alfred P. Sloan retired after running GM for over 30 years. End of an Era! GM has never had the depth of management or the insight since."

Z28Wilson

Sales being down 1 month compared to last year is hardly a legitimate reason for why "GM is about to go under". For all the doom and gloom tossed at GM they are still the world's #1 automaker, and I don't see them falling into utter ruin within the next year or so. Changes have to be made, product needs to continue improving, but the General will survive. I'm pretty postive about that.

number77

i wonder why all my posts go unnoticed?

I THINK GM IS LETTING THIS CAR INFLUENCE WHAT WE WILL BE GETTING IN '08
http://www.supercars.net/PicFetch?pi...etizione-1.jpg
http://www.supercars.net/PicFetch?pi...etizione-3.jpg
http://www.supercars.net/PicFetch?pi...etizione-2.jpg

NJSPEEDER24

that's fugly

Chris 96 WS6

Only the nose is fugly, the rest of the car is beautiful. I love the proportions.

Methinks that is a solstice (kappa) based car? Therefore, a beta sibling? Therefore, put a camaro nose on it and a little longer tail and there's your 5th gen.

Assuming GM is still in business, LMAO...

"I found it on the internet, so it must be true!" No doubt GM is up that certain creek w/o a paddle when it comes to the obligations due to pensioners over the next two decades, but they will survive. Business is just a cashflow game...

KillerTA

The whole thing is ugly and foreign looking.

Chris 96 WS6

That's what we like to call "opinion"

Jason E

Uhm, this post is about the most asinine thing I have read in quite a long, long time.

Chris 96 WS6

Clearly GM has its problems, http://www.fool.com/news/mft/2004/mft04120906.htm?npu=y

But the company employs like 180,000 world wide...no way they just shut down. Worst case is they hit bankruptcy, reorganize their debts and survive....If the government will bail out Chrysler, they'll bail out GM.

Josh452

Do you guys really believe everything that you read on the internet? What this tool fails to realize is that GM has already pledged $500 MILLION to Fiat to shut them up for the short term. Furthermore, the inventory levels are high right now, NOT because of slow sales but because dealers are stocking up for when GM cuts production in Q1 of '05.

Man, journalists these days and their spin.

25thTA

So what's this got to do with anything? It's a photo-chop! Doubt it came from GM. Besides, it doesn't look that bad for an Alpha Romeo.

Meccadeth

I don't think anyone really believes this

Capn Pete

.....and I'm sure that the management of every other car company is "perfect"?!

I mean, maybe it's naive to think that GM couldn't go under (it happened to the Titanic, right?) but I think they're too big, and I believe they've got the resources to "pull a rabbit of out the hat" and even if they had to drop a few model lines, they could still stay in the race with a leaner fleet of higher quality cars.

What I've believed for a long time is that GM just does the bare minimum they need to, to get by. Companies like Honda or Toyota (etc.) have had to build better cars than GM just to get recognized as being "exceptional quality car manufacturers". Otherwise GM owned the market. I don't believe GM can't make better cars, I just think they choose not to. If they were in a position of completely losing their footing in the auto market, I think we'd see some big changes (it may cost them some money they don't have initially, but I think they could make up for it in the long run).

muckz

IANAS IANAL, for all i know he might be presenting facts, but the tone of the whole article screams "conspiracy theorist!". Sounds like it should be printed at National Enquirer, or BON.

Caps94ZODG

wait wait wait..stick the Cheers and Gears Camaro Front end on this thing....where is Chris H..when you need him????
is this a 2 or 4 seater???