I seem to remember people thinking that it was a bad idea for Exxon and Mobil to join up... Well, for them, it turns out that was a great idea.

 

I'm all for any of the 3 Domestic brands sharing info and ideas to stay alive. I think Ford should've gotten in on the GM-Chrysler-BMW hybrid system that's being used now on the GM full size trucks. They should pool their money and resources as really together no manufacturer on Earth has more engineering and design talent and resources. Get them to tackle the great automotive technology.

The Domestic 3 got huge and strong because they were innovative and created things that consumers needed badly enough to trade in their old cars. (Style is innovation too)Once the foreign brands came in they have lost that edge. They need to jump to the next game in town, alternate fuels or power sources. If they could develop the next viable technology for automotive transportation and leave the Asian, Chinese, Korean and German brands stuck in the IC engine world just think how quickly they could get back in the game. It would be the K-Car/Minivan for all 3.

They won’t merge and Mustangs won’t have LS engines in them. But a little teamwork to keep the lights on won’t hurt.

 

I knew as soon as I saw the title of the thread, that the blindly biased would be out in force............... and I wasn't disappointed. LOL

Good reading.

That said, this is something that has to happen. My understanding is that GM approached Ford. Before everyone has a tizzy............. it makes sense, as their cash situation is much more precarious. Both companies have gotten rid of, or are getting rid of a tremendous amount of engineers. Thus, to pool some resources is just good money and good business............ plain and simple.

GM has some things to bring to the table, and so does Ford. Ford has worked hard to create their own outlet for Hybrid parts (batteries and transmissions), so they would not be limited on production by partially Toyota owned companies. You don't hear alot about it, but it is there. Also, their new Gen 2 Hybrid system coming out in the Fusion is supposed to be pretty close to a package deal for other vehicles (something that the Gen 1/Gen 1.5 Escape systems are not). This will make fast implimentation to other vehicles much easier. GM has the Volt, which looks to be very promising. However, promising usually means INCREDIBLY EXPENSIVE. Image Ford and GM pooling resources to bring more hybrids/PHEV/EV's to the market much quicker, and at a much better price than they could have done alone. Is that not worth collaberation???

Fords Ecoboost technology is far ahead of GM's (naysayers stay out of it.... just watch).

Stop thinking like an enthusiast............ and start thinking like a businessman, whose business is teetering on the brink. GM could have gone to anyone, and dangled the Volt in front of their face. As they had a good experience on the 6F tranmission development, Ford was a good fit. They both had things to offer.

I read an interesting blurb, from someone who obviously worked on the transmission deal. It is as follows............... and shows true cooperation.

 

Hmm, I don't hate the idea of a 3V OHC LSx engine. Hell combind with direct injection who knows how much power a 5.7 could push out.

 

One quick comment... all of us who love the American V8, rumble, and RWD... this thread is NOT for us. Forget about it. Don't even think it. This is not your party.
This party is for those in the appliance industry... major people movers... we're talking 1-million engines/year or more. This is the land of V6's I5's and I4's, with induction systems we have never seen. Even hybrid and alt-fuel systems.

Don't even dream of Mustangs with LSx in them, or Camaros with S/C 5.4s. Not gonna happen from this venture.

 

I don't really see where you can make that statement and then tell GM fans to just watch. I mean GM has a turbocharged DI 4 cylinder on the market, it has several turbocharged 4 cylinders for sale in the US and even more in Europe.

Ford essentially has nothing in the US market remotely like the Ecoboost engines, in Europe they have turbo 4 cylinder engines.

So why should we not question your statement about how far ahead of GM Ford is?

 

My question is not whether Ford has this wonderful 450 HP turbo V6 waiting in the wings, my question is how they will get this engine (and even its lower-powered derivative) in cars that resemble anything affordable. A motor with this level of power, strength and technology behind it can't be on the same economy of scale as the 3V 4.6, for instance.

 

I don't have high production expectations for the v6 Ecoboost engines. Honestly they represent halo car engines and nothing more. It is the 4 cylinders that have my interest (much like the new turbo DI 1.4 that GM is putting in the Cruze).

 

The ecoboost has piqued my interest but I'm still not sold that its that far ahead of GM's GDI offerings.

 

They must have found a way since this engine is slated for use in the F100/F150, Taurus, Flex, Fusion, and from the sound of it maybe mustang, etc... All of them are relatively affordable cars.

I can see this engine taking the place of the 3v 4.6/5.4 since Ford is heading towards the trend of smaller displacement engines and boost in place of larger N/A engines. With fuel economy standard and requirements going up this makes a lot of sense.

I read somewhere that Ford expects Ecoboost volume to top half a million units by 2012/2013.I don't know how much of that will be v6's, but i'd expect a good amount.

 

Just a note on gasoline direct injection - if you dig far enough into the programs of Ford, or GM, or any other manufacturer, you'll probably find a lot less internal development and a lot more technology from suppliers like Bosch, Denso, and Siemens. The automakers have been pushing this sort of development (and the associated costs) onto the supply base for a while now. GDI/SIDI is very attractive because it requires minimal development and tooling on behalf of the OEM - the fancy hardware required to make the stuff work consists mostly of supplied components (the exception is the required change to the cylinder head, but that's minor compared to the cost of a fresh engine).

I'm with IREngineer - this new co-development will likely be down the path of HCCI (or its close diesel cousion PCCI).

 

Bingo!

 

I wouldn't be surprised....

 

Please go on...

 

Good post.

Awaiting joint ventures on platform sharing between the two giants.

Alpha, Delta, ZetaII, Sigma etc... anyone?