exactly. Crown Vic sport? It still has the same 4.6 found in every other CV right? Nothing added to its performance? Its doesnt have a DOHC motor right? So thats not really sport.
The SVT Focus... the SVT Focus, aka the performance focus, puts out as much power as the mid level Cobalt.
And as for Taurus... my family owns 3 (yeah, I own a Taurus, hence the Ford hate), there hasnt been much since the SHO.

You might not find 13 cup holders a big selling point, but someone does. Like you said, enthusiasts realy could give a crap about "comfort" items out side of the drivers seat and placement of the shifter and wheel.

 

There is some added performance. True, you don't get the DOHC motor. But you get 15 more HP and 12 more lbs/ft torque. You also get a suspension package and a specific 17" wheel/tire combo. I think it's a nice little package for the money.
What mid level Cobalt? You talk about it like Cobalt has been available at your local Chevy dealer for years. As you know, the SVT Focus is going away after this year. Most of it's parts are going into the cheaper '05 Focus ST.

But it would have been interesting to compare SVT Focus to the UPCOMING Cobalt SS. Or, what would have been the 220HP SVT Turbo Focus to the Cobalt SS Supercharged.

 

Who says a turbo Focus is out of the picture BTW, I also own a SVT Focus (bought it for wife's daily beater). Power wasn't the goal on that car. Get in and drive it and you forget about HP. You keep looking for another turn. A faster turn. Eventually you find yourself taking all the highway mix-masters as fast as you can, scoping out new twisty streets and maybe even doing slalom in the grocery store parking lot The car handles and handles well. If I wasn't 6'3" with size 15 shoes, I'd have one as my daily beater instead of my WRX. Even flogging the SVT Focus my wife nor I can get LESS than 25 MPG IN THE CITY! There's a lot of fun to be had in small cars like that.

The Focus ST should continue this fun rather nicely. Once the Euro Focus reaches us, I hear it'll be even better!

 

i think alot of people are very jaded thanks to the 3rd and 4th gens. it was always about performance. and now thats part of why they are dead. in todays world not a whole lot of people want performance if it sacrifices reliability, comfort, safety, or other things like that. people want what gets the job done primarily. people want whats cheap but not too cheap. people want things like the current impala. why? because it gets the job done.

i work in a chain of small retail stores. the owner of the chain owns a new impala (not even SS) and just bought himself a brand new Avalanche. he didnt get the high performance SS Implan or the high performance SS SIlverado because he would be buying something that he doesnt need. hell right now i own a 91 trans am and a 92 blazer. im about ready to upgrade to an LS1 car but keep the 92 blazer. its slow enough (4.3 non vortec v6) that i have to take most highwya entrance ramps at damn near WOT. that doesnt bother me because i didnt buy the truck for its performance. i bought it for its usability and reliability. within the next couple of years i may upgrade to a canyon. those are pretty nice and look pretty sweet too. i doubt i get the performance edition unless cost is about the same because i dont need 2 high performance vehicles.

thats why bread and butter cars are successful. because they are good at what they are designed for. people on here get bent out of shape when a high performance edition isnt made or is made but with less performance than they deem ness. why? because we are enthusiasts. thats what we like. but this isnt the 60s anymore. most stay at home moms dont drive a 400hp v8 to get groceries.

 

87camracer:

You make some good points. The majority of consumers are looking for reliable cheap transportation. They need nothing more than androgenous, vanilla appliances. And Chevy...to it's credit ..has the androgenous vanilla appliance sector covered. Even beyond that...they have androgenous vanilla appliances available with heavy rebates too. Many people can be happy with that.

But not me. Maybe I don't represent the majority of consumers...but I need something to light a spark before I buy. Even for my daily driver. Even for my wife's family hauler. No, it doesn't need 400hp, or even 300hp....but it does need some thing. Maybe just a sporty suspension and manual trans....maybe some styling element that makes me pay attention. Maybe a new platform (as in DC's LX), that changes all my paradigms. Whatever it is......it's something that Chevy doesn't have presently, and that makes me sad .

One last thing.....

Even for those who are looking for no more than "vanilla", alittle something extra special wouldn't hurt.....in fact, it may be a pleasant surprise to them. It certainly wouldn't stop them from buying....who knows, maybe even for a lower rebate.

 

i agree than people are buying very bland cars. but GM isnt the only one making boring cars. Fords only cars that look decent and not boring are the stangs and the gt. and i think those are both hideous pieces of animal feces. but we wont get into that here.

for the past couple of years GMs cars ahve lost their spark. now they are just cars that fit in with the other relatively bland cars. i like where Acura is going at the present time. i LOVE the new TL. the headlights on that car really set off the front end and give the car an in your face look that at the same time is not over bearing. cars today are so bland and flat. they dont have lines that entail mystique. take the 4th gen for example. it is a decent looking car and has some very nice models. but compare that to a nice third gen and you will see what im talking about. the 3rd gen has lines that really added something extra to the car.

i dont think buyers can be won or bought by horsepower these days. unless its a person looking for that like you or I. others look for a car that looks halfway decent, does what they want them to do, and does it for cheap. special editions add flavor to these lines but come with a higher price tag. and usually these special edition cars have no more than a sticker package added on. maybe wheels and exhaust but come on. make it something that is truely different. to me a special edition is something like the Acura RSX Type S A-Spec. nothing too outragous in terms of styling, has new wheels, and a reworked suspension. i think cars need things like that.

i will disagree with your last point tho, buyers most certainly can be turned off by more horsepower. look at v6 4th gen buyers. they prolly bought the car for 1 of 3 reasons:

1. price
2. insurance
3. performance

fact is, not everyone that owns an fbody bought it for its racing abilities. i know alot of the locals around here didnt buy a z28 because its something they dont need. or in the case of price the high performance models add on to the price. maybe insurance was a concern because higher insurance premiums seem to go hand in hand with high performance.

im waiting on the Cobalt to be released but i personally think gm is on to something there. several different levels of performance. the go fast enthusiast can pop for the most expensive Supercharged SS or the budge minded could pop for the standard SS and be just as happy. and yet even still a budget minded person looking to go fast without the insurance rates could pop for the regular cobalt and finance in a factory supercharger and if available maybe exhaust work. i really believe that the cobalt is gonna be a hit. it offers something for everybody.

 

My biggest gripe about Chevy right now is the lack of a big RWD sedan and the lack of a Camaro. I think its just disheartening finally seeing other automakers bringing their cars out and waiting for the goods to come from GM, even if we know they're coming.

However in my first post I wasnt preaching "All is Lost", I think all the Chevy division of GM needs is the big RWD sedan cause there is a HUGE market for this from fleet to emergency services to consumers and of course our Camaro back. The sporty part of Chevy is complete with Corvette AND Camaro. Corvette is high end and v6 Camaros cover the extreme low end and mid v8 and high end v8 Camaros cover the in between. IMO thats ALL that Chevy needs to complete its portfolio right now. Save the roadsters, mid-engine, and AWD beasts for Pontiac.

 

I wasn't at all talking about horsepower there.....simply cranking up the power is not enough. The 4th gen proved that .
I was referring to having some sence of style or appeal. What's wrong with having that? Look at the Malibu for example.
Would it have have been so wrong if it weren't so homely? In fact the SS model will only be available on the Maxx, because the regular Malibu is so vanilla, that the SS version bombed in consumer clinics.

What if the Malibu were more attractive, maybe more like it's Opel Vectra platform mate? What if it were available with some nice wheels? What if the 3.5 or 3.9 were available with a 5 or 6 speed manual? Horsepower is the last thing I'm talking about here....sure, I like power, but I'm not one of these "just add more power...that's all we need" guys.

I'm just concerned that Chevy has become the "appliance" division, maybe that's a good business plan for them.....but that makes them irrelevant to me.

 

Don't forget dual exhaust and a 3.55 "perfromance" axle ratio

 

Funny you should use that term... it brings to mind another paradigm that was tested years ago.

We "old dudes" recall the days of Chevelle SS396 cars, 454 big blocks, tire-smoking El Caminos, Impy and Nova SS cars - especially the early Novas from the 60's, man I love those cars! We rehash the old Monte Carlo SS from the mid '80's (man, did I run my share of those things in my 5.0 T-bird!). All that performance, and I haven't even BEGUN to mention the Camaros yet!

OK, let's think about Coca-Cola now...
A "performance" beverage. Fizzy, racy, peps you up on caffene and sugar. Been selling it basically unchanged for 100 years. There's the classic logo, the bottle, and even the tagline "It's the REAL thing". These are mainstays of the BRAND. You see a Coke bottle, you don't think Tab, or Snapple... you think COKE.

Maybe some of you younger whipper-snappers don't recall back in the 80's when Coke invested bazillion$ of dollars in a new image, a new version of Coke. It was a new flavor. The company really risked a lot by changing their basic recipe too. Well, it was a TOTAL FLOP. Coke had to back pedal and do MAJOR damage control. They went so far as to repackage the old original recipe in cans that said "ORIGINAL Coca-Cola", because people were picking up cans of the new stuff thinking "Coke is Coke", then getting grossly disappointed when they took a swig.

Nowadays, when Coke or Pepsi introduce a new drink like Pepsi Clear, Pepsi Blue, or Vanilla Coke, they are VERY CAUTIOUS about not associating the new with the original beverage, and they CERTAINLY don't try to replace the original baverage the way Coke did in the '80's. And you know what's more, none of the new drinks seem to ever reach the success levels that the original drinks did, nor do they ever "redefine" the company.

My point, when we buy a Coke, we expect Coke to be in the can. We always have. And when Coke wasn't in the can, many felt betrayed and bought something else (Pepsi mostly).
The same scenario applies to Chevrolet IMHO.
I expect Chevy to provide me Chevy cars and trucks - like they always have. From good basic transportation to performance cars to pony cars - you name it. Camaro is Chevy. Impala is Chevy. C/K is Chevy. Monte Carlo is Chevy.
Like Coke learned, if Chevy changes it's chemistry to become only a "basic transportation" vehicle provider, they may or may not be successful, but they will certainly lose enthusiastic supporters.

The "new Coke" was still wet, quenched your thirst, and really didn't taste bad at all - so it DID a job. But it wasn't Coke anymore, and people rebuked.
Likewise, if Chevy isn't Chevy anymore... well... Vanilla Chevy anyone?