demand for domestics lessens
http://www.stltoday.com/stltoday/bus...e+rivals+surge
DETROIT - The nation's two largest automakers said demand for new vehicles fell 5 percent last month from a year ago. The trend almost assures heftier consumer incentives to come, even as Japanese rivals Toyota, Honda and Nissan rode a slew of new products to double-digit gains.
No. 1 automaker General Motors Corp. said Wednesday that truck sales were off 4.6 percent and that car sales down 5.5 percent in October.
Sales of Ford, Lincoln and Mercury trucks were up 3 percent at No. 2 automaker Ford Motor Co., but the demand wasn't nearly enough to offset a 22 percent decline in car sales - a familiar trend for Ford this year.
October marked the eighth time this year that Ford's monthly sales have been below year-ago results.
The smallest of the nation's Big Three automakers, the Chrysler Group of DaimlerChrysler AG, said overall sales rose 2 percent in October, for the 12th time in 13 months that Chrysler had a year-over-year increase.
Despite continued strong sales of its Chrysler 300C, the Chrysler Group was outsold last month by the U.S. division of Toyota Motor Corp. Toyota, including Lexus and Scion, reported 170,815 sales, versus 170,169 for the Dodge, Jeep and Chrysler brands.
(more)
DETROIT - The nation's two largest automakers said demand for new vehicles fell 5 percent last month from a year ago. The trend almost assures heftier consumer incentives to come, even as Japanese rivals Toyota, Honda and Nissan rode a slew of new products to double-digit gains.
No. 1 automaker General Motors Corp. said Wednesday that truck sales were off 4.6 percent and that car sales down 5.5 percent in October.
Sales of Ford, Lincoln and Mercury trucks were up 3 percent at No. 2 automaker Ford Motor Co., but the demand wasn't nearly enough to offset a 22 percent decline in car sales - a familiar trend for Ford this year.
October marked the eighth time this year that Ford's monthly sales have been below year-ago results.
The smallest of the nation's Big Three automakers, the Chrysler Group of DaimlerChrysler AG, said overall sales rose 2 percent in October, for the 12th time in 13 months that Chrysler had a year-over-year increase.
Despite continued strong sales of its Chrysler 300C, the Chrysler Group was outsold last month by the U.S. division of Toyota Motor Corp. Toyota, including Lexus and Scion, reported 170,815 sales, versus 170,169 for the Dodge, Jeep and Chrysler brands.
(more)
Re: demand for domestics lessens
Time to put that rebate money into better products.
Anyone notice how Domestic RWD products are red hot (Mustang, C6, 300C, STS) hmmm..... what does this say about RWD
Anyone notice how Domestic RWD products are red hot (Mustang, C6, 300C, STS) hmmm..... what does this say about RWD
Re: demand for domestics lessens
Canadian results look a little better for domestics ..
Heavy discounting can't turn Oct. sales slide
by Canadian Press
posted Nov 3, 2004
By Steve Erwin
TORONTO (CP) — New vehicle sales in Canada slipped in October compared to the same month one year ago, although heavy discounting by the Big Three car manufacturers prevented a steeper decline.
Sales of new cars and trucks reached 119,751 in October, down 1.1 per cent from the 121,094 units sold a year ago, according to figures compiled by DesRosiers Automotive Consultants Inc.
For the first 10 months of this year, the market was down 4.9 per cent, with just over 1.3 million vehicles sold. DesRosiers? forecast calls for 2004 sales to come in somewhere around 1.54 million units, below last year?s 1.593 million.
The October results followed a much more difficult September in Canada that saw new vehicle sales fall eight per cent compared with a year earlier.
"We expected the market this month to be up or down a point or two so this performance is not out of line," said industry analyst Dennis DesRosiers.
"There was very heavy discounting by GM, Ford and (DaimlerChrysler) which we suspected would help maintain sales and we were correct."
GM Canada?s sales were up 8.3 per cent in the month to 33,035 vehicles. It had the top market share in Canada ? 28.4 per cent year to date. That?s up 0.4 percentage points from last year, though GM?s grip on the market has declined over several years, as cars and trucks made by offshore-based automakers gain more favour.
GM has protected itself from further market share erosion this year, however, through its willingness to stay in the incentive game ? such as zero per cent interest financing plans, which are expensive for automakers, DesRosiers said.
The analyst also noted that GM is focusing more this year on taking back market share for entry-level vehicles from mainly Korean-based competitors.
"Over 40 per cent of the Canadian market is entry-level vehicles and GM is importing a number of products in this segment ? Aveo and Optra etc. ? which are gaining some traction and helping them maintain market share," he said.
DaimlerChrysler?s October sales increased 0.3 per cent to 16,734 vehicles. However, sales at Big Three competitor Ford fell four per cent to 15,175.
Import nameplates that tend to shy away from the heavy discounting were down 5.6 per cent on the month, according to preliminary sales results compiled by DesRosiers. Hit especially hard was Honda, where sales plummeted 20.6 per cent during the month to 8,748 vehicles.
Sales at Toyota fell three per cent to 12,917, though sales at its Lexus luxury arm increased 18.9 per cent to 888.
Notable import exceptions were BMW, up 1.3 per cent, Hyundai, which gained 19.6 per cent, and Mazda, rising 14 per cent.
For October, passenger car sales fell 1.3 per cent to 64,393. For the year, sedan sales were off 6.1 per cent.
Sales of light trucks ? a broad category that includes pickups, SUVs and minivans ? fell 0.9 per cent in October to 55,358. For the year, sales in the light truck segment have declined 3.5 per cent.
Major automakers report their October sales results Wednesday for the United States, which follows a strong September in the world?s biggest auto market.
Observers say heavy discounting at the end of September likely boosted October?s U.S. sales for some automakers, while sagging consumer confidence may have hurt business.
by Canadian Press
posted Nov 3, 2004
By Steve Erwin
TORONTO (CP) — New vehicle sales in Canada slipped in October compared to the same month one year ago, although heavy discounting by the Big Three car manufacturers prevented a steeper decline.
Sales of new cars and trucks reached 119,751 in October, down 1.1 per cent from the 121,094 units sold a year ago, according to figures compiled by DesRosiers Automotive Consultants Inc.
For the first 10 months of this year, the market was down 4.9 per cent, with just over 1.3 million vehicles sold. DesRosiers? forecast calls for 2004 sales to come in somewhere around 1.54 million units, below last year?s 1.593 million.
The October results followed a much more difficult September in Canada that saw new vehicle sales fall eight per cent compared with a year earlier.
"We expected the market this month to be up or down a point or two so this performance is not out of line," said industry analyst Dennis DesRosiers.
"There was very heavy discounting by GM, Ford and (DaimlerChrysler) which we suspected would help maintain sales and we were correct."
GM Canada?s sales were up 8.3 per cent in the month to 33,035 vehicles. It had the top market share in Canada ? 28.4 per cent year to date. That?s up 0.4 percentage points from last year, though GM?s grip on the market has declined over several years, as cars and trucks made by offshore-based automakers gain more favour.
GM has protected itself from further market share erosion this year, however, through its willingness to stay in the incentive game ? such as zero per cent interest financing plans, which are expensive for automakers, DesRosiers said.
The analyst also noted that GM is focusing more this year on taking back market share for entry-level vehicles from mainly Korean-based competitors.
"Over 40 per cent of the Canadian market is entry-level vehicles and GM is importing a number of products in this segment ? Aveo and Optra etc. ? which are gaining some traction and helping them maintain market share," he said.
DaimlerChrysler?s October sales increased 0.3 per cent to 16,734 vehicles. However, sales at Big Three competitor Ford fell four per cent to 15,175.
Import nameplates that tend to shy away from the heavy discounting were down 5.6 per cent on the month, according to preliminary sales results compiled by DesRosiers. Hit especially hard was Honda, where sales plummeted 20.6 per cent during the month to 8,748 vehicles.
Sales at Toyota fell three per cent to 12,917, though sales at its Lexus luxury arm increased 18.9 per cent to 888.
Notable import exceptions were BMW, up 1.3 per cent, Hyundai, which gained 19.6 per cent, and Mazda, rising 14 per cent.
For October, passenger car sales fell 1.3 per cent to 64,393. For the year, sedan sales were off 6.1 per cent.
Sales of light trucks ? a broad category that includes pickups, SUVs and minivans ? fell 0.9 per cent in October to 55,358. For the year, sales in the light truck segment have declined 3.5 per cent.
Major automakers report their October sales results Wednesday for the United States, which follows a strong September in the world?s biggest auto market.
Observers say heavy discounting at the end of September likely boosted October?s U.S. sales for some automakers, while sagging consumer confidence may have hurt business.
Re: demand for domestics lessens
Originally Posted by Z28x
Time to put that rebate money into better products.
Anyone notice how Domestic RWD products are red hot (Mustang, C6, 300C, STS) hmmm..... what does this say about RWD
Anyone notice how Domestic RWD products are red hot (Mustang, C6, 300C, STS) hmmm..... what does this say about RWD
Re: demand for domestics lessens
Originally Posted by Z28x
Time to put that rebate money into better products.
Anyone notice how Domestic RWD products are red hot (Mustang, C6, 300C, STS) hmmm..... what does this say about RWD
Anyone notice how Domestic RWD products are red hot (Mustang, C6, 300C, STS) hmmm..... what does this say about RWD
Re: demand for domestics lessens
What do they expect, the public will continue to be buying their 10 year old designs?
Japanese automakers came out with a lot of different models recently, or at least have updated them, and seeing as Chevy will only now start introducing various new product offerings, who wanted to buy Sunfire, or Cavalier? Same with Ford, just now they are offering some new products.
CHrysler's sales have picked up, but did you see what they did? They introduced a new line of cars. If they hadn't done so, I'd be interested in seeing how many people would be buying iNtrepids, Concords and 300Ms.
Japanese automakers came out with a lot of different models recently, or at least have updated them, and seeing as Chevy will only now start introducing various new product offerings, who wanted to buy Sunfire, or Cavalier? Same with Ford, just now they are offering some new products.
CHrysler's sales have picked up, but did you see what they did? They introduced a new line of cars. If they hadn't done so, I'd be interested in seeing how many people would be buying iNtrepids, Concords and 300Ms.
Re: demand for domestics lessens
Originally Posted by muckz
What do they expect, the public will continue to be buying their 10 year old designs?
Japanese automakers came out with a lot of different models recently, or at least have updated them, and seeing as Chevy will only now start introducing various new product offerings, who wanted to buy Sunfire, or Cavalier? Same with Ford, just now they are offering some new products.
CHrysler's sales have picked up, but did you see what they did? They introduced a new line of cars. If they hadn't done so, I'd be interested in seeing how many people would be buying iNtrepids, Concords and 300Ms.
Japanese automakers came out with a lot of different models recently, or at least have updated them, and seeing as Chevy will only now start introducing various new product offerings, who wanted to buy Sunfire, or Cavalier? Same with Ford, just now they are offering some new products.
CHrysler's sales have picked up, but did you see what they did? They introduced a new line of cars. If they hadn't done so, I'd be interested in seeing how many people would be buying iNtrepids, Concords and 300Ms.
Re: demand for domestics lessens
The Big 2.5 are so out of touch with the cars people want to buy. Chrysler seems to be the closest, and if they didn't have the quality history they do, their sales would be higher. Ford is probably second, and even if their cars have bland styling, the new models have a clean design and nice interiors.
And GM, for all their actions to beat Toyota on Quality, GM is still pumping out plenty of lackluster designs (Malibu? Ion?) and continuing to fail on the styling front way more often than it should. GM says that these buyers don't want or care about dramatic styling. Even when GM introduces cars with good styling themes, they blow the details. And what does Toyota itself say its biggest weakness is? STYLING!!!
What's even worse, is that all 2.5 of them usually make cars physically larger than their closest import competitors with no advantage in interior volume or usability. They also tend to have far fewer powertrain options. Stickshift? Well, there are a couple. True Hybrids? Only Ford is answering the Call here. Diesels? Only DC is answering here, and only with E-class Benzes and Liberty's.
Sure, everyone has bright spots, but on average, I'd be seriously worried about the compeition.
PS: Anyone ever notice that when they compare Toyota to Chrysler they usually compare Toyota, Lexus and Scion to Chrysler (w/o Mercedes)?
And GM, for all their actions to beat Toyota on Quality, GM is still pumping out plenty of lackluster designs (Malibu? Ion?) and continuing to fail on the styling front way more often than it should. GM says that these buyers don't want or care about dramatic styling. Even when GM introduces cars with good styling themes, they blow the details. And what does Toyota itself say its biggest weakness is? STYLING!!!
What's even worse, is that all 2.5 of them usually make cars physically larger than their closest import competitors with no advantage in interior volume or usability. They also tend to have far fewer powertrain options. Stickshift? Well, there are a couple. True Hybrids? Only Ford is answering the Call here. Diesels? Only DC is answering here, and only with E-class Benzes and Liberty's.
Sure, everyone has bright spots, but on average, I'd be seriously worried about the compeition.
PS: Anyone ever notice that when they compare Toyota to Chrysler they usually compare Toyota, Lexus and Scion to Chrysler (w/o Mercedes)?
Re: demand for domestics lessens
There has to be a point where the market is saturated with new vehicles.
With vehicles morgaged at 5, 6, or even 7 years means that all the vehicles sold in the last few years are upside down in value (owners owing more than the vehicle's worth). People who once might have traded their car every 2 or 3 years (when their vehicle has some type of equity) have to hold on to their cars longer.
Also, there's only so long you can keep having record years before you hit a ceiling & drop, regardless as to rebates.
I suspect we are getting to that point.
With vehicles morgaged at 5, 6, or even 7 years means that all the vehicles sold in the last few years are upside down in value (owners owing more than the vehicle's worth). People who once might have traded their car every 2 or 3 years (when their vehicle has some type of equity) have to hold on to their cars longer.
Also, there's only so long you can keep having record years before you hit a ceiling & drop, regardless as to rebates.
I suspect we are getting to that point.
Re: demand for domestics lessens
Originally Posted by WERM
The Big 2.5 are so out of touch with the cars people want to buy. Chrysler seems to be the closest, and if they didn't have the quality history they do, their sales would be higher.
Can you imagine the LX cars at GM!
Can you imagine making a business case to Rick Wagoner?
Ok Rick, this is what we have planned. We want to take ALL of our bread and butter FWD full sized sedans, and ALL of our FWD premium/luxury/sport sedans from Dodge and Chrysler and replace them ALL at once. We plan on using a large premium RWD architecture with suspension inspired by the MB E-Class. We will give them multi-valve V6's and a 340 hp V8. Styling will be abit out of the mainstream.....call it love it or hate it.
And oh, we don't really plan on charging anymore than we do now.
Please sign right here Ricky.
Re: demand for domestics lessens
I think think that he might go for it. I think he wants a lot of stuff, but still has to deal with a lot of internal GM BS that most companies dont have to deal with.


