ANY chance at all the Firebird/Trans Am will be along side the '07 Camaro?
Registered User
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 11
From: Miami, Fl
1. GTO represents the new Pontiac. Don't disregard the GTO till you see it yourself up close & personal.
2. Pontiac is moving upscale, and a Grand Touring car is their stated flagship, meaning GTO. Need more proof there is no room for Firebird? One word: Solstice!
I like my ride to be an American v8 RWD powered coupe that has a very aggressive and menacing(somewhat). Since the f-bods are gone, there are none that fit in this category anymore(the look, not necessarily the v8 rwd part). So I'll be happy with my TA for quite some time and won't have to worry about drooling over some other new more expensive car.
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Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 615
From: Lexington, Kentucky
Originally posted by DarthIROC
I refuse to give up hope. It has been a dream of mine since I was like 5 and saw Smokey and the Bandit to roll a brand new black on black T/A off the lot. I feel thats a pretty reasonable dream, and I'll be damned if Im denied it
I refuse to give up hope. It has been a dream of mine since I was like 5 and saw Smokey and the Bandit to roll a brand new black on black T/A off the lot. I feel thats a pretty reasonable dream, and I'll be damned if Im denied it
Consider yourself damned.
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Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 470
Originally posted by guionM
Why Firebird (and especially the Trans Am) is dead and wont return in the forseeable future: 101
1. GTO represents the new Pontiac. Don't disregard the GTO till you see it yourself up close & personal.
2. Pontiac is moving upscale, and a Grand Touring car is their stated flagship, meaning GTO. Need more proof there is no room for Firebird? One word: Solstice!
3. Pontiac has been trying to get rid of the Trans Am name since 1983! GM must pay a royalty on each car they sell with that name (the result of someone actually threatening to sue GM over DeLoren stealing the name... no one challenged his theft of "Grand Prix", "GTO", & "LeMans", and he attempted to grab "Trans Am" as well). If you look at introduction publicity pictures of the 3rd gen Trans Am of 1983, it's called "T/A". The only reason Pontiac changed it's mind was that the race series still threatened to take them to court.... and it was a sexual term back then (T&A).
3. Coupe sales are currently flat, and doesn't support the costs of designing & marketing of 2 identical cars. Also, since Firebirds wern't selling in large numbers, one can also make the case that the very very few people who would refuse to by a Camaro over the Firebird on principle isn't even a blip on the sales radar.
4. Pontiac simply doesn't want Firebird at the moment.
As was pointed out, the GTO and the next Camaro will infact be of the same structure, though word is Camaro will be a shortened version of the GTO structurally.
So, it IS still a real possibility that Firebird may return as a loaded Camaro with nothing more than a genaric Pontiac grill & different taillights to tell it apart.
However, even if Pontiac reverses itself over the next 24 or so months, the Firebird almost certainly won't be as different from Camaro as the 4th gen was.
Why Firebird (and especially the Trans Am) is dead and wont return in the forseeable future: 101
1. GTO represents the new Pontiac. Don't disregard the GTO till you see it yourself up close & personal.
2. Pontiac is moving upscale, and a Grand Touring car is their stated flagship, meaning GTO. Need more proof there is no room for Firebird? One word: Solstice!
3. Pontiac has been trying to get rid of the Trans Am name since 1983! GM must pay a royalty on each car they sell with that name (the result of someone actually threatening to sue GM over DeLoren stealing the name... no one challenged his theft of "Grand Prix", "GTO", & "LeMans", and he attempted to grab "Trans Am" as well). If you look at introduction publicity pictures of the 3rd gen Trans Am of 1983, it's called "T/A". The only reason Pontiac changed it's mind was that the race series still threatened to take them to court.... and it was a sexual term back then (T&A).
3. Coupe sales are currently flat, and doesn't support the costs of designing & marketing of 2 identical cars. Also, since Firebirds wern't selling in large numbers, one can also make the case that the very very few people who would refuse to by a Camaro over the Firebird on principle isn't even a blip on the sales radar.
4. Pontiac simply doesn't want Firebird at the moment.
As was pointed out, the GTO and the next Camaro will infact be of the same structure, though word is Camaro will be a shortened version of the GTO structurally.
So, it IS still a real possibility that Firebird may return as a loaded Camaro with nothing more than a genaric Pontiac grill & different taillights to tell it apart.
However, even if Pontiac reverses itself over the next 24 or so months, the Firebird almost certainly won't be as different from Camaro as the 4th gen was.
i dont meen to sound like an *** hole....wait a minute..yea i do. but what the **** are you talking about?!?!?! your whole post doesnt make sense and contradicts itself.
you say at the beggining "Why Firebird (and especially the Trans Am) is dead and wont return in the forseeable future: 101"
then at the end you say "So, it IS still a real possibility that Firebird may return as a loaded Camaro with nothing more than a genaric Pontiac grill & different taillights to tell it apart."
what the hell is going on?? is it or is it not?? also you say at the end that the firebird might come back as nothing more than a loaded camaro with diffrent grill and tail lights......WHAT THE ****??? THATS WHAT IT WAS THROUGHT ITS WHOLE 4th GEN LIFE????? whats going on here???? im going to shoot myself in the head because i cant live with the memory of reading this thread...goodbye cruel world....
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Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 2,925
From: Detroit
Originally posted by guionM
One word: Solstice!
One word: Solstice!
Registered User
Joined: Mar 2001
Posts: 13,713
From: The Golden State
Originally posted by Zerosheaven
i dont meen to sound like an *** hole....wait a minute..yea i do. but what the **** are you talking about?!?!?! your whole post doesnt make sense and contradicts itself.
you say at the beggining "Why Firebird (and especially the Trans Am) is dead and wont return in the forseeable future: 101"
then at the end you say "So, it IS still a real possibility that Firebird may return as a loaded Camaro with nothing more than a genaric Pontiac grill & different taillights to tell it apart."
what the hell is going on?? is it or is it not?? also you say at the end that the firebird might come back as nothing more than a loaded camaro with diffrent grill and tail lights......WHAT THE ****??? THATS WHAT IT WAS THROUGHT ITS WHOLE 4th GEN LIFE????? whats going on here???? im going to shoot myself in the head because i cant live with the memory of reading this thread...goodbye cruel world....
i dont meen to sound like an *** hole....wait a minute..yea i do. but what the **** are you talking about?!?!?! your whole post doesnt make sense and contradicts itself.
you say at the beggining "Why Firebird (and especially the Trans Am) is dead and wont return in the forseeable future: 101"
then at the end you say "So, it IS still a real possibility that Firebird may return as a loaded Camaro with nothing more than a genaric Pontiac grill & different taillights to tell it apart."
what the hell is going on?? is it or is it not?? also you say at the end that the firebird might come back as nothing more than a loaded camaro with diffrent grill and tail lights......WHAT THE ****??? THATS WHAT IT WAS THROUGHT ITS WHOLE 4th GEN LIFE????? whats going on here???? im going to shoot myself in the head because i cant live with the memory of reading this thread...goodbye cruel world....
*IF (boldfaced & capitalized for a reason) Pontiac did reverse itself it wouldn't have much to differentiate it from Camaro or else (knowing how the industry tends to work) Firebird wouldn't return till Camaros next revision (likely the end of the decade at the earliest).
*There isn't one body panel that the 4th gen Firebird shares with the Camaro besides T-top & roof, and beyond guages, HVAC, and stereo the interiors are completely different.
*The reason I said real possibility is that if enough of you Firebird people raise a ruckus to Pontiac's marketing (ie: Mustang fans of the late 80s), I suspect Pontiac might rethink it if enough good points were made that didn't go against Pontiac's direction.
So you see, you don't need to blow your head off just yet.
Originally posted by JB383TA
It fits perfect. All of Pontiac's cars look the same, especially to people who've never had one or just looked briefly at them. It's been remarked many times that Grand am = grand prix= bonneville = gto, etc.. Not many noticeable differences, unless you're an enthusiast, which most people are not.
Upscale to what? I don't think BMW and Mercedes will ever be threatened by anything coming from Pontiac in terms of quality, performance, luxury, just about everything. Even Caddy is playing catch up to the Euros(tho this is debatable), and Pontiac is NO Caddy. Why can't Pontiac be Pontiac without attempting to become a cheap imitation of something else?
I like my ride to be an American v8 RWD powered coupe that has a very aggressive and menacing(somewhat). Since the f-bods are gone, there are none that fit in this category anymore(the look, not necessarily the v8 rwd part). So I'll be happy with my TA for quite some time and won't have to worry about drooling over some other new more expensive car.
It fits perfect. All of Pontiac's cars look the same, especially to people who've never had one or just looked briefly at them. It's been remarked many times that Grand am = grand prix= bonneville = gto, etc.. Not many noticeable differences, unless you're an enthusiast, which most people are not.
Upscale to what? I don't think BMW and Mercedes will ever be threatened by anything coming from Pontiac in terms of quality, performance, luxury, just about everything. Even Caddy is playing catch up to the Euros(tho this is debatable), and Pontiac is NO Caddy. Why can't Pontiac be Pontiac without attempting to become a cheap imitation of something else?
I like my ride to be an American v8 RWD powered coupe that has a very aggressive and menacing(somewhat). Since the f-bods are gone, there are none that fit in this category anymore(the look, not necessarily the v8 rwd part). So I'll be happy with my TA for quite some time and won't have to worry about drooling over some other new more expensive car.
*Upscale to what? Poniac & Chevrolet buyers have been interchangeable since the 1970s. GM is moving Pontiac (and their other divisions) farther apart:
Chevrolet is value & volume
Pontiac is excitement and road performance
Buick is American road cars (think of the former Cadillac.
Cadillac is going after world luxury standards.
Saturn is GM's "import" brand (Saturn snags more potential import buyers than any other US brand.
Is Pontiac going to be BMW? No. But they will offer BMW's famed performance & handling at a 1/3 off the price. Sounds good to me.
Last edited by guionM; Jan 21, 2004 at 12:08 PM.
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