My engine is all ready to roll. I have air, fuel and spark. The only problem is the timing with the spark. I have taken out my distributor and dropped it in one way, and then 180 degrees the other way. I have turned my distributor every which direction while it is facing one way and then 180 degrees the other way.

I also tripple checked to make sure my spark plug wires are going to the correct cylinders.

I know for sure i have spark because i took a timing light to it and from what i'm told, timing a little bit off should not start an engine from turning over.

When I crank the engine, it fires a little bit, but not enough to turn over by itself.

Where should I look next?? Thanks in advance.

Nick

 

Make sure the distributers rotor is pointing at the #1 spark plug in the cap with the engine at top dead center on the compression stroke.It should fire, sounds like the engine is trying to fire out of time that would cause it to hang up and not complete a revolution.

 

Pull #1 spark plug out and bar the engine over until the piston is at TDC on the compression stroke. You'll hear the air trying to escape through the spark plug hole.

Now check for the timing mark on the balancer. You want to put it as close as possible to where your initial timing is supposed to be. If base timing is 10* BTDC, rotate the balancer until the marks line up to 10* BTDC. An indexed balancer or timing tape helps if you have a lot of initial advance.

Now you need to have the cap and rotor off the distributor. Look at where the magnetic pickup is pointed. It should be right on top of a point on the pickup rotor (a little hard to explain) If it's lined up then lock the distributor down since it's timed now almost perfect. Install the rotor and see where it's pointing. That's where your #1 plug wire will be. If it's not in the position you want, pull the distributer, use a long screwdriver to turn the oil pump drive and reinstall the distributer to where you want #1 to point to and realign the magnetic pickup again. The oil pump drive slot points in the same direction as the rotor. Don't forget to compensate for the distributor gear mesh.

Put the cap and wires back on and the engine should fire right up. You should be within a couple of degrees of timing. This is good when you fire an engine up for the first time and need to break in a cam. You don't want to play around trying to set the timing when you need to break in the cam first.

Worst case senario is that you have the camshaft timed 180* out.

18436572 is the typical firing order. The plug wires go clockwise around the distributor. 5 and 7 are the 2 most often mixed up.

 

I have tried the method where I take off the valve covers. I would take them off and then turn the crank pulley with a breaker bar. I would then wait to see movement in the intake valve for cylinder #1, and I would then drop in the distributor to where i thought it may be. No luck so far though.

I have two questions that i am pretty sure may help my progress.

1) Does my rotor turn clockwise or couter-clockwise?
2) What is the ratio of my camshaft gear to my distribtor gear? are they the same size gears with the same amount of teeth?

Thanks!!!

Nick

 

Huh? Why would you want the plug to fire when the intake valve opens?

1) The engine rotates counter clockwise from the drivers point of view. Standing in front of the engine you need to rotate it clockwise.

2) 1:1. Camshaft rotates once, distributor rotates once. Crankshaft will rotate twice.

 

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Stephen 87 IROC
[B]Huh? Why would you want the plug to fire when the intake valve opens?


I'm not going for when the intake valve opens, I just want to drop it in when it is in the general area, then I will fine time it by turning the distributor.

From what I understand, the distributor rotor can be facing either 180 degrees one way or 180 degrees the other way.

Nick

 

Stephen is 100% correct.

Your distributor is out of phase with the cam/vavle timing.

Both the intake and exhaust valve must be closed to ready itself
for the power stroke (firing position).

What you need to do is rotate the crankshaft until the piston is
TDC AND BOTH the intake and exhaust valve are riding on the
baseline of the cam lobes.

IE: rotate the crankshaft until the intake valve fully closes...then stick
your finger in the spark plug hole to feel the compression of the
piston rising.

If all is correct, the balancer mark will line up close to the zero
degree mark on the timing tab - this is when you drop in the
distributor to point at the #1 spark plug wire post.

It's best that you buy a Haynes manual to follow step by step.
What probably happened is you lined up the cam and crank gear
dots for 6 o'clock and 12 o'clock. They should have both been at
12 o'clock...a very common mistake.

FYI: The distributor can ONLY be dropped in one way correctly.
The 180 degree reference doesn't hold true. That would only
work if the #6 cylinder is ready to fire (but let's not go there, it
will confuse the issue).

 

QUOTE]rotate the crankshaft until the valve fully closes...then stick[/QUOTE]

Do i do this when i crank the engine by hand, or do i turn the key???

 

Do this while the engine is off. Use the breaker bar to set the crank position.

You will need to have the odd bank valve cover removed as well.

 

Theoretically you can drop the distributor in where ever you want. It will still go around the same. The key is to have the #1 plug wire in the right position on the cap when the rotor passes under it when #1 cylinder needs to be fired.

#1 plug wire is usually at the left front corner of the cap but it can be put anywhere on the cap as long as the rotor is in the proper position.

Just because the distributor dropped in doesn't mean it's in the proper position. When you drop a distributor in, it will only go into 2 positions at one time (0* and 180*). If the rotor isn't in the proper position, the distributor needs to be pulled out and the shaft needs to be turned at least one tooth on the distributor gear. The distributor now will not drop in properly until the oil pump drive is also turned the same amount. You need about an 8" flat tip screwdriver to reach down and turn the oil pump drive. Once everything is lined up and the rotor is pointing in roughly the direction you want for #1 TDC, follow those instructions I gave above to set the base timing close enough to get the engine started.

You stated that you dropped the distributor in when you saw the intake starting to open. That would put your timing roughly 90* out since the power stroke has finished and it's now starting on the intake stroke.

If the valve cover is off, bar the engine over and watch the rockers. Watch the intake rocker. The rocker will open then close. Once it's closed, look at the timing marks. The mark on the balancer should be coming up to TDC. When it's at TDC, the piston is at the top of the cylinder. You want the timing to before TDC so back it up a few degrees. As I mentioned in my above post, look to see where the rotor is pointing and line up the magnetic pickup points to set the timing.

 

Cool guys...... Thanks for all of your help. I was under the impression that the distributor can drop in either 1 of 2 ways. Hopefully the beast will be running soon.

Thanks again

Nick