Methanol Injection ????
03-01-2003, 11:19 AM
#1
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Methanol Injection ????
Well, I was thinking about how they use water to cool the induction of air and make more power last night. Great, good idea.... Then I started to think about the dillutive act that water has on gasoline... Hmmmm....
Now, here is what i'm thinking... Methanol injection. A spray of methanol to cool the intake charge. If you have ever gotten any on your hand, you know how cold it becomes when it contacts air, and it's flammable. It would be a pretty simple setup using a small 1 gallon tank and some lines as far as i can see...
Any Ideas ? Has this been done ?
-Shannon
Now, here is what i'm thinking... Methanol injection. A spray of methanol to cool the intake charge. If you have ever gotten any on your hand, you know how cold it becomes when it contacts air, and it's flammable. It would be a pretty simple setup using a small 1 gallon tank and some lines as far as i can see...
Any Ideas ? Has this been done ?
-Shannon
03-01-2003, 02:05 PM
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Oh Vito, don't forget i've been using methanol since I started racing 9 years ago 
I'm thinking a 1 gallon auxilery tank run to the back of the throttle body with some nozzles to inject it into the intake, towards the back, kind of like the NOS throttle bodies. Damn thing would be pretty much free if I used a wiper motor or something similar to pump the meth.
Would the cooling charge help much I wonder
I don't think the atomized fuel would have any problems mixing. I know that meth won't directly mix with gas very well, and it definitly won't mix with oil.
I'm just trying to cool the charge going into the intake...
-Shannon
I'm thinking a 1 gallon auxilery tank run to the back of the throttle body with some nozzles to inject it into the intake, towards the back, kind of like the NOS throttle bodies. Damn thing would be pretty much free if I used a wiper motor or something similar to pump the meth.
Would the cooling charge help much I wonder
I don't think the atomized fuel would have any problems mixing. I know that meth won't directly mix with gas very well, and it definitly won't mix with oil.
I'm just trying to cool the charge going into the intake...
-Shannon
03-01-2003, 03:45 PM
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We use alcohol and propane injection kits in the turbo buicks all the time. Alky injection does a few things actually: first it cools the intake charge and CC temps(lower specific heat), acts as a supplemental fuel (methanol is about 110-115 octane, ethanol about 100).Methanol is a good injecting agent, but is too corrosive to normal fuel lines and pumps. I think it was discovered that a mid-90s Ford truck fuel pump will stand up to meth for quite some time. I use 100% denatured from Lowes and have had great results(it is Ethanol, but has a little meth added to make it poisonous to keep people from making their own beverages 
). Lately Propane injection stole the spotlight though.
For me:
93oct/17psi max/little to no knock
93+alky injection/24psi max/little to no knock. So alky lets me run 7psi more boost than on pump alone.
1 tank of alky will last about 13-15 runs at the track.
A fellow member over on the TB board ran almost 27psi boost on pump gas and propane injection. The thing is, propane is somewhat cheap, allows you to run more boost, and if you boost it a couple of times a day a tank will last you over a month. I might be selling my SMC alky setup and getting Jay Carter's "Propain" system.
Browse around on here for a while:
www.turbobuick.com/messagebd/
go to the alky,n2o, and propane board and enjoy.
[edit]- check out the thread entitled "methanol in the smc kit", they go into a very detail discussion about ethanol vs methanol
). Lately Propane injection stole the spotlight though.For me:
93oct/17psi max/little to no knock
93+alky injection/24psi max/little to no knock. So alky lets me run 7psi more boost than on pump alone.
1 tank of alky will last about 13-15 runs at the track.
A fellow member over on the TB board ran almost 27psi boost on pump gas and propane injection. The thing is, propane is somewhat cheap, allows you to run more boost, and if you boost it a couple of times a day a tank will last you over a month. I might be selling my SMC alky setup and getting Jay Carter's "Propain" system.
Browse around on here for a while:
www.turbobuick.com/messagebd/
go to the alky,n2o, and propane board and enjoy.
[edit]- check out the thread entitled "methanol in the smc kit", they go into a very detail discussion about ethanol vs methanol
Last edited by Fast Caddie; 03-01-2003 at 03:57 PM.
03-01-2003, 04:33 PM
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I'm heading to the TB forum now
Main reason I want to use Meth over Alc is the fact I can get any amount of meth I want for free
I'm gonna try this on my Z28 and see if I feel any difference or anything. I'm definitly gonna do this on the 2.8 after we get the turbo set up on there... Shhhhh
Be expecting some pics in a couple weeks...lol
-Shannon
Main reason I want to use Meth over Alc is the fact I can get any amount of meth I want for free
I'm gonna try this on my Z28 and see if I feel any difference or anything. I'm definitly gonna do this on the 2.8 after we get the turbo set up on there... Shhhhh
Be expecting some pics in a couple weeks...lol
-Shannon
03-02-2003, 01:54 PM
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Don't know too awful much about meth but I do know the stuff is extremely corrosive. How do you plan to keep it from eating everything up? Maybe stainless fittings???
Good luck though!
-Mindgame
Good luck though!
-Mindgame
03-02-2003, 06:11 PM
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Originally posted by Mindgame
Don't know too awful much about meth but I do know the stuff is extremely corrosive. How do you plan to keep it from eating everything up? Maybe stainless fittings???
Good luck though!
-Mindgame
Don't know too awful much about meth but I do know the stuff is extremely corrosive. How do you plan to keep it from eating everything up? Maybe stainless fittings???
Good luck though!
-Mindgame
I'm going to use the same fuel lines we used on our racing karts since it's not going to require a large amount of fuel just too cool the charge. now i'm just working on figuring out what kind of pump to use -Shannon
03-02-2003, 09:13 PM
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Originally posted by ROOSTER93V8
This is rather old technology...
How bout just water? Water has a higher heat capacity therfore it can hold (or absorbe) 7 times more heat that gasoline.
If you don't need the octane don't use it
This is rather old technology...
How bout just water? Water has a higher heat capacity therfore it can hold (or absorbe) 7 times more heat that gasoline.
If you don't need the octane don't use it
BTW, i'm trying to find an Eaton
lol-Shannon
03-02-2003, 09:17 PM
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I believe different things where injected into aircraft motors way back in WW1 By WW2 nitrous, Water, methane where all being used.
Its not surprising that 80% of fuel used is used for internal lubrication and cooling.
Those Me-109 mechanical fuel injected and RR Merlin engines of ww2 where simply amazing.
BTW need a M90?
Its not surprising that 80% of fuel used is used for internal lubrication and cooling.
Those Me-109 mechanical fuel injected and RR Merlin engines of ww2 where simply amazing.
BTW need a M90?
03-02-2003, 10:27 PM
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Originally posted by ROOSTER93V8
I believe different things where injected into aircraft motors way back in WW1 By WW2 nitrous, Water, methane where all being used.
Its not surprising that 80% of fuel used is used for internal lubrication and cooling.
Those Me-109 mechanical fuel injected and RR Merlin engines of ww2 where simply amazing.
BTW need a M90?
I believe different things where injected into aircraft motors way back in WW1 By WW2 nitrous, Water, methane where all being used.
Its not surprising that 80% of fuel used is used for internal lubrication and cooling.
Those Me-109 mechanical fuel injected and RR Merlin engines of ww2 where simply amazing.
BTW need a M90?
Thanks for the info in your Eaton post BTW, I've got tons of plans now
-Shannon
03-02-2003, 10:43 PM
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Re: asdl
Originally posted by ROOSTER93V8
No problem,
Jeez, i'm not going to head back overthere until i work on it a bit more though. If you read I've been answering the EXACT same question for 2 pages now. hehe
No problem,
Jeez, i'm not going to head back overthere until i work on it a bit more though. If you read I've been answering the EXACT same question for 2 pages now. hehe
-Shannon
03-03-2003, 03:53 PM
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Check out www.snowperformance.net they have the methanol/water cooler kit w/everthing you need for about $300.00.