S-m-o-k-e!!!!!
Thread Starter
Registered User
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 108
S-m-o-k-e!!!!!
I have a 87 with a 350 tpi...it has 83000 on it....when i start it up a lil puff of smoke comes out....i was wonding if any of you have the same problem...do you know what it is...are the rings shot...is it comming threw the valves...is this common...i have heard of other people having the problem and they say..."dont worry about it"...i replied your a dumb a$$ ( in my head) i dont want to just not worry i want to know why this happening...the thing of it is it doesnt seem to use any oil...can you explain this....
Registered User
Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 461
From: Richmond, Va
Re: S-m-o-k-e!!!!!
Sounds like the valve seals... They will crack after while and allow oil to drip past to the valves after the car sits... Not a huge deal to change.. You can change them with the heads still on the car... If the car blows smoke all the time, that can be a ring problem.
Registered User
Joined: Dec 1969
Posts: 1,147
From: Phila., PA
Re: S-m-o-k-e!!!!!
Valve guide seals are dried up, hardened and leaking oil down the valve guides. Very common on these engines. You can replace them if you don't mind pulling the valve springs off. Frankly, when I replace guide seals I replace the springs or upgrade them with Crane #99848 springs while I'm at it. With access to compressed air and the right tools it's still a solid day's work.
Registered User
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 100
From: Grand Rapids, MI
Re: S-m-o-k-e!!!!!
The valve guides and the valve stem seals (which are leaky in your case) are 2 very different things.
http://images.snapfish.com/3429%3B74...%3A79%3Aot1lsi
That pic shows the general location of the valve seal. In that particular picture, it shows a positive seal. Older SBC's used the umbrella and the O-ring designs. By design, the posi-type is the best and most "sealing" design. To my knowledge, Fel-Pro is the only company that makes a positive design seal that fits the factory guide boss and is available at most parts stores.
Basically, here's the run down:
1.) Remove the valve covers and deside which side you want to do first. I start with the driver side. Remove all the spark plugs for that side.
2.) You will need a method to hold the valves up while you remove the springs. The 2 ways suggested are compressed air and a length of nylon rope. With the compressed air, you will need a spark plug fitting. Once you get that, just thread it in, turn it on, and the valves will be pinned up for that particular cylinder. With the rope method, take a length of nylon rope (I used 3/8") and feed it in through the plug hole. Once you have a good portion of rope in, rotate the engine over by hand (I have a crankshaft socket that bolts to the 3 bolts on the balancer for this, other methods include using the crank pulley, and if you are REALLY careful, bumping it over). Either way, the piston will push the rope up and press it against the valves, physically preventing them from falling while you do the swap. Air is obviously faster and more convenient, but either method works.
3.) You will need a valve spring compressor tool. Because the heads are on the car, you will need one that uses leverage from the rocker stud. These are available from most parts stores, etc. With the valves forced closed, remove the rocker arm and pushrod (lay them on a towel, keep them clean). Take some paper towels, something and lay them around the bottom of the heads, covering all the tiny little holes that lead to the depths of the engine. This prevents the pesky little locks from falling into a place where you can't get them. A magnet is handy as well.
4.) Use the sprinc compressor and compress the springs. Use the magnet to retrieve the locks. Remember, there are 2 locks per valve spring. Once you do that, slowly release the spring compressor and remove the valve spring and retaining assembly. You will now see the valve seal. Yank the old garbage off now. If you got the positive seal design, apply a light coating of oil to them to help them slip on. The locking grooves on the valves can be sharp enough to damage the inner side of the seals, and that is bad. Slip the seal on and press it into place. Make sure it is firmly seated on the guide boss.
5.) Place the valve spring and retaining assembly back over the valve stem and use the compressor again to compress the spring. Place the locks back on the valve stem and release the compressor. The locks will get wedged back into place. I only depress the spring just far enough that the locks can rest on the retainer.
Do one cylinder at a time and you will keep things in order from where they came off.
That's the basics. There isn't too much more to it than that. Like said above, doesn't sound like much, but it's still a good chunk of work. Esp. if you use the rope-in-the-hole method.
http://images.snapfish.com/3429%3B74...%3A79%3Aot1lsi
That pic shows the general location of the valve seal. In that particular picture, it shows a positive seal. Older SBC's used the umbrella and the O-ring designs. By design, the posi-type is the best and most "sealing" design. To my knowledge, Fel-Pro is the only company that makes a positive design seal that fits the factory guide boss and is available at most parts stores.
Basically, here's the run down:
1.) Remove the valve covers and deside which side you want to do first. I start with the driver side. Remove all the spark plugs for that side.
2.) You will need a method to hold the valves up while you remove the springs. The 2 ways suggested are compressed air and a length of nylon rope. With the compressed air, you will need a spark plug fitting. Once you get that, just thread it in, turn it on, and the valves will be pinned up for that particular cylinder. With the rope method, take a length of nylon rope (I used 3/8") and feed it in through the plug hole. Once you have a good portion of rope in, rotate the engine over by hand (I have a crankshaft socket that bolts to the 3 bolts on the balancer for this, other methods include using the crank pulley, and if you are REALLY careful, bumping it over). Either way, the piston will push the rope up and press it against the valves, physically preventing them from falling while you do the swap. Air is obviously faster and more convenient, but either method works.
3.) You will need a valve spring compressor tool. Because the heads are on the car, you will need one that uses leverage from the rocker stud. These are available from most parts stores, etc. With the valves forced closed, remove the rocker arm and pushrod (lay them on a towel, keep them clean). Take some paper towels, something and lay them around the bottom of the heads, covering all the tiny little holes that lead to the depths of the engine. This prevents the pesky little locks from falling into a place where you can't get them. A magnet is handy as well.
4.) Use the sprinc compressor and compress the springs. Use the magnet to retrieve the locks. Remember, there are 2 locks per valve spring. Once you do that, slowly release the spring compressor and remove the valve spring and retaining assembly. You will now see the valve seal. Yank the old garbage off now. If you got the positive seal design, apply a light coating of oil to them to help them slip on. The locking grooves on the valves can be sharp enough to damage the inner side of the seals, and that is bad. Slip the seal on and press it into place. Make sure it is firmly seated on the guide boss.
5.) Place the valve spring and retaining assembly back over the valve stem and use the compressor again to compress the spring. Place the locks back on the valve stem and release the compressor. The locks will get wedged back into place. I only depress the spring just far enough that the locks can rest on the retainer.
Do one cylinder at a time and you will keep things in order from where they came off.
That's the basics. There isn't too much more to it than that. Like said above, doesn't sound like much, but it's still a good chunk of work. Esp. if you use the rope-in-the-hole method.
Last edited by Stekman; Jan 28, 2005 at 02:53 PM.