5thgen69camaro

Why does it still stand? noone said to make the car out of titanium and gold, but balance the weight that is there as close to 50/50.

Rampant

I think the overall theme here is balance. Not necessarily 50/50 weight balance, but balancing all the variables involved. Cost, overall weight, unsprung weight (an SRA detriment), etc.

And, personally suspension settings can overcome nose-heavy distribution a whole lot easier a higher total weight. I say, the lighter the better.

Heck, look at the Evos. They have something like 60/40 distribution at ~3200#, and I don't hear anyone complaining about they handle. Yet a Z has 52/48 distribution and they understeer like mad from the factory.

For me overall weight is more important than distribution for the Camaro.

Good Ph.D

Putting things in orthodox places cost money, using lightweight materials cost money, BMW had to do both of those to get that kind of balance for the car.

jg95z28

Thank you!!!

Look... I want a great handling Camaro just as much as the next guy. All I am saying is I want the lightest-best-handling car for the price. What some people are suggesting sounds good on paper, but try engineering a sub $30k, 50/50, 3200-lb ponycar. I just don't see it being practical.

JakeRobb

Okay, but you've misinterpreted me. Aim for perfection, so that when you're close, you end up with something good. Would a 53/47, 3400-lb pony car be impractical? I'd be more than happy with that.

Z28Wilson

I can't speak for everyone else, but that is what I am saying as well. I just don't like the attitude of "Pony Cars aren't supposed to be even close to 50/50 balance and if you're looking for that you don't want a Camaro." All I want is for the Camaro to have best in class handling, and a number of factors play into that....weight, balance, and steering feel.

jg95z28

I agree with you in principle; however I don't like the idea of people throwing out generalisms without thinking of the logistical impacts they may create. Let's say GM comes up with the following cases:

(a) 3200-lb coupe; 55/45 weight distribution; $45,000 MSRP
(b) 3600-lb coupe; 60/40 weight distribution; $30,000 MSRP
(c) 3900-lb coupe; 50/50 weight distribution; $38,000 MSRP

These of course are hypothetical scenarios, but for sake of arqument, let's say each of these theoretical "Camaros" has class leading performance and handling. Which would you prefer? Personally, I feel case (b) is the closest to the "winning formula" Camaro will need to be successful.

The question is do you compromise cost; weight; or performance? That is the task GM engineers are being asked to tackle. Personally, I think its a little late in the game to be going back to the drawing board. At this point the Camaro is what it is. To start over at this point, would delay its arrival by several years.

Z28Wilson

I don't disagree with you.

Again, because the IRS will undoubtedly be heavier than the rear end of the previous car I don't think balance will be a concern. Overall weight still is, but I doubt we'll have an overly nose-heavy car with the IRS out back.

5thgen69camaro

I dont think anyone was asking for a 3200 pound car. I dont know where you came up with that, nor a perfect 50/50 but to make an attempt to get close as reasonably possible to a 50/50 3600-3700 pounds especially with the IRS weight offsetting the engine and transmission.

jg95z28

A few people have said they want it as close to 3000 lb as possible.

5thgen69camaro

Well there I agree with you then. Thats rediculous to expect even for a vette.

JakeRobb

Did you just pull those out of thin air, without even thinking about them? The conditions don't even improve with price.

I didn't start this thread to talk about price, I just wanted to put an idea in people's heads, and that is that overall weight shouldn't be taken so low as to prevent decent balance. IMO, 55/45 weight distribution is the worst that GM should let out the doors as the 5th gen Camaro. The 4th gen is 56/44, and it's front-heaviness causes it to understeer when pushed in turns. I'm just asking for some improvement in that department.

But, since you brought up price, I'd take the $45,000 car. That said, you've pretty much described a C6 with those numbers, except that the Vette's balance is a little better than 55/45. GM probably wouldn't sell too many Camaros like that, but that's more an issue of poor market positioning than it is of vehicle handling compromises.

I'm thinking that 53/47, 3400lb is doable with a pricing scheme competitive with the Mustang. Do you disagree?

DvBoard

When your designing from scratch (like i assume was done with the camaro) then you can work in fairly what ever you want for cheaper than it is to try to go back and fix it later. So lets hope they aimed for 50/50 3k form the start so that when they end they will be close and the price will be low vs having to go back and "fix" it.

ChrisL

ok... a 3000lb Camaro, when the C6 Z06 is what? ~3100 lbs.



You can have a 3000 lb Camaro. It just wont have an engine.



It will weigh what it weighs. Rest assured, weight is everyone's enemy, so GM will do what it can to reduce weight, within the bounds of the business plan.

5thgen69camaro

AND come up with a decent weight distribution? I hope!