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Old 03-03-2013, 02:30 PM   #1
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starting toggle switch

Ok guys I have a serious problem. I've gone through 3 ignition tumblers in 2 months. Its nothing to do with the car its the actual car just the tumblers are all a giant pos. I'm finally saying screw it and I'm just going to go ahead and going to wire everything to toggle switches. Here is the problem. Having never done this before I really have no idea where to start. I want to have it set up to have a spring loaded toggle with run being the center position, up being start then spring back to center, and down being off. What wires do I need to use to make this happen and how do I need to hook them up. Also, how does the security system play into this? Do I need to hook up a switch for the fuel pump? The problem with the tumbler now is that the key won't go in all the way. Thanks guys.
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Old 03-03-2013, 02:57 PM   #2
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Re: starting toggle switch

Here's the schematic, http://shbox.com/1/ignswschematic.jpg Ignition switch is actually gang mounted 4 switch setup 1- applies +12 in run, and accy but drops the +12 in start when it kills kill radio, windows etc as voltage will drop while cranking plus starter needs all the juice. The next switch holds +12 in Run and start to feed the PCM, engine sensors and guages, the third +12 in run no voltage in start kills blowers, fans, ABS when cranking. The last +12 in start no voltage in RUN hits the starting circuitry and eventually the starter solenoid . Can easily be done with a couple DPDT relays with the NO and NC points wired to mimick the 4 switches, not so easily with just mechanical switches.. Basically convert it over to a push button starter.
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Old 03-03-2013, 04:30 PM   #3
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Re: starting toggle switch

Ok thanks, now just looking at that diagram would it be possible to put in 4 toggles off the ignition switch? One on the Brn wire, one on the Pnk wire, one on the Org wire, and one on the Yel wire? Just turn on the yellow wire for the crank and clutch signals and the pink wire for the injectors? Not sure where the fuel pump comes in at, maybe the pink wire also? Once the starter is engaged and the car starts and is running then turn the other toggles on?
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Old 03-03-2013, 06:31 PM   #4
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Re: starting toggle switch

Ok couple quick questions after looking at the diagram. Is there only 4 wires coming out of the ignition switch: BROWN, PINK, ORANGE, and YELLOW? Of course the red is coming in for the +12v. Also, according to the diagram the YELLOW wire shows only powered during starting for the crank and security and neutral safety switch signals but then it looks like there is no power in run, which was stated earlier. My question concerning that is wouldn't the security system shut the car down if it was running if it hadn't been bi-passed? Thanks guys.
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Old 03-03-2013, 10:55 PM   #5
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Re: starting toggle switch

Once the engine starts, the security system no longer controls whether it runs. It is only there to cut off power to the starter. The security system also provides a fuel permit signal to the PCM when the starter is cranking.
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Old 03-04-2013, 12:52 AM   #6
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Re: starting toggle switch

Thanks injuneer. So do I have it right in thinking that I can run 4 toggles like this? And if so can i run a 2 pole toggle with just the 12v and source wire to it and it will still ground where it would normally or will I need a 3 pole with 12v, source and ground toggle?
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Old 03-04-2013, 07:26 AM   #7
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Re: starting toggle switch

Using 4 toggles will work, but would be a bit clunky, IMHO. The one for the starter needs to be a momentary switch. bobdec gave good advice on using less switches and adding relays for the items powered in the run position. There are no grounds involved. Your car won't be very secure from theft when wired in this manner.

You already got pretty good advice here before you emailed me with the same questions.
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Old 03-04-2013, 11:22 AM   #8
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Re: starting toggle switch

Thanks guys appreciate it. I like the relays idea but think on a toggle panel one or two toggles wouldn't look right. I'll go with 4 toggles or 3 with a pushbutton and a hidden toggle for security. I'll also take out the lock plate on the steering wheel, can't forget that. I appreciate the help guys cause before yesterday I didn't have a clue. Also, this was somewhat of an emergency as of yesterday because my duramax needs injectors and this is my only other car that my wife and I have to share and the only way I can start it is to use a drill bit to push the lock ball on the tumbler while holding the security wires on the key and rotating it all at the same time. Kinda a pain in the butt.
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Old 03-04-2013, 11:39 AM   #9
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Re: starting toggle switch

And all this is because the key cylinders you are buying keep failing? What brand are they? How do they fail? In essence, you are making your car easier to steal. If you have to do the push-button start, there are ready made panels available. I would also include a hidden switch to prevent the entire system from operating, to deter theft.

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Last edited by Injuneer; 03-04-2013 at 11:49 AM.
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Old 03-05-2013, 12:05 AM   #10
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Re: starting toggle switch

Really the tumbler is fine, its the black dress up piece that falls off.After a few turns it starts to get loose until it completely falls off.inside the black part is where the security system wires are held that touch the resistor in the key. The black part also houses the lock button.once it comes off you better have a drill bit or pen cartridge handy if you want to get the key out. The 3 lock cylinders I have gotten are as follows: one from oreillys, one from Autozone and one from a locksmith. All three are plastic black dress up pieces.All three have failed at the same point. I will absolutely have at least one hidden switch. I have looked at the ones like painless and I know i can make one for cheaper than $200 plus I can incorporate my line lock and things into it as I do stuff to the car.
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Old 03-07-2013, 03:45 PM   #11
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Re: starting toggle switch

Do you have a plan to disable the steering lock also?
Not sure why you would need all that electrical gear. Can't you just rig something to move the switch actuator rod in and out?
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Old 03-07-2013, 09:37 PM   #12
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Re: starting toggle switch

Quote:
Originally Posted by GaryDoug View Post
Do you have a plan to disable the steering lock also?
...
Quote:
Originally Posted by YBSTOCK View Post
... I'll also take out the lock plate on the steering wheel, can't forget that. ...
Answered before asked.
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Old 03-07-2013, 09:37 PM
 
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