t-tops or no t-tops

i've been trying to decide on whether to get an lt1 car or an ls1 car. but either way, i was looking for one with no t-tops since i want to use the car for autocrossing and some straight line racing fun, along with driving to work every now and then. i have seen my share of leaking tops, noisy t-tops and also figured thats there has to be some added weight with them and some loss of strength in the body.
so with these hassles in mind, i was looking for a car without t-tops. only problem is that almost all the M6's i find have t-tops.

so - is having t-tops that bad??? should i just buy one with t-tops and just not worry about it??

thanks
tony

ttops are not that bad.

for the most part they fixed the leaking and the noise thing. and there is only a mild loss of ridgidity with them.

i'd say thow on some SFC....but that will likely put you in a different autoX class.

That is like asking black or white lol. All preference. I prefer not to have them. I have had a convertible, t-tops and hardtop, and I really prefer the hardtop, however I am looking at a car with t-tops, only because the T/A Ls1 doesnt come without them:(

I love my T-tops. I ran in ESP at an SCCA autocross a while back, and all of the F-body guys were running with the t-tops off (even lighter than a hardtop that way!).

I agree.... t-tops all the way. And I converted my car, the metal removed. is really not a "major" structural support.

Ive always thought T-tops were awesome.

The GM shipping figures show that T-tops add 12.3#

The GM shipping figures show that T-tops add 12.3#
Are these shipping figures available online? How detailed are they? For instance, does it say how much more an SS weighs than a Z28?

T-tops are fantastic. I'd never own a F-Body without them.

The table was copied from the 1995 factory data, so the SS is not included. Obviously some of the numbers are not applicable to the 98+ cars, because of the change in engine weight, but body-related features like TTops are identical on all years. Look at the bottom of this page:

http://www.f-body.org/tech/tech.htm#FourthGen

T-tops are fantastic. I'd never own a F-Body without them.
Just the opposite for me. No t-tops.

I like the T-tops in a street car, but they're sort of superfluous on a "track" car. I bought the stock plastic roof panel off a guy who did a coupe-->T-top conversion, in the hope that I could make light weight replacements for the glass tops, at least for track use. Still working on it though.

it would be cool if someone made carbonfiber t-top replacements for track use or fiberglass. you could start with broken t-tops no glass and go from there.

it would be cool if someone made carbonfiber t-top replacements for track use or fiberglass. you could start with broken t-tops no glass and go from there.

I actually thought about doing it with my roof panel form my conversion but its a little beat up.


All honesty though, the weight difference between the metal removed, and the roof panel vs. a set o t-tops is neglibible.

I didn't actually weigh it, but I think the metal might even be heavier then the t-tops.

their is a decent weight difference in the weatherstripping though.


Either way the weight benefits is neglibible imo... Take a **** before you race, and you will be good ;)

I like the T-tops in a street car, but they're sort of superfluous on a "track" car. I bought the stock plastic roof panel off a guy who did a coupe-->T-top conversion, in the hope that I could make light weight replacements for the glass tops, at least for track use. Still working on it though.


A thought I had was just keep the one piece and make it into a "fake targa top" Take the center bar out, and add the side pieces.

what you have to ask yourself is... do you really think 5 or 10 pounds is gonna make u win the race? with propper mods 10 pounds will not make a difference.

- I've had my car for 7 years, tops don't leak
- There is no "structural advantage" to the hardtop 4th Gen's. Those little metal support bars for the hardtop don't do anything.
- T-tops cars are easier to sell
- T-top cars are much more fun in nice weather, and look better with the tops out.
- SLIGHTLY better head room w/ T-tops

If you don't like taking them out, then just leave them in. I wouldn't buy a 4th Gen without them.

yeah im wishing my car had t-tops vs. the hardtop i have now...:( i frequently take rides in my cousins car bc i like the t-tops alot better and if i had the time and drive to convert my car to t-tops i definitely would..o and my car is an m6 with hardtop...

The only thing I might add is that T-Tops look great on a black car, but tend to be a distraction on any other color car. Zero leaks or noise. I always use the inside covers to shield the sun (bake like a Pheasant under glass)

This is my opinion only. Also, my favorite color is blue and my most comfortable tempertature is 72 degrees...Oh, and then there is this subject of blondes.

The only thing I might add is that T-Tops look great on a black car, but tend to be a distraction on any other color car. Zero leaks or noise. I always use the inside covers to shield the sun (bake like a Pheasant under glass)
Lots of T-Top cars (mine, for instance) are black on top, making the t-tops not-so-distracting.

http://homepage.mac.com/jakerobb/camaro/1.jpg

Correction:

Quote: The only thing I might add is that T-Tops look great on a black car, but tend to be a distraction on any other color car...


Blue looks good too!

I prefer not to have them. I have had a convertible, t-tops and hardtop, and I really prefer the hardtop.

Agreed. :)

T-tops = more sun glare, noise and sunburn when out, the car looks better with a roof of any kind rather than the open T-top look. T-tops just make a car look less strong even if it is the same.

I could live with T-tops if I had the sunshades for them and the glass was tinted. But otherwise, I'll pass. I do like sunroofs that open an inch or two at the back though.

I'm about to buy a '00 T-top tomorrow. Do they come oem with "sunshades" or is that some aftermarket item. Be nice to get all the stuff that came with the car, rather than jack with the seller for things he forgot to throw in the trunk.

I've had both T-tops and hardtop and the only advantage the hardtop had from my opinion is if you roll the car. I rolled my hardtop in March and I bet I would be dead if I had the T-tops in my car, but my new car has them and I love them. More head room, even though it is just a little, and girls love it (for the most part, my gf doesn't like it, but that's just cause the hardtop saved me in my last one).

i would agree that t-tops are better! and if you dont like the sun glare, you can put inserts in that come with the car, it blocks the glare.

i would agree that t-tops are better! and if you dont like the sun glare, you can put inserts in that come with the car, it blocks the glare.


agreed.


It has more headroom, can be just the same as a hardtop on the inside when you get the t-top shades in.

I've had both T-tops and hardtop and the only advantage the hardtop had from my opinion is if you roll the car. I rolled my hardtop in March and I bet I would be dead if I had the T-tops in my car, but my new car has them and I love them. More head room, even though it is just a little, and girls love it (for the most part, my gf doesn't like it, but that's just cause the hardtop saved me in my last one).
I don't think a hardtop would be any safer in a rollover than a t-top. What are you basing that on?

I'm about to buy a '00 T-top tomorrow. Do they come oem with "sunshades" or is that some aftermarket item.Yeah, the shades came with the car, it just depends whether the guy kept them, used them, lost them, or sold them somewhere along the line?!;) I've still got my factory sunshades, but they've been in the original bag up in the loft somewhere!:D I think I stuck them in place once or twice just to try them?:think:

...personally, I LOVE the open roof feeling (even if the T's are on the car) and I love the storage spot in the trunk for them :bow:. GM definitely got that part right!:thumb: And in comparison to the '81 Z28 I had with T-tops, these don't rattle or leak at all ... only problem is if you spray water directly at the top of the side windows, a few dribbles of water can get through, but I don't know that the T-tops are even to blame for that??:shrug:

I don't think a hardtop would be any safer in a rollover than a t-top. What are you basing that on?

I'm basing that on the small cut I got from busting my head on the roof compared to what would have been my brains all over the road if I had the glass t-tops that would have shattered when I rolled over.

Hard top here. :)

I'm basing that on the small cut I got from busting my head on the roof compared to what would have been my brains all over the road if I had the glass t-tops that would have shattered when I rolled over.
Basic logic should explain the superior safety of metal vs. glass protecting your head;).

I'm basing that on the small cut I got from busting my head on the roof compared to what would have been my brains all over the road if I had the glass t-tops that would have shattered when I rolled over.
T-top glass is very thick, first of all. Thicker than your windshield.

Second, all auto glass is extremely shatter resistant. If you do manage to break the glass, it will just sag, but the pieces will hold together. There is a strong layer of clear plastic sandwiched between two layers of glass.

I can't say for sure, but I am confident that a t-top car would have protected you just as well as your hardtop, and that your brains would not have ended up all over the road.

I wish i had t-tops. I bought my camaro without even thinking about them. i almost regret it but i still love my car.

:cool: I had to order my car to get a hardtop. No T-Tops for me in any car since my 68 Vette new in Sept of 67:eek: And JakeRobb unless they have changed in the last few weeks, all t-tops and car glass less the windshield are tempered glass. Shatters into a zillion pieces very easily in a rollover or crash.:eek:

:cool: I had to order my car to get a hardtop. No T-Tops for me in any car since my 68 Vette new in Sept of 67:eek: And JakeRobb unless they have changed in the last few weeks, all t-tops and car glass less the windshield are tempered glass. Shatters into a zillion pieces very easily in a rollover or crash.:eek:
Yeah, but the zillion pieces all hold together due to the plastic layer.

Basic logic should explain the superior safety of metal vs. glass protecting your head;).


Here is a secret....the roof is not metal, it's plastic. Thin, flexible plastic, like the fenders. :o

I agree i have the T-tops and my head sticks up a lilttle past the beam that goes between the 2 tops. If i rolled that car that glass would not do a damn thing.

Basic logic should explain the superior safety of metal vs. glass protecting your head;).
Too bad that's thin fiberglass panel over your head on a hardtop car, not metal. :D

Too bad that's thin fiberglass panel over your head on a hardtop car, not metal. :D

Easy now, Joe!! ;) I already got schooled once on this!!! :D

Here is a secret....the roof is not metal, it's plastic. Thin, flexible plastic, like the fenders. :o

Yeah, thanks, I guess ya learn something new everyday!;) And here I thought I knew just about all I could know about 4th-gens:rolleyes:.

..... well, back to school!! :)

But I have to comment on this:
Yeah, but the zillion pieces all hold together due to the plastic layer.

I don't think the glass exactly "holds together" all that well?:think: I've seen enough crashed cars with windows smashed in and the glass scattered all over the interior!:shrug: Windshields seem to be the only thing that will actually stay in one piece "sort of". Do we know for certain that the T-tops are built like the windshield??:confused:

I don't think the glass exactly "holds together" all that well?:think: I've seen enough crashed cars with windows smashed in and the glass scattered all over the interior!:shrug: Windshields seem to be the only thing that will actually stay in one piece "sort of". Do we know for certain that the T-tops are built like the windshield??:confused:
I don't know about the t-tops, but I've never seen a side window on a late-model car that didn't have the safety glass I'm talking about.

I love my t-tops, and my 98 Z28 is for sale.
winter is coming, and I am broke.

The side glass,on any car, is designed to break into small pebble size chunks. If the doors don't open you can crawl out vertually uncut.T-tops are like the windshield. I've seen rolled T-top cars (3rd gen) and the T-top glass stayed together just like the windsheild "CAPN".

You may be able to find a picture in this link. http://www.marshu.com/ws6-pontiac-camaro-car-crashes-accidents.php

May have changed since then, but when my mom rolled a 1 week old 1982 Z28 on to the roof, the glass shattered into a million pieces. Her head didn't get scraped by the glass because she was hanging upside down in her seatbelt.

Wear your seatbelts kids.

I've seen rolled T-top cars (3rd gen) and the T-top glass stayed together just like the windsheild "CAPN".
That's good to know than:thumb:. Like I said, I've seen lots of shattered side windows (the glass in little "pebbles" all over the interior) but I've never seen a rolled F-body before to see what happens to the T-tops. I know they shatter if/when they fly off on the highway though;) (not from personal experience mind you!!:o).

May have changed since then, but when my mom rolled a 1 week old 1982 Z28 on to the roof, the glass shattered into a million pieces. Her head didn't get scraped by the glass because she was hanging upside down in her seatbelt.

Wear your seatbelts kids.

Judging from this experience I was right. My brains would have been all over the road. The roof went from flat to a V shape on the driver side roof.

My driver side window went into a million pieces too. I've still got pieces in my arm and hand cause the doctor couldn't get it all out.

I was wearing my seatbelt by the way.