I have installed a vortech supercharger kit on a friends 97 WS6. The kit comes with the Crane HI-6r and a different map sensor with a retard box. This car is highly modified now,( stroker, heads, big cam) and I got a tune from pcmforless that i downloaded to the pcm with my tunercat program. My question is is it really necessary for the Crane box now with the pcm tune or is it just for factory pcm tuned cars to retard timing? Should i install it anyway and just do 0deg timing retard with the retard box and run the MAP the kit came with and the factory MAP on the intake, or keep all that off and get a 2 bar MAP?? I dont really understand how it all works yet. Does a 2 bar map measure both vacuum and pressure? where can i get one if one is needed? thanks for your help with the newbie questions

Chad

 

What kind of map sensor is it?. Is it a 2 bar?, never the less if the pcm was tuned for the s/c then you "shouldnt" need the retard box.

 

The car has the facory MAP on the intakem and i dont know what the vortech kit came with...IT is a slightly used kit, and it doesnt say any particulars in the instructions. I am guessing once you hit WOT and start producing boost, the map that came with the kit reads the pressure being built, goes thru the retard box, then goes to the Crane box and tells it how much to retard the timing according to how much boost is being created and how much retard is requested by the retard ***. I think its all uneccessary if you have a custom tune, but just want to make sure,

Chad

 

I think you answered your own question. I agree that with a custom tune you don't need the crane box. PCM for less is pretty conservative on his SC tunes as far as timing goes. It is generally accepted here that a two bar Map is good in theory but is extremely difficult to tune. I would leave all that extra stuff off and let the PCM do its job.

In aviation we call it KISS (Keep it simple stupid)

 

The Crane Hi6R box will provide a hotter spark, this is a good thing to have on a blown car along with the spark plug gap reduced to .035 - .038 and non-platinum plugs 1 - 2 heat ranges colder. As far as the retard function, you won't need that with custom tuning.

 

thanks for the replies guys. i am using th epcmforless tune just as a base tune to get it broke in. i plan on gettin a dynotune in the near future. i have autolite non platinum plugs 2 steps colder gapped at .035". imgoing to skipusing the crane box and get a msd6al for a re liniter. thanks again

Chad

 

You should ask bryan just in case.

That would be the safe way.

 

I ran across this exact same problem with my combo. . .

First of all, the MAP sensor for the Crane is a 2 bar, while the stock is 1 bar. DO NOT replace the stock MAP sensor with the 2 bar unless you have a specific tune for it. It screws with much more in the computer than you realize.

I put my car together at first with a 9 psi Vortech. Since I was doing my own computer tuning, I though I could do without the Crane box and timing retard. WRONG!

First of all, the car would stutter at anything over 4.5 psi boost. Installation of a simpler MSD 6AL cured that problem.

Then, I had persistent detonation problems even though I dialed the timing all the way back to 20 degrees in the computer. For some [still] unknown reason, the computer reverted back to 35 degrees on top end. I had to swap the MSD out for the Crane and use the external timing retard to get rid of the detonation.

Mike

 

I'm running 10# of intercooled boost on my Vortech. Custom tuning by Jeff Creech and no need to retard timing through my Crane box (dial set at zero). The car puts down 593 rwhp with no detonation issues.

 

Sure you can do it this way.. but what happens when you drive the car up at 5# or 7# or ATM? You have a fixed amount of timing..