Wanna maybe save $80? LS1 idler pulleys.
 

I've worked with bearings a lot as a tech in industry, and have pulled a few middle of the night repairs on equipment with squealing bearings by popping seals off, stuffing them with grease, reinstalling them till a replacement could be found, just to get a machine back in production.

The bearings on LS1 idler pulleys have a rep for going bad. So while I changed the oil today, I thought I'd pop one off and see if it had removable seals. Sure did. With ~ 21k miles on my Z, I expected the grease inside to still be in decent shape.

WRONG! The bearing was completely dry, the (no doubt) cheap grease the maker of the bearing used had completely cooked off, was just a dark powder here and there in the bearing. A few spots on the seal still had bits of some uncooked light yellow grease:
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h2...s/IdlerDry.jpg

The balls and races themselves were still in good shape, no damage yet. So I decided to stuff them with a quality high pressure wheel bearing grease. On one side, the bearing cage is closed, if the 1st seal I removed was this side, I would just pop off the opposite side to get to the cage side with openings that could be packed with grease:
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h2...dlerPacked.jpg

I used a fine tip flat blade screwdriver to carefully remove the seals, dig out as much as I could of the cooked grease and to pack the fresh grease into the bearings. After packing, I reinstalled the seals, making sure the inside and outside diameters fully seated in their grooves. Good to go, and only added about an hour to the oil change.

If your bearings aren't screaming yet, might be something to consider doing.

Of course you could just buy the 4 pulleys if/when they go bad, but that costs money... and can you be assured the replacement manufacturer used a top quality grease, or the cheapest stuff they could get by with? Like the company that supplied GM with the original bearings?


:::edited to add pics and update:::

Just did it on my 3rd LS1. Changed liftoff method. Now I hook it near inner part of the seal. Seal has a metal insert, grab it by there. Lift carefully, pops right up. You can't see metal ring when seal is still on, but you can feel it with screwdriver. Just make sure screwdriver isn't sharp so you don't damage seal. Mine was nice and dull from many years of use. Pic of liftoff:

http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h2...rs/liftoff.jpg

To reinstall, I apply pressure with my thumbs on opposite sides of the seal, press down, and it pops right in. Make sure metal ring of seal is towards bearings. Pic of grooves where seal pops into:

http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h2...rs/grooves.jpg

If a spot on seal doesn't slip in, use screwdriver to press it into groove. Pic:

http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h2.../reinstall.jpg

This is what it looks like when you take off bottom 3 pulleys. 2 had backing slingers, just left them in place so they wouldn't grow legs and wander away:

http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h2...rs/removed.jpg

Re: Wanna maybe save $80? LS1 idler pulleys.
 

good stuff

Re: Wanna maybe save $80? LS1 idler pulleys.
 

This is a good thread. I wish I knew about this sooner.


Thanks for the information!

Re: Wanna maybe save $80? LS1 idler pulleys.
 

+1.

Re: Wanna maybe save $80? LS1 idler pulleys.
 

Nice! Good info!

Re: Wanna maybe save $80? LS1 idler pulleys.
 

I did this with my ac pulleys. Silent now.

Re: Wanna maybe save $80? LS1 idler pulleys.
 

No visible damage doesn't mean it is not damaged.

Re: Wanna maybe save $80? LS1 idler pulleys.
 

Very resourceful. Thanks for it.

how did you popped them off?

Gonna stick this for a bit. Good info.

The seals? Used a small screwdriver, the type that clip on your pocket. The smaller the better. Just slide it in carefully at the outer diameter of the seal and pop it right up.

ok so how do you remove the pulleys? do you have to take the belt off?

You remove 2 belts, 2 idlers per belt. One of the bolts is a torx, don't remember the size bit to use. Just make sure the torx recess is clean so the bit doesn't round out.

I know I am on the wrong side of the tracks here but this works well on opti-spark bearings too.

Awsome idea. Some of the best ideas are the simplest!

Good info!
1st pic, It seems to me there is a lock ring, right? so the removable seals under that lock ring/clip!
did you try to remove the lock first or directly the seals?

just wondering how you did it w/o damaging the brass seals,
Figured, if that easy to remove that's mean there is a gap between the outer race and the seal so grease will leak out slowly!

Thanks

There is no retaining clip. The seals are plastic, reasonably flexible. So it's pretty easy to just hook them at the outer diameter and carefully pry them up. They seat on the inner diameter and outer diameter in small grooves. If you do deform them a bit with the screwdriver where you lift them up, you can just use the screwdriver to smooth out the plastic. I didn't have this issue.

Only problem I can forsee is if the bearings have been running dry for a while, this could cause high heat that can degrade the plastic to the point where it becomes brittle. But this plastic seemed pretty forgiving, unlike the nylon retaining clips used on some cars underhood wiring connectors. Those seem to break the instant you touch them.

Got it!!
planning to do the same :)

Thanks for the info!

Hi,
is it possible that you post a "how to" of getting the idler pulley out.
I am not a bad mechanic, but I don't want to damage anything.
So please post pics and a howto.
Best regards from Germany.
Hanno

NICE! Good post!

My A/C idler just started squeeling now. I've maybe put 50 miles on it since it started. I went ahead and removed the belt untill I can get another idler.

My question is.... is it too late for me to grease my idler and put it back in?

Just wondering trying to save a buck :) O'Reillys has this idler for $15 if not.

Thanks

Sorry, no "how to", but it's pretty easy to do, just remove the belts and unbolt the pulleys. There are metal slingers (washers) on the pulleys, just note their orientation for the reinstall.

Probably, but you lose nothing by opening it up for a look. If the balls don't looked trashed, go ahead and try greasing. If they are shot, at least it was good practice for the other 3. Don't overlook the possibility that the belt itself was the cause/contributed to the squeeling.

No. Optispark bearings are sealed in place with epoxy and you can't get to them.

This is a real cool idea that I will be trying real soon.

Re'

Update:

Greased the A/C idler and tensioner. I put in really sticky moly grease.

The noise is 100% GONE!

Thanks again for the cool info, please leave this a sticky for other people to see!

just did this and the noise is all gone!:thumb:

i need to do this....was it hard?

Can we have some pics of where it is located?

I guess it depends on your level of experience, but I thought it was cake.

Here is a pic I scammed off the net and added arrows pointing to the 4 idler pulleys. The red one has the torx bolt for clearance cause it's behind the main drive belt. The blue one has the metal outer, as far as I remember, process was basically the same on it too. Been a long time since I did it.
Attachment 49565

Hello,

in my other Thread we talking about, ill must make this mod too, because my belt was falling of (dont know why) and my engine was overheating. The first way (you all suggest it to me) is to grease the pulleys and change the belts to Goodyear Gaterback Belts.

Im wondering if it exist any pulley, that is be the same like the idler one (with a right and left boundary), so that the belt have a better guideway.
Your blue one are the same like mine and dont have a boundary. Its clean and maybe it prefer to fall of the belt. Can i change it with the same one like in the Idler or the Alternator? Yes it looks like a little big bigger, but maybe it works and give a little protection to the belt.

Next days ive made an order at summit-racing, so when i order that stuff to germany i must make sure, that i not forget important stuff.
So if anyone have a good idea, please tell me.

The shock is sitting so deep in my stomeck, when i drive on the autobahn and the temperatur gauge is jumping to red. Its not funny not do know if the engine is going bad and then in panic brake down in traffic to cut off the engine :irk: :no: :mad: :rant: :death:

Thanks verry mutch. I hope my english isnt to bad ;)

Don't worry about you're English, it may not be perfect, but it is easier to understand than some other people who post here :).

Check the alignment of you're pullies, as 4 out of 6 (crank, tensioner, power steering and altenator) pullies have lips (boundries). If everything was lined up right, the belt should stay on without any problem. I don't have much LS1 specific experience, but I do work on cars for a living (Nissan), so it's good to know that the Goodyear belts I bought were a good choice.

Hopfully my car will be running next month.

I did this maintenance a while back on my 2000 SS. While changing the oil on my 96 vette (LT1) I thought I'd look at idler pulleys ~ same deal. This works for LT1 the same as the LS1, so it may be worth sticky to the LT1 page?;)

I've done some looking into this as I just got my first LS1 car, and it had the same cooked grease issues.

The real crux of the matter is the bearings are rated for 12,000rpm, but with the pulley sizes the A/C idlers are at that speed when the engine is at 4,000rpm and the main idler is maxed at 4800rpm. :| No wonder these cook their grease in a hurry when you are having fun.

I'm am currently working with Shon Herron to come up with something to solve this problem once and for all though.

Are any of the bolts reverse thread?

Re: Wanna maybe save $80? LS1 idler pulleys.
 

to reply to pulley rehab use spray on brake clean and spray into the bearing @ a45degree angle so the propellant spins the bearing fast clean up then re pack and be on your way this is my first post ever on a computer so ive entered the 21st century ! hope this is of use to someone long live the Z28!!!!

Re: Wanna maybe save $80? LS1 idler pulleys.
 

just my two cents, you can use a knife to pry off the seal. Worked great for me, and i think its easier than a screwdriver.

Re: Wanna maybe save $80? LS1 idler pulleys.
 

Did this on my 3rd LS1. Updated 1st post with more pics and info.