Mystery LS1
 

hello I am new here
I have a 2002 35th aneversery addition Camaro # 138 destined for Canada, it was built in n6vember of 2001.
the mystery comes from the fact it is a hybred of various enginss
it has the 345 hp kit.
at 3/8 gas it will run to 6200 like a lS6, I am not going to knock the ls1 but NO engine I know of will hit 50 mph in under 1n around 120 feet. it is comparable at 3/8 thoutlel to a v10 powered bmw.
the history goes likes this I ordered it from Winnipeg dealership who got it dropped shipped from Edmonton mortors where it was orginal ordered.
both SLP and gm go way out to deny this car.
yes the heads are 241
has any one any ideas?
thanks

re: Mystery LS1
 

Hi!

Your post isn't very clear, but I think you're saying that you give the car less than half throttle (3/8) and it goes like you floored it? And maybe even faster than you think a stock LS1 Camaro should? Have you ever taken it to a track to get a real timeslip? Measured the power on a dyno? Used one of those accelerometer apps on your smartphone to measure a rough 0-60 time? Some sort of real data would be helpful.

All that at half throttle -- what does it do when you floor it?

Re: Mystery LS1
 

I will try to put it on a dyno

Re: Mystery LS1
 

the engine has high rpm fuel starvation
by the way, where is the fuel filter on that car.
it appears the ecm is locked

Re: Mystery LS1
 

PLEASE USE THIS THREAD. If you delete it again, we will not reopen this one. PLEASE.

The other thread CLEARLY said it was going to be closed.

Re: Mystery LS1
 

Now to deal with the topic.... why do you say "it is a hybred (hybrid) of various enginss (engines)". The SS package upgrade was 335 or 345 HP/350 lb-ft torque, as you indicate yours is. The LS1 had 241 heads, the LS6 had 243 heads. What components of your engine came from some other engine?

Re: Mystery LS1
 

How do you know there is high RPM fuel starvation? How do you know the ECM is "locked", and what does that mean?

The fuel filter is just in front of the rear left wheel, inside the subframe. There are good pictures and instructions here: Fuel Filter Replacement

Re: Mystery LS1
 

the long block I believe is ls6 heads 241 . cam is different. the ECM is locked. I did live streaming of the ECM an the reading was not adapting to fuel table. eg had a bunch of bad gas and when reading the ecm live amoust many things it said it was 23% lean but did not correct the problem. It should of richened the mixeter to meet the fuel table. at -23% the nitros oxide would be through roof. under full power it fall on it face and quients down.

Re: Mystery LS1
 

THANKS for the info on the fuel filter

Re: Mystery LS1
 

In 2002, some LS1's in the F-Body got the LS6 block, which just has larger windows in the webs between the cylinders. Some of them also got the LS6 intake manifold. GM was cleaning out the F-Body inventory and using random Corvette parts, since the Camaro was soon to be discontinued. Everything I have seen indicates the 241 heads were used on the LS1. LS6 heads are 243.

Most scanners report an average LTFT as a %. -23% would indicate the PCM is pulling out 23% of the fuel to correct a rich condition. You would have to look at the LTFT's for the individual "Cells" to see the LTFT (left and right) for that Cell.

-23% doesn't mean its running lean. If it was, why worry about NOx.... you would have massive detonation if the PCM was NOT correcting for running 23% lean = 18.1:1 A/F ratio. It means it would be running rich if the LTFT's weren't pulling out 23% of the fuel. I am surprised to see a -23%. But that could be peculiar to the LS1. In the LT1, the max subtraction of fuel is -15% (108/128 - 1 = -0.156)

How do you know "the cam is different"?

And just curious.... you've owned this car for 15 years, and only put 6,500 kM on it. And while you feel it has some sort of exceptional power output just at part throttle, you never ran a 0-60? Never took it to the track? Never ran it against a similar LS1/SS model?

Are you familiar with the modifications made by independent shops like GMMG/Berger? Could it possibly one of their builds?

Re: Mystery LS1
 

I has the LS6 intake, I a friend find #s
no proof but the block is as I said is most likey LS6
the Engine shakes at idle
and YES I had a firebird 2002 owner look at the engine and listen and said they are not the same.
he had headers and matching exhaust BTW , and mine was stock.
his you could balance a coin on . that is only a dream on mine.
YES I agree it could be a berger or gmmp but that why I am here both gm and slp deny it
and thanks for your info, it is nice to chat with someone who know something.
and 1 other thing how many people knew about that the car date of birth was november1 2001.but the black wing and the 345 hp kit was available in November 1.2001

Re: Mystery LS1
 

Give me the casting number on the block and I'll tell you if it's an LS6. I'll repeat again.... the LS6 block was used randomly in 2001-2002 to build LS1 engines. There is no magic about an LS6 block. The web vents reduce crankcase pressure at very high RPM.

GMMG (who did the Berger, Tom Henry, Earnhardt Intimidator, etc conversions) has nothing to do with GM or SLP. You would have to check w/ GMMG in Marietta, GA.

http://gmmginc.net/media/Press/Camar...s_Sept2006.pdf

Re: Mystery LS1
 

I tried to find the casting # where is it please.
bare with me I am 58 years old and this is the first forum I ever been on, so I am learning as I go on.
I do not know how to word this , my experience has taught me that a engine that likes to run will have a bark to it, in fact slowly rev it up in newtral will show a lot of things,
1 torque peak . it will have a loud bark to the exaust when you hit the peak and as u go faster the bark softens as the torque drop,
this will show how well the combination works.
mine is loudest at 4800-5000.
question would not larger injectors cause the ecm pull fuel back?
a friend said I had LS6 injectors, he had just put the larger injectors in his car so I believe him

Re: Mystery LS1
 

I think you'll find the casting number below the rear of the driver's side head.

If you can't see it from above, you might have to view it from under the car.

Re: Mystery LS1
 

thanks
yes 26 mpg is very good

Re: Mystery LS1
 

I got this # from the back left head 1305mk579365 does any one have info on this 3

Re: Mystery LS1
 

If you installed larger injectors (the LS1 and LS6 both used the same size 28.6 #/HR @ 58 PSI injectors 2001-2002), the only way the PCM would have to pull out fuel would be if you didn't have the PCM programmed with the larger injector size. That would be a serious mistake. Larger injectors do nothing, unless the amount of air entering the engine is increased - better heads/intake, more aggressive camshaft, etc. Then the engine needs more fuel.


You indicate:

Of course they are not the same. A 2002 Firebird Formula or Trans Am would have the "base" 310 HP LS1. You have the 345 HP SLP package. On the other hand, if the Firebird was a Firehawk, it would have the same SLP package as the SS.


What exactly does that mean? Does SLP acknowledge that your vehicle is in fact 2002 SS conversion #138, based on the serial number you would have to give them? Are they denying that they ever modified the vehicle in any way other than the standard 345 HP package? Whom did you contact at GM to attempt to verify the vehicle is something other than a 345 HP SLP SS conversion?

Since Roush bought SLP in 2013, finding out about specific vehicles has become a bit more difficult. But the founder of SLP, Ed Hamburger, is still available. He now operates HSV (Hamburger Specialty Vehicles). You might want to contact him there, and see if he can shed some light on your search. There were always rumors that the LS6 would be installed on some of the final year 2002 F-Bodies, but all the references I have seen indicate it never happened.

About Us | Hamburger's Specialty Vehicles

A decent reference on the last years of the LS1 in the F-Body, with regard to part #'s, injector sizes, performance mods:

Re: Mystery LS1
 

Part #'s:

LS1 - 12564241

LS6 - 12564243

Look at the exhaust manifold side of the head. On top of the rectangular edge that forms the face of the exhaust ports, there should be a three-digit number cast. Either 241, 243 or 799. Go to this eBay listing, and hover the mouse over the photo of the heads. When the photo enlarges, move the mouse down to the bottom of the picture, the head on the right. You will see the "241" location. Appears to be right above a number with the same number of digits you quoted, but not the same number. That may be a production date code.


LS1 LS2 LS6 241 CYLINDER HEADS GM OEM CORVETTE TRANS AM CAMARO GTO | eBay

Re: Mystery LS1
 

Correct about the block, but not the intake.

All 2001 and up LS1s, regardless of the car they went in, got the LS6 intake. It was paired with a slightly milder cam, and a +5hp rating relative to the 2000 model. (305->310 for Z28s and Trans Ams; 320->325 for SSes and WS6s, 345->350 for C5s).

It also makes the engine a bit more tractable in the very low RPM range. For example, my 2002 is perfectly happy to loaf along at 40mph in 6th gear, running just 800rpm. The earlier cars will lug if you try that.

Re: Mystery LS1
 

thanks for all your help all of you
I could not do that stunt 800 rpm in 6th gear at 40 mph it would protest loudly.
any thing below a 1000 it would complain.
my friend who had a transam had headers 3 inch exhaust and a forched air induction, that was not one I seem before fed diretly to a huge 12x14 filter.


I won,t bother asking questions any more for a while
BTW the fuel filter change definetly help the high rpm running.

Re: Mystery LS1
 

there is a new mystery as it appears not to have no rev limit,
in low gear when having fun the car got away from me, it spun up to 6400 rpm before I caught it . does not the ls1 have a rpm shut off of 6200 rpm?
and at 6400 it was charging for more it did not even try to stop reving

Re: Mystery LS1
 

does the f bodies have a factory drive shaft hoop installed at the factory?

Re: Mystery LS1
 

Not sure what you mean by a hoop, and where it is located on the drive shaft, but on my 95 Z I had a Propeller Shaft Slip Yoke, see the Photo. I had it removed, and the drive shaft rebalanced along with new U Joints when I replaced the Transmission Ouput Seal and the Rear End Pinion Seal.

Re: Mystery LS1
 

I think he means driveshaft safety "loop"......

https://www.bmrsuspension.com/?page=...3CB6AA946E7E2F

Never installed at the factory. There is just a sheet metal brace across the bottom of the driveshaft tunnel, where the red cross-support is in the photo below.

Re: Mystery LS1
 

Thanks Injuneer, I wasn't aware of this.

Re: Mystery LS1
 

I have yet dynoed the car [ plans for future ]. I have determine the harmonic balancer is aluminum. the# at the back of the block on driver side is 1305MK579365.
those last 6# have no common relation to the last # on the vin, and any thing else is subjective, yes I had a try at 0-30 but was tire limited.
is it really true hood , tailgate,doors , roll bar and front fenders, are made of aluminum or fiberglass.
thanks

Re: Mystery LS1
 

On an SS, everything but the rear fenders is composite plastic. A Z28 would have a steel hood.

Re: Mystery LS1
 

does any one know what head this is 12561584
there is symbole of { I } under that #
and also { gm }
and also { dp }
and a large 7

Re: Mystery LS1
 

GM parts houses show that as a power steering mounting bracket, not a head.

https://www.gmpartsdirect.com/oem-pa...Mjc1NSZyPTI%3D

Re: Mystery LS1
 

sorry for being dumb, I should of look closer.

Re: Mystery LS1
 

i have finaly fiqured out my ls1, it appears that between GM and SLP some how the 500 hp ls1 was swaped for the original engine,
the reason say this is as follows, aluinum ballancer , 6.5 quart oil change , piston slap at 1400 rpm.
and finaly it can take on and beat a 560 rwhp bmw.
and finaly the vin# is deferent

Re: Mystery LS1
 

You might want to post the new discovery on ls1tech.com if you haven’t already. I'm sure they will have a lot of questions and comments.

Re: Mystery LS1
 

You, sir, have the patience of a saint. I can't figure out if this guy is a troll or an escaped patient from a mental health facility.

As far as Mystic27 goes, you need to post some pics or videos. You're making some pretty wild claims here. I believe you said you bought the car new... Wouldn't the window sticker shed some light on your questions? How much did you pay for the car? Because if it was sold with a 500hp engine as you claim, it would have cost around $20k USD more than a regular SS. So many questions that I highly doubt will ever be answered.

Re: Mystery LS1
 

And simply contacting David Hamberger probably would have answered the question, but he never bothered to do that. And, if he bought it new, why did he wait 20 years to try and figure it out.

None of this makes any sense to me, but thought it would be a good idea to play along to see where it went. Wait 'til he posts any part of this on ls1tech.... they'll eat him alive :D

Re: Mystery LS1
 

That was an interesting read, or at least the parts I was able to read.

Re: Mystery LS1
 

The OP should post some pics of the mystery car.

Re: Mystery LS1
 

I agree. I’ve been subscribed to this thread for months. It says on the OP’s page that he hasn’t gotten back on since the day of his last post though....

Re: Mystery LS1
 

IP is from Winnipeg, Canada, where he claims he bought the car new.

Re: Mystery LS1
 

I am a car hack, and this hurt my head.