GTO Judge
11-21-2002, 07:47 PM
#16
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Location: Coppell, Texas
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I have to agree that this kinda negates the purpose of having GMPD around. I'm sure that when SLP comes out with their GTO package it will have the HSV boys in Oz laughing. But then again who knows what SLP might do. They did have an awesome real performance option in the 92 Firehawk. Maybe they can do something a little more involved like they did on that car with the new GTO. Hood, floor mat, badges, and key fob aren't going to cut it.
11-21-2002, 08:11 PM
#18
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Maybe they (GMPD) should revive the Bobcat name. from the glory days of Ace Wilson's Royal Pontiac.
Don't know who owns the rights to the name? but it is relavent.
They could just call it the Bobcat GTO
Don't know who owns the rights to the name? but it is relavent.
They could just call it the Bobcat GTO
11-21-2002, 09:55 PM
#20
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Re: Re: I'd guess....
Originally posted by jrp4uc
And hopefully Pontiac can come up with something better than this "XP" moniker--GTO GXP or GTOXP doesn't sound good to me. Sounds like a Microsoft product
, not a classic muscle car reborn. There have got to be some hardcore GTO enthusiasts on here that can come up with something more relevant than XP (or Judge if that is infact going to SLP) to signify a special, high performance model...something with the same type of flare as Z06.
And hopefully Pontiac can come up with something better than this "XP" moniker--GTO GXP or GTOXP doesn't sound good to me. Sounds like a Microsoft product
, not a classic muscle car reborn. There have got to be some hardcore GTO enthusiasts on here that can come up with something more relevant than XP (or Judge if that is infact going to SLP) to signify a special, high performance model...something with the same type of flare as Z06.
Anything more is just superfluous.
11-21-2002, 11:56 PM
#21
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Location: New England
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Maybee SLP will just offer a "judge" package for any GTO's that come here..kinda like the Grand Prix performance package..it would save GM some $$$ if SLP designed a JUDGE package and who knows it might be worth 20 +HP??? all SLP or LS1 bolt on mods..
who knows..
who knows..
11-22-2002, 12:26 AM
#22
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Location: Chicagoland IL
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Does anyone really think that an SLP Judge will make the 18,000 GTOs per year more desirable? Because I don't.
First lets have a quick Judge history lesson.
The Judge was a LOW END GTO, designed to compete price wise with the lower cost and popular Road Runner. It was originally to be called T37...but DeLorean decided to tap into the prevalent lingo from the Laugh In Show.
Judge comes from the term....."Here come da Judge" .
The Judge DID NOT have any special performance options. Yes Virginia.....it was no faster than any other GOAT...it was just decontented and supposed to be cheaper than a regular GTO. Most people who bought them however, optioned them heavily, so there really wasn't much of a price advantage.
Do we really need SLP to pimp out a GTO....isn't just having a GTO enough.
First lets have a quick Judge history lesson.
The Judge was a LOW END GTO, designed to compete price wise with the lower cost and popular Road Runner. It was originally to be called T37...but DeLorean decided to tap into the prevalent lingo from the Laugh In Show.
Judge comes from the term....."Here come da Judge" .
The Judge DID NOT have any special performance options. Yes Virginia.....it was no faster than any other GOAT...it was just decontented and supposed to be cheaper than a regular GTO. Most people who bought them however, optioned them heavily, so there really wasn't much of a price advantage.
Do we really need SLP to pimp out a GTO....isn't just having a GTO enough.
11-22-2002, 09:56 AM
#24
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So...if we want a real GTO Judge, one that is true to it's heritage....how about this.
Cloth seats,(maybe even bench seat), steel wheels (with NO trim rings of course), rubber floor mats, etc., etc.
Sticker price= $24,000.
Cloth seats,(maybe even bench seat), steel wheels (with NO trim rings of course), rubber floor mats, etc., etc.
Sticker price= $24,000.
Last edited by Z284ever; 11-22-2002 at 10:03 AM.
11-22-2002, 11:21 AM
#25
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Join Date: Feb 2000
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Seeing how the car will debue on the big screen in the second part of that movie "XXX", maybe they will call it the GTO XXX?
I dunno, sounds corny, but I would like that better then GTOXP, GTXP, or whatever.
BTW, the original Judge did come with a pretty funky spoiler, wasn't that a special performance option?
I dunno, sounds corny, but I would like that better then GTOXP, GTXP, or whatever.
BTW, the original Judge did come with a pretty funky spoiler, wasn't that a special performance option?
11-22-2002, 06:19 PM
#27
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Join Date: May 2001
Location: New Haven, CT
Posts: 1,042
Originally posted by Chuck!
They're only bringing 18,000 of them over. Just let GMPD put LS6 heads on them all, say 375 hp, and call it a day. I agree with jrp4uc, let the damn division get some recoginition and let SLP play with damn Ford trucks.
They're only bringing 18,000 of them over. Just let GMPD put LS6 heads on them all, say 375 hp, and call it a day. I agree with jrp4uc, let the damn division get some recoginition and let SLP play with damn Ford trucks.
The GTO will be like the Z28, the Judge will be like the SS: mostly looks, a few suspension upgrades NO BIG POWER CHANGE. The Judge will devalue the GTO, like the SS did the Z28 as WERM pointed out in an older thread.
11-24-2002, 04:28 PM
#28
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Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: The Golden State
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Originally posted by Z284ever
Does anyone really think that an SLP Judge will make the 18,000 GTOs per year more desirable? Because I don't.
First lets have a quick Judge history lesson.
The Judge was a LOW END GTO, designed to compete price wise with the lower cost and popular Road Runner. It was originally to be called T37...but DeLorean decided to tap into the prevalent lingo from the Laugh In Show.
Judge comes from the term....."Here come da Judge" .
The Judge DID NOT have any special performance options. Yes Virginia.....it was no faster than any other GOAT...it was just decontented and supposed to be cheaper than a regular GTO. Most people who bought them however, optioned them heavily, so there really wasn't much of a price advantage.
Do we really need SLP to pimp out a GTO....isn't just having a GTO enough.
Does anyone really think that an SLP Judge will make the 18,000 GTOs per year more desirable? Because I don't.
First lets have a quick Judge history lesson.
The Judge was a LOW END GTO, designed to compete price wise with the lower cost and popular Road Runner. It was originally to be called T37...but DeLorean decided to tap into the prevalent lingo from the Laugh In Show.
Judge comes from the term....."Here come da Judge" .
The Judge DID NOT have any special performance options. Yes Virginia.....it was no faster than any other GOAT...it was just decontented and supposed to be cheaper than a regular GTO. Most people who bought them however, optioned them heavily, so there really wasn't much of a price advantage.
Do we really need SLP to pimp out a GTO....isn't just having a GTO enough.
You also point out a major flaw in John Delorean & his Pontiac guys. They not only had a uncontrollable tendancy of stuffing racing engines in "production line" cars to be evaluated by the press, they also had no quams about stealing names (and expressions) without paying for them.
A few weeks ago I came across an article about how he tried to steal the Trans Am name for a performance Firebird, but the series reps weren't going to go for that, and forced him to pay $5 for every car sold with that name (as it's done for over 30 years
). Other names stolen: LeMans, Grand Prix, GTO, and one expression...... the Judge! At least Plymouth paid for the rights to "Road Runner".They may have been a pretty unsavory bunch running Pontiac, but no one else would have managed to con a GTO out of GM back then either.
11-24-2002, 11:46 PM
#29
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Location: Chicagoland IL
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Originally posted by guionM
You have that history down pat!
You also point out a major flaw in John Delorean & his Pontiac guys. They not only had a uncontrollable tendancy of stuffing racing engines in "production line" cars to be evaluated by the press, they also had no quams about stealing names (and expressions) without paying for them.
A few weeks ago I came across an article about how he tried to steal the Trans Am name for a performance Firebird, but the series reps weren't going to go for that, and forced him to pay $5 for every car sold with that name (as it's done for over 30 years ). Other names stolen: LeMans, Grand Prix, GTO, and one expression...... the Judge! At least Plymouth paid for the rights to "Road Runner".
They may have been a pretty unsavory bunch running Pontiac, but no one else would have managed to con a GTO out of GM back then either.
You have that history down pat!
You also point out a major flaw in John Delorean & his Pontiac guys. They not only had a uncontrollable tendancy of stuffing racing engines in "production line" cars to be evaluated by the press, they also had no quams about stealing names (and expressions) without paying for them.
A few weeks ago I came across an article about how he tried to steal the Trans Am name for a performance Firebird, but the series reps weren't going to go for that, and forced him to pay $5 for every car sold with that name (as it's done for over 30 years
). Other names stolen: LeMans, Grand Prix, GTO, and one expression...... the Judge! At least Plymouth paid for the rights to "Road Runner".They may have been a pretty unsavory bunch running Pontiac, but no one else would have managed to con a GTO out of GM back then either.
We could use a guy like him!
11-25-2002, 07:21 AM
#30
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Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: Pewee Valley, KY
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guionM, just thought I would ad this the Trans Am was almost changed into T/A in 82. There were a few pics of a preproduction car from back in 80 or 81 that show the T/A decals on the front quarter. I think that pontiac was trying to get out of paying those royalties. but instead they went with the recognized name.
but instead they went with the recognized name.