HuJass

Just go to ANY comments section of ANY online article about the auto industry and you will see for yourself who these people are.

JasonD

Let's not start this, guys...

5thgen69camaro

Jason, this is your board, however this is an entire political thread so Guy can preach his ideology as to how he believes it affected the auto industry and what he speculates the fall out would be if the Government had not stepped in.

Im a GM fan but I am staunchly against Federal government intervention. I dont know how to respond to political threads without explaining why I think it is a bad thing.

5thgen69camaro

Thats not what I said at all. I I said his actions, meaning certain actions, not all, referring to case in point are certainly in my opinion fit. I do not understand why you can not differentiate actions based on ideology and beliefs which can change at any given time from party or people. Even your own.


Unless its your ideology full of your assumptions about where unemployment would be if any other ideology based route had been taken other than the one you advocate. Call, label make or name call a spade a spade.

Z28x

Some of you guys should go look up the definitions for socialism and corporatism in your spare time. The -ism get thrown around a lot on many sites while discussing this topic, and they are usually used incorrectly.

Bottom line to me, in 10 or 20 years from now we will look back and be glad we saved this American industry and we will be a wealthier country for doing it.

JasonD

I understand completely, but what I am saying here, plain and simple...This is nothing new, I am just setting the reminder. There is no more or no less to it, and I don't think this is unfair or out of line. We are all adults here, and all are expected to understand this in full and remain respectful of the differences in stances and opinions. If everyone wants dialog to remain open and flowing, it has to adhere to the above. I am asking everyone to construct their posts accordingly and if you have to hold your tongue, then please do so it doesn't get ruined for everyone. I would rather it be a group effort than to have to tighten the post content requirements in general.

HAZ-Matt

It's amazing what a little dose of education might do. Even if it is self education.

guionM

You said it!

I'm not even going to debate with this guy because it's a complete waste of time.

General Motors just posted a 7.6 Billion dollar profit yet didn't have enough money to keep their doors open an additional week when George Bush diverted TARP funds to keep GM open. Chrysler also earned their first profit in many years. Both are highly competitive car companies... that wasn't the case at the start of 2009.

These companies are now still paying a huge taxes to the states they operate (which pay for roads, bridges, schools, police, prisons, and funds state colleges) in instead of creating revenue craters including not just the revenue from car companies they depend on, but also additional money states would lose paying out unemployment compensation to people who should be instead working and paying taxes.

All the companies that depend on US automakers either directly or indirectly are still in business instead of being boarded up and throwing additional people out of work and making state and federal shortages worse (which would have made deficits and unemployment worse), which would have fallen extremely hard to those of us still working.

So.... if there is someone who still wants to use "-isms", and call something George Bush did socialism (believe me, I'm still laughing pretty hard at that one!! ), and would have rather seen the collapse iof the US economy, the US car industry, and most of it's manufacturing base (let alone almost double the unemployment rate) because of a personal belief, there's no point in talking to them.

GM and Chrysler are doing extremely well today, and I'd be hard pressed to name any fan of American automobiles that isn't tickled pink that the industry not only survived, but are taking on (and topping) imports in quality and sales, no matter whos to thank.

If there's someone who wants to still turn it into a political issue and it throw a lot of "-ism" labels where neither apply then all you can do is just go on with your business (though I can't help thinking of Dustin Hoffman's Rainman character's obsession with Judge Wolpner in all this)

At least in Carl Rove's case, he clever enough to get paid to come up with those views.

OK, I'm done with this subject.

indieaz

I laughed...I cried...I read comments to an online news article.

5thgen69camaro

Seriously? High taxes for, state colleges, roads, bridges, schools, police, prisons, and funds state colleges supposidly and you accuse me of turning this into a political issue?

Current unemployment is pretty bad right now. Not exactly something Id be bragging about. Chrysler isnt even American anymore. Its Fiat. So now youre suggesting bailouts of foreign companies are a good thing as well. GM has the 2nd best selling truck. Suggesting another car company wouldnt buy assets like that, and continue to produce them is crazy. The Fed has no business or authority being involved. They over steped thier bounds.

youre done? I doubt it. Half your posts on this board are political...

guionM

Whatever you say dude.

I suppose I have to draw in crayons what I mean insofar as saying I'm done with this subject.

I posted the subject and the link. I added facts to drive the point.

There were no lables, "-isms", and if anything, it was a testiment of certain people stepping up to the plate and showing leadership... something that is extremely rare nowadays.

You came in and intervened espousing a move that would have been not only a serious lack of leadership and decisionmaking, but would have resulted a serious destruction of an industry and hundreds of thousands of lives and by effect, adversly effected the country.

This wasn't a political issue, and therefore the thread wasn't closed.

You popped in, and as usual, you turned it into one.

Since you have a history of this, and you tend to shoot yourself in the foot, I stated I was done with the subject (meaning debating you and throwing this entire thread off subject into a political argument which it wasn't), and rish getting the thread closed (which you seem hellbent in doing).

Therefore, when I say I'm done... because you can't talk to people who are fixated on idealogy (regardless as to the consequences) over showing leadership... that means I'm done debating any issue with you.

Things are good in the US auto industry today.

If you want to keep saying we should have stood aside and let things go to hell, then that's all on you.

You do enough to yourself. You don't need me.

5thgen69camaro

Do me a favor and tell us how the US bail out of foreign Italian owned Fiat Chrysler is good thing for domestic US Auto industy. There has been mentioned in the past about Toyota not being American because it is foreign owned and only had factories here as compared to GM. Chrysler now fits that same scenario and has been bailed out.

Feel free to use said crayons, lick the screen or whatever method youre most comfortable communicating with.

Anomaly

That all the domestic parts manufacturers, suppliers, and workers still have jobs?

Fwiw, Fiat only owns something like 58%, it's not like it's 100% fiat owned.

TOO Z MAXX

And you can add a lot of speculation to your posts. The fact is you, me or anyone else in this world has no idea what would have happened if the gov didnt bail out GM. You paint a picture of a worse case scenerio. I dont think it would have been half as bad as you say. Now if they didnt bail out the banks and the automotive companies then we would have had a real disaster are our hands.
I for one am glad GM is still here. Chysler too. After a week in Maui with a rented 5th gen convertable SS, I see why GM is doing so well.

jg95z28

Seriously. Most people with an education above the 6th grade understand that had the gov't not bailed out GM we would be in a full blown depression today. It's pretty obvious when you do the math and calculate all the businesses and jobs related to GM (both directly and indirectly) that would no longer exist had GM closed it's doors. And yes... that was the very next step had there been no bailout.