scottpdx2010

hi, and thanks in advance for any advice. this is my 2nd post, the first one was in F-body tech. probably the wrong place for this, so I am relisting here. I have a 1996 firebird with T-tops. I want to replace headliner and the sun visors. the color is graphite. I got samples from both Stock Interiors and Classic Industries. they are ok but not great like OEM. they both use a ABS base with the material glued to it. have you guys used these abs headliners, and do they fit and look nice? I would like to keep it looking as stock as reasonable. so have you guys bought from these companies, or someone else you would refer me to?

Injuneer

Probably doesn't matter where you post.... not a lot of people left on this site. Maybe a 1/2-dozen die hard LT1 owners trying to keep the site going, helping mostly newer owners who have issues with their 20+ year old vehicles. "General......" gets more traffic than most of the specialty forums, and we've loosened up what we allow to be posted there. The "Appearance" crew seems to have departed.

I'll be interested in seeing any responses you get. My t-top headliner is sagging, but replacement is going to be a challenge, given the roll bar that is right up against the roof.

peterpar

Have you contacted a local auto trim shop? I've had several headliners recovered with new material after stripping the original base. I think it cost me $80-$100 which included removal and installation.

scottpdx2010

that sounds real reasonable. I will look into that. thanks peterpar. if I can find a professional around here to do it all for $100 I will be all over that.

scottpdx2010

well I checked a few local guys in Portland, but I was quoted $500 - $800 dollars, to much for me to go ahead that way, so again I ask f anyone has used Classic Industries, or Stock interiors. also liked the product for a new headliner on a Fi
rebird t-top or any of their stuff?

scottpdx2010

tank you all for your information. I ended up ordering a pre covered one from Acme through Rock Auto. it looks GREAT and with the new sun visors I got from Firebird Central. my car looks much better on the inside. the headliner ended costing under $150 delivered to my door. decent product, installed pretty easy, just had to do a few adjustments when installing.

BTC

This might not be the best spot, but this seems to be the most recent headliner thread.

I have a new headliner I may try to put in over Christmas. It's an OEM GM headliner and may have been one of if not the last available when I purchased it. It's been in the box for a few years. It's supposed to be graphite, but just looking at it in the box I'm not sure that it isn't gray. Regardless, it will probably be installed anyway.

How difficult is a headliner install? I've read several posts indicating that it's pretty straight forward. My only fear is breaking the headliner because it seems like that might be easy to do.

Hawks 3rd Gen also has headliners for anyone that might be looking. I've read some good things.

Shop by Category - Camaro - 93-97 Camaro - Interior - Headliners & Accessories - Hawks Third Generation

scottpdx2010

well i did install the abs headliner. it went in pretty easy. if you found a oem headliner i would warn you not to bend it as you put it in. i broke my old oem headliner in a few pieces taking it out. the abs one was easy to bend to get into place. i wish i had more to give you, but straight in from behind should go best. also get a friend to help hold it. just so you do not bend it. i put it in alone through the door, but again bending it posed no problem on the abs. good luck with probably the last new oem headliner around.

BTC

I appreciate the input.

I bought the headliner several years ago and had planned on having it installed by someone other than myself. I've read several things indicating it's not as difficult as it might seem, so I may give it a shot. I'll definitely have some help.

My car is a hard top. I have no idea whether that might make it easier, more difficult, make no difference etc. I get the impression that the liner for T-tops might be a more difficult install.

I briefly perused the factory service manual this past weekend, but it didn't seem crystal clear in terms of the number fasteners, their location etc. I may simply need to take a closer look as I didn't read everything carefully. The one thing that does seem clear is that the headliner has to go in/out through the rear hatch.

Potential damage is certainly my biggest concern as the headliners seem like they could be a bit flimsy. I would like to preserver the headliner in the car, if possible, and perhaps have it re-covered for future use. Depending upon the condition of the backing, particularly after removal, that may not end up being an option.

scottpdx2010

yes, i did not see all your information before my first advice. mine is a 1996 t-top. it went pretty good, like i said. before i started i first bought the retainer on e-bay (it was the wrong part, the head was to small and wrong color . i looked deeper and found the graphite oem part. it is 10278954 i put that and gm in e-bay search, there is a guy selling them for 9.95 each. little steep, but i wanted the correct part. the t-top took 1. it looks like the hard top takes 2. other than that, i was able to use all the old retainers. except for one more retainer under the light it was just a cheep push in again, it did not need to match. any auto store would have one that should work.

good luck

BTC

Thanks again.

Looking at GM Parts Direct, the only part number I see for retainer clips that appear to be associated with the headliner is 10121502. They show the part number you listed as discontinued. Any idea if that is a T-Top specific part? The factory service manual doesn't really seem to clarify things either.

I'm going to speak with Jason Cromer @ Sam Taylor Buick. He may have access to more detailed schematics and might be able to identify parts. $9.95 for those clips seems pretty steep, but I guess it's supply and demand. I guess re-using the existing parts is also an option if you can remove them without damaging them.

scottpdx2010

as far as using the old clip, i doubt it. taking mine out, i wrecked it totally. i got my information from gmpartspro.net . they have nice oem parts explosions in there. under body, then interior trim roof. they show i holder for the t-top and 2 holders for hard top. the number you gave 10121502 that is a smaller head on it. i think that was the one i first bought and was wrong. but if i remember right i used it under the light, or i did not use it at all. pretty sure you want 2 of the 10278954.

let me know what happens- scott

BTC

Thank you Scott, again.

Yeah, I've looked at several of those GM sites. It looks like there may be several front end sites utilizing the same back end services, all with a little bit different pricing. The site I generally use as a reference is GMPartsDirect.

I spoke to Jason Cromer today, who I've bought a lot of stuff from over the last 10 years. I ordered ten of 10121502, which appear to be used all over the car, and probably on numerous GM cars. I also ordered two different kinds of tape that he pulled up for headliners.

I think Jason may have only had access to the same schematics used on all of those GM sites. I gave him the part number for the retainer you bought off eBay. It's obviously been discontinued, and whatever he was looking at seemed to indicate it was used on the later model cars with T-tops.

Due to the age of these cars, some of this type of info has probably been lost and/or poorly maintained over the years, particularly as more and more parts are discontinued. The headliner info certainly seems to be a bit incomplete/lacking, confusing etc.

When you say you see two holders for the hard top, I actually don't see that, and I looked at several different year models. Maybe we are just interpreting the pics or info differently. I only see the one retainer part number listed for a 1994, which is 10121502. Some of the later years don't even seem to list a retainer part number at all for the hard top.

I wish I could just go out and look at my car, but I can't because I live in Michigan and the car is in Ky. I should have taken a close look at the headliner when I was home for Thanksgiving. Maybe I can get my brother to run out to his shop and take a look.

Where exactly on the headliner did you remove and use those larger retainers that you bought off eBay? Do you remember? I'm assuming the retainers you removed were just like the 10278954 retainers you bought off eBay? I may buy some just in case I need them.

scottpdx2010

for me there was one retainer right between the T-tops. between the seats. what it looked like on yours was one retainer right above each seat. i hope the ones you bought will work for your car. it sounds like your friend Jason is a good resource. sad you are a distance from your car, but with family i think you will get it.


and yes, that was the one i bought and like i said for a 1996 it was perfect

good luck.

BTC

I appreciate the discussion. I hope you don't think I'm grilling you, or doubting you or anything like that. I'm just kind of thinking out loud. If someone responds with relevant info, that's great. There isn't much discussion taking place regarding the older f-body's anymore.

I'm not sure if you are familiar with shoebox and his fbody site, shbox.com, but Jason is one, and now perhaps the only, point of contact referenced on his site for getting GM parts at reasonable prices. I've bought lots of stuff from him over the years and I'm sure it's saved me quite a bit of money.

In terms of some of the stuff I ordered yesterday, like the tape & retainers, I have no idea if they are the correct parts, if I'll ever use them etc. They weren't high dollar items so I figured better to have them and not need them etc. I'm kinda feeling the same way about getting the retainer you used.

I do have one more thought regarding the retainers. It's possible that due to the design of the t-top headliner that a retainer might be necessary in the center that isn't required for a hard top. I'll certainly follow up whenever I do the install, assuming I ever actually do the install. All I can say is the headliner currently in the car needs to come out. It's pretty much hanging down everywhere, the fabric is coming off etc., and interferes with visibility.

I'm already wondering what I might do if the headliner I purchased in fact turns out to be a color other than graphite, which I believe is a distinct possibility. It wouldn't be the first time I bought something that wasn't what it was supposed to be. I got a passenger side fog lamp once that was boxed incorrectly and turned out to be for the driver's side. The headliner is probably going in regardless, but I would like it to match. I've never used a fabric paint and have no idea how that might look or work.