3DFORMULA

I was taking it as he meant stocker. As in my car. The engine is completely as bought from the dealer in '94, 140,000 miles ago. From throttle body to manifolds untouched, other than a MSD coil and wires.
I do believe that with LT headers, good tuning capabilities, weight reduction, more gear, and more suspension parts/tuning, I will make the 11's with this unopened 140,000 mile GM LT1.

Great thread guys and thanks for the intell. cnorton!

cnorton

[QUOTE=3DFORMULA;5644594]I do believe that with LT headers, good tuning capabilities, weight reduction, more gear, and more suspension parts/tuning, I will make the 11's with this unopened 140,000 mile GM LT1.

That will be a worthy challenge. Obviously, my experience lies in another realm but, offhand, I'd say that the key elements will lie in weight reduction and finding really good air to make your shots. In your part of the world, Earlville, Iowa, and Joliet, Illinois, could both provide the air and bite if you hit them early in the spring or late in the fall. Earlville has a favorable orientation relative to the prevailing winds also. More gear will be required as you noted. It will be a fine line between enough gear to launch that well and keeping the car from tapping the limiter. Of course, "good tuning capabilities" can remove the limiter from the equation as well.

Meantime, good luck. I'd be interested in keeping up with your successes.

c

3DFORMULA

I believe you mean Eddyville, yes great track. Thanks for the interest, I'll make a post about the 'birds progress some time next year. Altho', I'm gettin more interested in bracket racing CONSISTENTLY and have decided to start building the Z/28 with its auto, so most of my time will be with it for a while.
Darrell

cnorton

I don't keep up with all the tracks back home anymore but I recall that the Eddyville track was an eighth? I was making reference to Tri-State Raceway, 2217 270th Ave, Earlville, IA 52041. That's an all-concrete 1/4 mile track located next to US Route 20, practically within the town of Earlville, due west of Dubuque. The NHRA guys love to go there in the spring and fall because the track is owned by Sportsman racers who understand how to make a track work for our kinds of cars. Lots of records are set at Earlville.

c

3DFORMULA

I hadn't heard of that one, it does sound great tho'.

James Montigny

Someone mentioned in a recent thread that a racer was using "SS/SE tactics", which seemed like odd comment to make.

Pardon my ignorance, and please don't take this the wrong way but it doesn't sound like there's a bunch of magic things done as SS/SE
other than taking the same things the rest of the hotrodding community does to the next (few) level(s) and doing them all at once.

Longer duration cams (square looking in some cases), bigger gears, more aggressive
stalls, massive gutting, extreme attention to detail in selecting and assembling combos.....
(all of which generally lead to cars no longer being driven on the street)

The thing that does catch my eye is the head work.
I'd be interested to see what is done differently in SS/SE heads VS the "Stage III" things we see from the usual gang of porters.

If I've missed something here, please correct me.

I'll have to pick Ed's brain next time I am down there getting my tune updated.

mdacton

there is no magic in them......its understanding how to maximize everything you have and use it all up at the right time......

most of these heads would really fly in a good car...

and most SS cars are far from gutted.....they are heavy IMO

cnorton

After forty years of Stock/SS competition I'd have to say that you're correct, magic really isn't the key ingredient of a competitive Stock/SS car. A primary element is a particular state of mind on the part of the racer and it evolves through a commitment to adhere to an established set of rules in search of attaining the maximum performance from a particular combination. Perseverance, patience, desire, and sacrifice are, each it it's own way, much more significant than magic. It's certainly not a game for everyone.

James, the discussion you've initiated is fairly complex but a couple of hours with an NHRA Rulebook could provide a greater understanding than is reasonable here. Basically, weight can be adjusted (up to a point) to fit cars into classes but "gutting" is not allowed. Super Stock cars do have head work done but they are limited to stock valve sizes, specified limits on intake/exhaust runner sizes and combustion chamber sizes. Stock-sized carburetors/throttle bodies are specified. Stock compression ratios are required. Stroker cranks and long rods are not allowed.

You are correct, successful Stock/SS racers do maximize every advantage they're allowed and some probably roll the dice and push the envelope past the line. Mostly, the cars are legit and they're good examples of hot rodding ingenuity in action. When an LT1 based F-body goes to the starting line and runs well under 10 seconds while adhering to the specified rules, you can be assured that there's more than magic involved.

Tell Ed I said "Hi."

c

MichiganSkip

James, I don't know if this will help your understanding of what gets done but if you can find the Ausust 2002 issue of HotRod, there is an article in there about Mike Adams. He takes a Fastburn 385 and does some work to it. It's a Top Stock motor, but the idea is basically the same. That's what intersted me in SE racing. I always wondered how they got those cars to go so quick with no portwork, stock lift cams, stock TB etc. At any rate if you can find the mag, it's good reading.

James Montigny

My bad, poor choice of words.

Thanks, I'll look that up.

canuck94z28

Very interesting topic.Over 2 yrs.ago i was told by a fella that these cars have well over $40,000 into them.As well they are barely streetable,no o.d transmissions,not driven to track,etc.He told me about a class called DFIA w/ a index of 13.20.He basically said that if you could run that and have drivability,gas mileage,be able to drive to track(important as my track is 150 mi.away!)that you should be very proud of that.As my time in sig.i came very close and that,s w/a poor 2.03 60ft.As they say there is next yr

cnorton

94z28,

There have been a few changes in Stock Eliminator since you spoke with that individual. NHRA has since merged all the Stock fuel injected classes with the rest of the stockers. IHRA has continued to provide classes specifically for fuel-injected cars, however. Most of the LT1 F-bodied cars now can be found in B/SA, C/SA, D/SA, and a few in E/SA. To build one from scratch, if you contract the work, could cost as much as $40K although the recent unpleasantness in the world economy has reduced the resale price of a competitive car to the mid-twenties.

I wouldn't call them particularly "streetable" at all but then, that's not their purpose. The days of driving any Stock Eliminator car to the track and running the index have pretty much gone away unless you have a turbo-charged or super-charged car that has an unrealistically low horsepower rating. Stockers, indeed, do not have O.D. transmissions and they have gearing and other allowable modifications that would make driving impractical. The index in E/SA (E/Stock Automatic) is 12.00 and an LT1 E/SA car with driver is required to have a minimum weight of 3560 pounds as well as meet the usual safety and technical requirements. 60' foot times usually range between 1.35 and 1.50 for LT1 Stock Eliminator cars. If you're interested in further information about Stock Eliminator cars, don't hesitate to PM me.

Good luck,

c

3DFORMULA

That class should be full. More info on that class. Modern f-bodies can easily do that with nothing but CAI, cat-back and suspension.

canuck94z28

Thanks for the update cnorton and w/ the CDN.dollar only worth 81 cents compared to over a dollar a yr. ago i could add another 30%+ to that 40 grand.Thus i will even try harder to maximize my present setup and future mods,sort of like the buildups in the mid to late 70,s.

marshall93z

Hell, a BONE stock LT1 head will support that much power with an aggressive solid roller. It's been done before.

Your thinking is kinda twisted. You have to remember these cars are set up EXTREMELY well and will run numbers unthinkable with whatever horsepower they have.