2004 GTO looks like a Grand Prix???WTF???
06-25-2002, 09:08 AM
#1
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2004 GTO looks like a Grand Prix???WTF???
First off I have a poll on my website and so far almost 4:1 the car is and overwhelming hit.
Now some rants...
I am willing to bet the complainers are the the same people who a few months ago were begging for a RWD LS1 Prand Prix...now its a bad thing it looks like one?WTF? We won't even touch the fact that the car is a totally different platform and has different proportions. The rear sits higher on the GTO, the car is overall taller. The grille also looks a bit taller. I am willing to bet when it is said and done there will no mistaking the new GTO.
For teh last five years Pontiac has been bashed by the press and consumers for haveing designs to racey, so it starts tone things down and now the GTO is "boring"?? I mean what did you want, a hood tach and judge decals? GM has shown time and tiem again that they generally do no do all out retro designs. The closest thing is the SSR and it doen't draw from a specific model like teh GTO would. That being said I also think if they would have went retro, they stood a much better chance of messing it up. As much as I like Ted's designs, if they would have made something similar it would have looked just plain odd in real life.
I love the complaints that it looks too much like Pontiac's other cars...WTF is supposed to look like? Look at the GTO's from the 60's....the look an aweful lot like the Grand Prixs, Le Mans, Tempests, and even first gen Firebirds's. Of course a new GTO si gonna look like the rest of the Pontiac family, it always has. Sure it had hood scoops here and there, but nothing that the new car can't do with out. If you want hood scoops and tachs there are plenty of companies I am sure in line to make them. I know some people will cricize everything GM does and I try and accept it, but there has to be a point somewhere where common sense sets in. GM didnt ahve to bring back the GTO and they didnt have to do teh program so fast...be thankful! I swear some people would complain if they sold Lamborghini's for $20,000 because teh dash rattles...
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Now some rants...
I am willing to bet the complainers are the the same people who a few months ago were begging for a RWD LS1 Prand Prix...now its a bad thing it looks like one?WTF? We won't even touch the fact that the car is a totally different platform and has different proportions. The rear sits higher on the GTO, the car is overall taller. The grille also looks a bit taller. I am willing to bet when it is said and done there will no mistaking the new GTO.
For teh last five years Pontiac has been bashed by the press and consumers for haveing designs to racey, so it starts tone things down and now the GTO is "boring"?? I mean what did you want, a hood tach and judge decals? GM has shown time and tiem again that they generally do no do all out retro designs. The closest thing is the SSR and it doen't draw from a specific model like teh GTO would. That being said I also think if they would have went retro, they stood a much better chance of messing it up. As much as I like Ted's designs, if they would have made something similar it would have looked just plain odd in real life.
I love the complaints that it looks too much like Pontiac's other cars...WTF is supposed to look like? Look at the GTO's from the 60's....the look an aweful lot like the Grand Prixs, Le Mans, Tempests, and even first gen Firebirds's. Of course a new GTO si gonna look like the rest of the Pontiac family, it always has. Sure it had hood scoops here and there, but nothing that the new car can't do with out. If you want hood scoops and tachs there are plenty of companies I am sure in line to make them. I know some people will cricize everything GM does and I try and accept it, but there has to be a point somewhere where common sense sets in. GM didnt ahve to bring back the GTO and they didnt have to do teh program so fast...be thankful! I swear some people would complain if they sold Lamborghini's for $20,000 because teh dash rattles...
------------------
Branden-Founder www.GMInsidenews.com
The #1 GM News Site on the Net!
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06-25-2002, 09:27 AM
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It looks, at least from Pontiac's picture, exactly like the current Grand Prix.
Yes, I love the fact that it's a RWD, V8 car... and I do not dislike the car myself, but I find the styling to be a disappointment, because it is totally unoriginal, and a virtual clone of an existing car that has been out since 1997.
This car is going to have a dated appearance the minute it hits the showroom, because it looks like a Grand Prix .
Personally, I am happy the didn't attempt some lame retro theme... and I understand to get it here quick and within budget, they opted to change only the bumper caps from the Holden Monero... that's fine, and all, but I just don't think it had to be so close to Grand Prix in the grille shape, foglight positioning, etc...
I'm sure they will sell them all, because the GTO name has value, and they are limiting production ot 20,000... so they covered themselves, and no matter what, it'll be considered a success, because they all will sell out, even though it's a tiny number being made to begin with.
[This message has been edited by Darth Xed (edited June 25, 2002).]
Yes, I love the fact that it's a RWD, V8 car... and I do not dislike the car myself, but I find the styling to be a disappointment, because it is totally unoriginal, and a virtual clone of an existing car that has been out since 1997.
This car is going to have a dated appearance the minute it hits the showroom, because it looks like a Grand Prix .
Personally, I am happy the didn't attempt some lame retro theme... and I understand to get it here quick and within budget, they opted to change only the bumper caps from the Holden Monero... that's fine, and all, but I just don't think it had to be so close to Grand Prix in the grille shape, foglight positioning, etc...
I'm sure they will sell them all, because the GTO name has value, and they are limiting production ot 20,000... so they covered themselves, and no matter what, it'll be considered a success, because they all will sell out, even though it's a tiny number being made to begin with.
[This message has been edited by Darth Xed (edited June 25, 2002).]
06-25-2002, 12:23 PM
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Brandon, quit pettin' your dog over the new GTO, and stand back and take a long look at it. Reminds you of the Grand Prix doesn't it? Whats so special about a car that looks like any other car Pontiac already has? Sure, performance should be great, but the looks don't get some of us very excited. I know I couldn't look at it and be excited about hopping in it to drive it everyday. They should have just put the Grand Prix badges on it. I don't expect a retro look to it, just something original. That is afterall why GM hired "design engineers" right?
06-25-2002, 12:48 PM
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It's quite unbelievable what goes on by looking at only one picture.
The picture shows the front end. There are some similarities between it and the Grand Prix, but the size of grille, headlights, and actually the styling of headlights is different from current Grand Prix. Either you need glasses, or your attention to detail is very low...
Now, based on these similarities on the front end, the whole car looks like a Grand Prix? Oh yeah, it doesn't just look like a Grand Prix, it's actually a clone of Grand Prix. You know, everything is exactly like the Grand Prix. As a matter of fact, it's just a re-badged Grand Prix...
Get a life. Wait until the actual real car comes out. And if you think that the car looks identical to Grand Prix, look at its side profile, or look at its rear end. A Grand Prix clone? Nope, far from it. As a matter of fact, the rear quarter window is more in the style of BMW 3-series than any other car.
Quit bashing these drawings/designs/pictures and be patient enough to see the actual car. It's true, by 2004 it may not look as new and fresh as it would look now, and I wish they'd bring it in for 2003, but oh well. The car will look nothing like current Grand Prix, even the front will look different in real life, despite its similarities (what they might be) to Grand Prix.
The picture shows the front end. There are some similarities between it and the Grand Prix, but the size of grille, headlights, and actually the styling of headlights is different from current Grand Prix. Either you need glasses, or your attention to detail is very low...
Now, based on these similarities on the front end, the whole car looks like a Grand Prix? Oh yeah, it doesn't just look like a Grand Prix, it's actually a clone of Grand Prix. You know, everything is exactly like the Grand Prix. As a matter of fact, it's just a re-badged Grand Prix...
Get a life. Wait until the actual real car comes out. And if you think that the car looks identical to Grand Prix, look at its side profile, or look at its rear end. A Grand Prix clone? Nope, far from it. As a matter of fact, the rear quarter window is more in the style of BMW 3-series than any other car.
Quit bashing these drawings/designs/pictures and be patient enough to see the actual car. It's true, by 2004 it may not look as new and fresh as it would look now, and I wish they'd bring it in for 2003, but oh well. The car will look nothing like current Grand Prix, even the front will look different in real life, despite its similarities (what they might be) to Grand Prix.
06-25-2002, 12:50 PM
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Actually, the car seems to be a "victim" of "corporate image" styling........the double grille, fog lights, etc.....even the Solstice has them.......problem is exactly as stated above.....it will look 'dated' from day one....NOT a good idea......even the GP is getting a face-lift...
I thought DutchInjun's front fascia/hood sketch was a very do-able design and GM NEEDS to stop playing it so close to the vest...be a LEADER again and not an also ran....Chrysler has kicked major bootie with daring designs....I'm not talking about tacked on cladding or scoops either.
I'd LOVE to have a car like this, but in reality, I don't need another GTP.....
[This message has been edited by Doug Harden, Pres CICC (edited June 25, 2002).]
I thought DutchInjun's front fascia/hood sketch was a very do-able design and GM NEEDS to stop playing it so close to the vest...be a LEADER again and not an also ran....Chrysler has kicked major bootie with daring designs....I'm not talking about tacked on cladding or scoops either.
I'd LOVE to have a car like this, but in reality, I don't need another GTP.....
[This message has been edited by Doug Harden, Pres CICC (edited June 25, 2002).]
06-25-2002, 12:52 PM
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<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by JasonK94Z:
Brandon, quit pettin' your dog over the new GTO, and stand back and take a long look at it. Reminds you of the Grand Prix doesn't it? Whats so special about a car that looks like any other car Pontiac already has? Sure, performance should be great, but the looks don't get some of us very excited. I know I couldn't look at it and be excited about hopping in it to drive it everyday. They should have just put the Grand Prix badges on it. I don't expect a retro look to it, just something original. That is afterall why GM hired "design engineers" right?</font>
Brandon, quit pettin' your dog over the new GTO, and stand back and take a long look at it. Reminds you of the Grand Prix doesn't it? Whats so special about a car that looks like any other car Pontiac already has? Sure, performance should be great, but the looks don't get some of us very excited. I know I couldn't look at it and be excited about hopping in it to drive it everyday. They should have just put the Grand Prix badges on it. I don't expect a retro look to it, just something original. That is afterall why GM hired "design engineers" right?</font>
The car is a Monaro with a Pontiac frontend...exactly what Lutz said would be..dont act so shocked..
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06-25-2002, 01:01 PM
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<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by muckz:
Either you need glasses, or your attention to detail is very low...
</font>
Either you need glasses, or your attention to detail is very low...
</font>
And, yes, from the side that I can see from the picture, I think the side shot looks like a Grand Prix too.
I am not so stupid to think I can tell what the whole car looks like from one shot, but I certainly can tell, as well as A LOT of other people can, that it looks A LOT like a 97-current Grand Prix.
Let's put it this way... If you never heard rumors of a GTO comback and you saw that picture... what would you say it was? I think most people would say a slightly freshened Grand Prix GTP...
[This message has been edited by Darth Xed (edited June 25, 2002).]
06-25-2002, 01:10 PM
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<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by JasonK94Z:
Brandon, quit pettin' your dog over the new GTO, and stand back and take a long look at it. Reminds you of the Grand Prix doesn't it? Whats so special about a car that looks like any other car Pontiac already has? Sure, performance should be great, but the looks don't get some of us very excited. I know I couldn't look at it and be excited about hopping in it to drive it everyday. They should have just put the Grand Prix badges on it. I don't expect a retro look to it, just something original. That is afterall why GM hired "design engineers" right?</font>
Brandon, quit pettin' your dog over the new GTO, and stand back and take a long look at it. Reminds you of the Grand Prix doesn't it? Whats so special about a car that looks like any other car Pontiac already has? Sure, performance should be great, but the looks don't get some of us very excited. I know I couldn't look at it and be excited about hopping in it to drive it everyday. They should have just put the Grand Prix badges on it. I don't expect a retro look to it, just something original. That is afterall why GM hired "design engineers" right?</font>
Brandon brings out a point I've also tried to point out. Yes, it looks like a 2 door Grand Prix, and it probally figured into the demise of the GP 2 door (instead of spending the money on a 2 door, inport a faster & superior version from overseas).
But GTO has always looked like any other Pontiac, that's the whole point. Pontiac is getting away from the glue-on body parts, & going to a smooth low profile look.
Lutz said this is the way Pontiac is going in design, so there is more of this design to come.
06-25-2002, 01:18 PM
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<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by guionM:
Petting the dog over it? Never heard that one before.
Brandon brings out a point I've also tried to point out. Yes, it looks like a 2 door Grand Prix, and it probally figured into the demise of the GP 2 door (instead of spending the money on a 2 door, inport a faster & superior version from overseas).
But GTO has always looked like any other Pontiac, that's the whole point. Pontiac is getting away from the glue-on body parts, & going to a smooth low profile look.
Lutz said this is the way Pontiac is going in design, so there is more of this design to come.</font>
Petting the dog over it? Never heard that one before.
Brandon brings out a point I've also tried to point out. Yes, it looks like a 2 door Grand Prix, and it probally figured into the demise of the GP 2 door (instead of spending the money on a 2 door, inport a faster & superior version from overseas).
But GTO has always looked like any other Pontiac, that's the whole point. Pontiac is getting away from the glue-on body parts, & going to a smooth low profile look.
Lutz said this is the way Pontiac is going in design, so there is more of this design to come.</font>
06-25-2002, 01:25 PM
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<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by Darth Xed:
Maybe they should have made the Monaro/Commodore into the Grand Prix and called the 2-door high-po version the Grand Prix GTO...
</font>
Maybe they should have made the Monaro/Commodore into the Grand Prix and called the 2-door high-po version the Grand Prix GTO...
</font>
But honesty trhe cars proportions ar different than the Grand Prix...it is taller and teh rear will be all different. I mean it has to look like a Poncho
06-25-2002, 01:33 PM
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I think the real judge should be the past GTO owners themselves. I like to think of the GTO as being "their" cars. Many of these people have a very negative reaction to the styling. Knee jerk reaction? Possibly. We haven't seen the whole car in front of us yet. But I still stand by my thought that the GTO, Pontiac's new flagship car, should not completely resemble a "been-there, done-that" design.
------------------
Mark
94 Z28, Red, A4, 3:23
Lone Mods--LPE CAI, !Lapeer Dragway.
(Hey, I'm a college boy I can't afford gobs of bolt-ons!)
Best time: 14.658 @ 95.1
with SES light on and Driver off! (First and only time at track)
The F-body will NEVER die.
------------------
Mark
94 Z28, Red, A4, 3:23
Lone Mods--LPE CAI, !Lapeer Dragway.
(Hey, I'm a college boy I can't afford gobs of bolt-ons!)
Best time: 14.658 @ 95.1
with SES light on and Driver off! (First and only time at track)
The F-body will NEVER die.
06-25-2002, 01:50 PM
#12
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So, let me get this straight, what all you whiners are saying is that the Monaro was copying the Grand Prix?
I find it interesting how all these people can make all these points on how it looks just like one when they have only put out one picture of it. AND, it isn't even a good picture, it looks more like a drawing to me.
One more point that has been made is that Pontiacs have pretty much all had the same looking grilles since the 50's, and now nobody likes it? I for one do like it.
Nobody said that the GTO is going to stay the way it is forever either. Maybe they will run it like it is now for a few years, then restyle it like they did when it first came out. They changed the look of the grill every year on GTO's for a while.
Also, if this car is a big hit, then they can always make a 6 cyl version for families and call it the LeMans or something.
This would make a great car to go head to head with Ford's new RWD car they have in the works, what is that thing? Galaxy or something?
Sorry this is so long, but people SHOULD be happy that GM is turning to the "right" direction with a RWD musclecar in the lineup again.
I find it interesting how all these people can make all these points on how it looks just like one when they have only put out one picture of it. AND, it isn't even a good picture, it looks more like a drawing to me.
One more point that has been made is that Pontiacs have pretty much all had the same looking grilles since the 50's, and now nobody likes it? I for one do like it.
Nobody said that the GTO is going to stay the way it is forever either. Maybe they will run it like it is now for a few years, then restyle it like they did when it first came out. They changed the look of the grill every year on GTO's for a while.
Also, if this car is a big hit, then they can always make a 6 cyl version for families and call it the LeMans or something.
This would make a great car to go head to head with Ford's new RWD car they have in the works, what is that thing? Galaxy or something?
Sorry this is so long, but people SHOULD be happy that GM is turning to the "right" direction with a RWD musclecar in the lineup again.
06-25-2002, 01:57 PM
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Ok, to satisfy the critics--compare for yourself.
GTO/Grand Prix/Cavalier
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-JERRY-
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GTO/Grand Prix/Cavalier
------------------
-JERRY-
'02 Impreza WRX
'88 Fiero Formula
'90 Sunbird LE For Sale
Formerly owned: '93 Firebird Formula
06-25-2002, 02:01 PM
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<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by jrp4uc:
Ok, to satisfy the critics--compare for yourself.
GTO/Grand Prix/Cavalier
</font>
Ok, to satisfy the critics--compare for yourself.
GTO/Grand Prix/Cavalier
</font>
06-25-2002, 02:04 PM
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<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by jrp4uc:
Ok, to satisfy the critics--compare for yourself.
GTO/Grand Prix/Cavalier
</font>
Ok, to satisfy the critics--compare for yourself.
GTO/Grand Prix/Cavalier
</font>
LOOK at the pictures. And please, I'm not saying the Monaro looks bad. It's very nice. I'm not saying the new GTO looks bad. They look like a couple of cars already in GM's lineup. GP and Cavalier. 
------------------
Mark
94 Z28, Red, A4, 3:23
Lone Mods--LPE CAI, !Lapeer Dragway.
(Hey, I'm a college boy I can't afford gobs of bolt-ons!)
Best time: 14.658 @ 95.1
with SES light on and Driver off! (First and only time at track)
The F-body will NEVER die.