New GTO a bust!

>Went out east for the Detroit Auto Show yesterday. Checked out the new Pontiac GTO. In real life
>I'm even less impressed than by the photos from various sites (very Asian looking). They had a
>yellow one, with black leather interior and yellow panel inserts (optional). Comes with M-6 or
>A-4, and LS-1 motor. MSRP about 34k, due this fall. When seen, it looks like a GranAm or
> GranPrix. NOT IMPRESSIVE! Hope they build last year's Solaro instead (it wasn't shown).
>
>On the other hand, the new Mustang looks like a '67 fastback that's updated....actually looked
>sharp for a Ford. Chrysler's Crossfire looked like the Mercedes SLK 320 (only as a coupe), and
> was also sharp.

Welcome to the board, newbie. I agree with some of your post, I like the Mustang concept too. The rest though, I beg to differ. I was at the Detroit show today (will post a report later). I liked the GTO - a lot. The Crossfire is missing an important component - A TRUNK.

I dont know, i kind of like the new goat.... i like the earlier concept drawings a little better.

Solaro? :confused: No idea WTF that is. A lot of people don't like the GTO, but most people do. For anyone even remotely thinking about one, I suggest you act quick to secure one. Otherwise, just sit back and watch it sell out in 04 for the simple fact that it's top notch quality plus new and exciting to those it's marketed at, then same thing in 05 thanks to styling and drivetrain updates. Beyond that there will either be another successful year on the current style, or a completely new design, probably the latter. I'm not crazy head-over-heels in love with it either but it's a winning formula and will sell lke hotcakes even at mid 30s:alert:
GT

I think the New GTO looks great, it definalty is No WS6!! It is 95% Monaro. What the car needs is a hood like this :
http://www.pfyc.com/store/graphics/new/gp1002.jpg
For those who don't like the styling don't worry, this GTO will only be around until about 2006 when the new Amarican made one comes out.

I don't know about that particular hood, but that would definetly be an improvement. I really hope the American GTO is alot better.

Originally posted by kizz
A lot of people don't like the GTO, but most people do. I beg to differ. A lot of people on this message board don't like the GTO, but most people do.

Me being one of them :) :bow:

Originally posted by Z28x
I think the New GTO looks great, it definalty is No WS6!! It is 95% Monaro. What the car needs is a hood like this :
http://www.pfyc.com/store/graphics/new/gp1002.jpg
For those who don't like the styling don't worry, this GTO will only be around until about 2006 when the new Amarican made one comes out.

Interesting hood. If a hood like that was optional, or on the LS6 version, I wouldn't object. :D

Kizz is right. GTO is going to be one of those cars where you either like it or don't, and it will do well with the fast but low keyed crowd (which I'm a member of). It's not going to appeal to everyone, but does it even need to?

As far as the more agressive looks crowd, and last but not least, the it doesn't look like a 64 Pontiac group, it will take more time and work to win most over to the new GTO (some people simply will never be won, so there's no need in even trying).

i think hes talking about the australian car that the GTO is based on (its basically the same except for the american LS1 and some of the styling cues) im not sure if thats what it was called but the car im talking about honestly does look a bit less grand am-ish then the GTO. still tho the GTO is on my stepdads wishlist (with the M6 of course) and i think its a pretty nice ride.

Originally posted by Z28x
What the car needs is a hood like this :
http://www.pfyc.com/store/graphics/new/gp1002.jpg


OK in my opinion that hood is a Double Whammy! for the following reasons:

1) I am a strong believer in having *functional* hood scoops. In order to have a scoop far back enough to remind us of the original GTO's, it will have to be non-functional because the horizontal LS1 intake won't be able to connect to the scoops so far back.

2) Look at the holes on that thing! classic "in one ear and out the other". the air just flies right through? Totally useless look, but amusing nonetheless.

Originally posted by kizz
OK in my opinion that hood is a Double Whammy! for the following reasons:

1) I am a strong believer in having *functional* hood scoops. In order to have a scoop far back enough to remind us of the original GTO's, it will have to be non-functional because the horizontal LS1 intake won't be able to connect to the scoops so far back.

2) Look at the holes on that thing! classic "in one ear and out the other". the air just flies right through? Totally useless look, but amusing nonetheless.

LOL!!!

1)The hood scoops can be made to be functional. Look at what SLP did to the 98-2002 SS. It goes into the hoodscoop and comes back around to the front of the engine. I know.;)

2)The hoodscoops at the front are cold air inducted, and the ones at the back are heat extactors to draw the heat away from the engine.:p

:Owned:

Originally posted by TheV6Bird
I beg to differ. A lot of people on this message board don't like the GTO, but most people do.


A lot of people that were looking at the GTO at the auto show didn't seem all that interested. The people at the Mustang section seemed a lot more enthusiastic. Me and all of my friends were just looking at the new GTO, like :confused: "Wow, it looks even more dull than it did in the internet pictures."

Pentatonic - I disagree. I was just at the show yesterday, and the GTO appeared well-received and liked from what I could tell. As far as comparing to the Mustang, it's apples to oranges... the concept Mustang is all-new and is bound to create a buzz, and the current Mustang sells to a very wide audience. The GTO is just now beginning to reach widespread marketplace awareness.

I too was at the show yesterday, and the general opinion I gathered from the crowd around me was more on the negative side..."That's no GTO." The "it looks like" went to the Monte Carlo from the people I overheard. I guess the older, mid-late 90s MCs resemble it in profile some.

Personally, I like the car and believe it to be worthy of the name, as I've proclaimed in countless threads before. I don't consider it a bust by any stretch. I also think the newness/novelty factor will push it along with good sales for a couple years even with styling that is not overwhelming (and it sounds like help might be on the way as soon as next year for that).

The only thing I really can add, is that I noticed the new Pontiac front bumper didn't have the best lines as far as matching up with the rest of the car (the corners were a bit askew). I assume that part is going to be assembled in Australian once it's in production, but just interesting/funny that the car immediately loses fit & finish as soon as a Pontiac badge is attached. ;)

Originally posted by BigDarknFast
Pentatonic - I disagree. I was just at the show yesterday, and the GTO appeared well-received and liked from what I could tell. As far as comparing to the Mustang, it's apples to oranges... the concept Mustang is all-new and is bound to create a buzz, and the current Mustang sells to a very wide audience. The GTO is just now beginning to reach widespread marketplace awareness.

I dont think that just because its a GTO it means that of course its going to have a smaller croud then the Mustang... They are two different classes of cars, and sure the mustang is new, but the GTO is new too... also if GM gave the GTO a more exciting agressive look Im sure it would have gotten a huge crowd.

Originally posted by ReznorZ28
I dont think that just because its a GTO it means that of course its going to have a smaller croud then the Mustang... They are two different classes of cars, and sure the mustang is new, but the GTO is new too... also if GM gave the GTO a more exciting agressive look Im sure it would have gotten a huge crowd.

I agree, the Mustang concept was definitely more of a show stopper than the GTO, and that's not because it's "only" a GTO. This is a car coming back after a 30 year absence! The Ford booth overall was very crowded, and probably one of the biggest hits of the show. I think once the magazines get ahold of the GTO and start pasting it on the covers with some nice numbers and headlines, it will get more people's attention.

As an aside I forgot to comment on before, I would say another tell-tale sign that the Chevrolet SS is speaking strongly for a Chevelle is the presence of an original Chevelle at the show. It shows Chevy has an interest in doing something with the car and put it back on people's minds.

Wait though jrp4uc... what time were you there? We need to track that now too according to some ;)

I'm not surprised if people say "gee, the new GTO looks like a MC, or a Grand Prix" or so on. All that shows is how true to original GTO roots this car really is. The core of the original GTO's was simple - a hot V8 in a small/midsize car. The new GTO fits that criteria to a T.

Sure the new Mustang concept is a hit. I like it too. In fact there is hardly anything I can think of I don't like about the new Mustang concept, except that maybe it leans a little too much on previous styling from 30 years ago. I believe the production version will be a success, as long as Ford doesn't botch the quality.

But I still say these are apples and oranges. The GTO has no V6 variant for the US. Unlike the Mustang, it has a real back seat. Its quality, if history is any indicator between Holden and Ford, will be superior. The GTO is not targeting all the different markets of the Mustang family. And that's fine with me... I don't want a convertible or a watered-down GT. :)

Originally posted by BigDarknFast
I'm not surprised if people say "gee, the new GTO looks like a MC, or a Grand Prix" or so on. All that shows is how true to original GTO roots this car really is. The core of the original GTO's was simple - a hot V8 in a small/midsize car. The new GTO fits that criteria to a T.


one thing that still bothers me about the GTO is that it wasnt designed to be a GTO... it was another car that was given a facelift and the GTO badge. I think they just shouldve brought the car over as the holden and left it alone.

Again, just like the first GTO's! Those were meant to be run-of-the-mill Tempests.

Originally posted by ReznorZ28
...it was another car that was given a facelift and the GTO badge

Don't forget 40+ more horsepower and cam change for better low end torque. And this isn't a big transistion, Monaro to GTO. The Monaro is, afterall, their big, classic muscle car. I'm not saying the comments here are implying it, but sometimes people act as if we are receiving some transformed fwd half-assed 4 door as a GTO; something completely non-performance. The Monaro is an outstanding car in every regard. (And yes, I know it's platform traces back to a sedan). :D

The problem with the new GTO is the "GTO" badge. Badge it a "Manaro" and i'm sure it'd have been more welcomed. The problem with it carrying the GTO name is that everyone's so caught up on trying to compare it to the original. "it doesn't have scoops" "it doesn't look as aggressive"...

I personally think it should have recieved an all new name. Overall, it's an excellent car.

Badge it a "Manaro"

Monaro......

Originally posted by jrp4uc
Don't forget 40+ more horsepower and cam change for better low end torque. And this isn't a big transistion, Monaro to GTO. The Monaro is, afterall, their big, classic muscle car. I'm not saying the comments here are implying it, but sometimes people act as if we are receiving some transformed fwd half-assed 4 door as a GTO; something completely non-performance. The Monaro is an outstanding car in every regard. (And yes, I know it's platform traces back to a sedan). :D

I agree, I'd rather have a 340HP Pontiac GTO than a 300HP Pontiac Monaro

Even though I consider the Monaro styling the best I'd rather a HSV GTS or the HRT 427 over the Monaro or the Pontiac with its ulgy grill :barf:

Originally posted by Z28x
I agree, I'd rather have a 340HP Pontiac GTO than a 300HP Pontiac Monaro

Id love a "original" 340HP GTO that was built to be a GTO from the drawing board, but from its current condition its just a monaro with a performance/appearance package...I would rather have an updated 340HP Pontiac Monaro..
Just to clear the record, I dont hate the GTO, its a nice looking car, but I think they shouldve imported it here, upgraded its performance aspects as they have and left it with its original name, Monaro...

How would you feel if they imported the Monaro, redesigned the front end and called it the camaro... "the new standard of speed and comfort, the all new Camaro Monaro!!!" ;) I dont think it would be cool.

I agree, it probably pisses some of them off. But then again, their car is being given a legendary name.

Originally posted by ReznorZ28
Id love a "original" 340HP GTO that was built to be a GTO from the drawing board, but from its current condition its just a monaro with a performance/appearance package...

Wow, that kinda sounds like the Firebird/Trans Am appearance package they used to offer for the Camaro. :p

Funny how reskinning is selectively accepted.

Originally posted by jrp4uc
Wow, that kinda sounds like the Firebird/Trans Am appearance package they used to offer for the Camaro. :p

Funny how reskinning is selectively accepted.

Heh Heh :D

Originally posted by jrp4uc
Wow, that kinda sounds like the Firebird/Trans Am appearance package they used to offer for the Camaro. :p

Funny how reskinning is selectively accepted.

Hey, thats a totally differnt story. they started out as 2 different cars, but they grew up as legends together and over time melted into one starting in probably the 80's, but the cars still carried on their own heritage and their own fans... Now if the Monaro and the GTO grew up together from the beginning and slowly started showing simularities over the years and had a merge in their fan base then hey, no worries and no complaints... but they didnt...

not only that, but I would say you have a point, IF the firebird had been discontinued for some time and out of nowhere the camaro was given a "reskinning" and called a firebird, but that didnt happen.. they just had a great influence on one another as they evolved into their present state and I think thats because their fan base was so alike...
now I doubt that the fans of the Monaro are simular to that of the GTO fans....

Originally posted by ReznorZ28
...now I doubt that the fans of the Monaro are simular to that of the GTO fans....

Really? I bet they are quite similar.

Originally posted by jrp4uc
Really? I bet they are quite similar.

I dont mean obvious simularities, like I bet they both like a performance car that can comforably seat so many people and such, because if we were talking about that then we can easily say that mustang fans are much like camaro fans and such, which is true as we both like a 2+2 performance car at a good price but we both have very different tastes in other areas... apearance, style, attitude, heritage and such and thats what Im getting at... but I mean I bet you over 50% of the hardcore GTO fans arent too damn excited about the new GTO now that they know what it is as to when it was just a rumor years ago...

OK, scoop the hood, and chop the roof line, and price it below 30k! I'll be interested then. I'll just do the Vette for now.

Here is my opinion. I really believe deep down that we all hate the damn GTO, we just don't want to say that because it is an American classic, and we feel we HAVE to like it. The more and more I look at it, the sicker I get, and I really hope the American one is nicer. But then again knowing GM, I wouldn't even bet 25 cents on it.

96Z28man - pls speak for yourself. That is not how I feel, nor the 20 potential buyers on a GTO waiting list at my favorite dealer. I was there today, and chatted with my salesman. He said they would have pricing and would start taking official orders in July, and deliveries in November. He also said they expect (but have not been told) they will be able to order 40 units this year. I asked about how they had priced their CETA Trans Am's this year... trying to determine their pricing strategy for rare Pontiacs. He said the first couple went for sticker, and the last few went for GMS (thats the GM employee discount price). Take that for what it's worth, I realize they are different cars.

Yeah, I'd definitely show restraint as far as wanting to be the first on the block with one. 20k units isn't so limited as to need to be first in line to get one or need to pay $10k over sticker. Not to mention, this is the first year for the car over here, so you have all the associated hesidencies of a first year car, plus more power/style on the way for next year.

I like the GTO a whole lot. Z28 performance, more passenger room, rear drive, a coupe!

If it's going to be compared to any Mustang, compare it to the current Cobra, because that's what Monaro is compared to in Australia. The GM car has the better interior by a light year, better handling, more standard equptment, lighter by a few pounds, and is only slightly slower than Ford's supercharged Cobra in down under trim.

If and when GM shows the 2006 GTO concept, then we can compare it to the 1 year older Mustang. Till then, comparing the GTO (Which true to form is a package based on an existing car) to a newly designed Mustang is stacking the deck against it and missing what this car is about.

I think the new Mustang is a knockout, and some GM executives think so as well (Camaro's getting a very very good look as a result). But GTO is a low keyed go fast version of an existing 2 door coupe (as it always was). Mustang and Camaro were the cars that carried the style & looked the part.

Aces! Another damned thread with the same people saying the same things about the GTO!